patchestheclown Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 So, the Ork codex has been out for a bit and while it really seemed ready to shake up the meta at the LVO Orks didn't place too highly (though that could be because everyone built lists to counter them /shurg). So my question is where do you think Orks sit right now within 8th edition? What klans/tactics do you enjoy using? Has vigilus specialist formations offered you anything? Let's try to keep the distinction between local meta and the competitive meta. In my own experience playing within my local meta (just me and my friends) Orks are strong! They hit hard and can control the board due to numbers, quick moving units, and of course da jump. I'm loving using deathskulls even with minimal MSU's the rerolls and more importantly invuln saves have really done some work. I have yet to lose while playing orks (only about 10 games though) and a few of those have been close run things. One game I had 10 gretchin, a weirdboy, and a trukk as the only things left on the map but I had their points doubled due to objectives. Best units for me have been the tankbustas! I always take at least two squads of these guys and they constantly put in work. I've heard people going gaga for the lootas but for me tankbustas are where it is at. Their built in rerolls vs vehicles and flat dmg 3 means they take down just about anything. They are probably the best anti-flyer in the game (imo). Honorable mention is warboss: brutal but kunning + killa klaw + fists of gork = a knight dead per combat phase (usually) hilariously he suffers vs hordes and good invuln. saves I struggle the most with their staying power, squads of 30 boyz are great but most armies can focus fire down a full squad (or more) a turn. And once the boyz run out my army loses a lot of its teef (pun intended). Usually though because I can control most of the objectives turn 1 I can skate by on points or do enough damage that even though I lose all the boyz turn 3 the enemy has little left. I also hate that almost every "competitive" list seems to just be based around Lootas, is this the only way orks are seeing success? What do you think? Are orks top tier or somewhere in the middle? What's been working well for you? Is the only way to play them green tide + lootas? I haven't tried any of the vigilus specialist detachments, any gems in there? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamingDeth Posted March 4, 2019 Share Posted March 4, 2019 I've played orks for years and, despite playing deffskulls, have never included lootas in my lists even once. I doubt my gaming group is the most competitive meta, but I've been consistently winning games with then even with the index and the codex just made them better. I typically run big mobs with specialists in trukks and a bunch of stompy bots, kanz and dreadz and things. I've also considered getting/making from other things some of the new buggies but haven't yet. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5269261 Share on other sites More sharing options...
patchestheclown Posted March 5, 2019 Author Share Posted March 5, 2019 I'm so glad to hear that you've been having good success even without lootas! I've put in a small squad because they seem mandatory according to loud voices on the internet but they have yet to distinguish themselves (could just be the armies I've been playing against though). I feel orks are strong but was disappointed when they didn't do to well in the LVO The buggies seem real interesting but I always feel that I have something else in my army that probably does it better. Though I do have to say the snazzwagon is one of the best models ever and mass S5 shots is never bad. The rivet cannon one looks decent too and now you can buy that by itself so may pick up one in the near future Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5269924 Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted March 6, 2019 Share Posted March 6, 2019 As I posted in the "Which codex won?" thread in the Amicus Aedes, I think Orks got a great codex that is just below the tip-top competitive armies. We did see at the LVO that Orks still can't handle mass flyers, which was a concern of mine from the beginning of the edition with the indices, but overall, I'm really pleased. Obviously, there's a few glaring issues (looking at you, Stompa), and as a collector I hate what they did to our options, but from an 8th edition gameplay perspective, I think we should be very happy with what we got.My best units are Boyz, plain and simple, but I've enjoyed Mek Gunz and my Nob Bikers weren't a complete waste of points at LVO. I do think I need to get Lootas in, just to have some kind of mass ranged firepower, but I'm also interested in picking up all sorts of stuff to add to my collection, including Meganobz, another Dakkajet, a pair of Deff Dreads, and other things I'm blanking on right now. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5271380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tychobi Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 Lootas are overrated like most of the ork codex. Top armies do not fear any ork builds at the moment. Over priced units and a huge weight of bland time consuming rules drag down the ork codex. I would rate ork codex C+ at best. Tournament track record does not interfere with my assessment as far as I understand. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5272974 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 I still haven't played a single game with the new codex. How Orks are doing is a silly question anyway. I don't consider ITC to be 40K. It's a pile of house rules for people who like that sort of thing. If I were interested in how Orks were doing in that environment I would start by looking at how Orks did before the codex and see if the Ork player with the codex were placing better than before and just watch those stats for a year.I think the codex looks good and I can't wrap my head around a codex than isn't brand new and bad this is the fist not bad codex I have had since 3rd edition. This book reminds me of a 2nd ed codex, which is nice. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5273283 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dchmp Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 I think out orks have a great standalone codex, but the other codexes having the ability to "soup" makes it difficult for orks in some match-ups. I use the evil suns to sprint boyz across the field, while weird boyz send units with DaJump to get into the enemies' lines. In the back field I have Smash Guns. I use grots to take up space or get to objectives. They do well most of the time, but against more competitive lists its difficult to get the points back if I don't get first turn, which i often don't. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5289180 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamingDeth Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 I think a lot of that has to do with point level. It's terrible at 2000 points but at 1000 points soup can't be quite as soupy, and that's the sweet spot, I think. That's where my group typically plays since after all the point drops 1k-1250 is about equivalent to 1500-2000 from third to fifth edition in terms to amount of models on the table. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5289193 Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 I think a lot of that has to do with point level. It's terrible at 2000 points but at 1000 points soup can't be quite as soupy, and that's the sweet spot, I think. That's where my group typically plays since after all the point drops 1k-1250 is about equivalent to 1500-2000 from third to fifth edition in terms to amount of models on the table. That is really true. This isn't a topic about soups, but since there are minimum detachment requirements, it stands to reason that "pure" factions, like Orks, are better at lower points levels where "tax" units take up a larger percentage of the points. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5289768 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamingDeth Posted April 2, 2019 Share Posted April 2, 2019 It goes a bit further than that, since 1) boyz aren't a tax unit, they're one of the few troops units that can actually form an effective core for the army, and 2) most of their stuff is much lower in points and thus can have more solutions on the table. Mostly though we just play at the lower points because the amount of stuff on the gaming table these days is getting absurd, and if we end up with orks vs foot guard in a pickup game we don't want it to take an entire weekend. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5289842 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted April 6, 2019 Share Posted April 6, 2019 I saw that Orks did well at Adepticon this year. Any thoughts on that? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5292130 Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 I saw that Orks did well at Adepticon this year. Any thoughts on that? I do. Steve Pampreen and Nick Nanavati finished 3rd and 10th, respectively, and they both took lists very similar/the same as they took to LVO, with the horde of boys, lootas, and a bunch of grots. Elliot Levy finished 9th, with a similar list, though he didn't take large mobs of Evil Sunz boyz, instead going with six 10-boy and one 20-boy mobz of Deffskullz. That's a interesting departure from the "meta" list. Bryan Hancock, however, finished 8th with a list featuring 0 boys and both a Gorkanaut and a Morkanaut. I find that very interesting. I do think if we see Castellans get a heavy nerfed, we'll see more variety in Ork lists, and maybe Bryan's finish kind of gives a glimpse of that, as he didn't face one. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5292381 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted April 7, 2019 Share Posted April 7, 2019 Nick Nanavati I've read his blog last year a fair bit. That guy knows some stuff. I was amazed at just what I didn't know that I didn't know about 40K this edition. I have his article "cracking the screen' bookmarked. And that to me at the time was the thing about Orks that I became interested in. We had "Nothing" except the rules to the game for so long I was waiting for an Ork player to just master the rules to start steam rolling other players. I would expect it would only now be easier, barring bad dice, with this codex. It is exciting that people are doing well and not all pushing the same lists. Very cool. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5292482 Share on other sites More sharing options...
patchestheclown Posted April 9, 2019 Author Share Posted April 9, 2019 Yeah I was very excited to finally see Orks in the top lists, i think there were 4-5 in the top 25 of adepticon. Although most had loota bombs I was happily surprised to see not all of them did. I still don't really understand how the 9th place ork list works since all he had were some min. sized ork boyz squads and I feel that any amount of fire power directed at them would have made them melt real quick. Always exciting to see gork/mork in a list and do well much less both. I am hoping that with some tweaks in the big FAQ (aka nerfing soups) will allow orks to really shine Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5293897 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I haven't see the list that placed 9th. I did hear about something like you've described but hadn't looked into it. Is it posted anywhere? Another forum? My own low model count armies were doing well before the codex. But I was gaming mortal wounds from Bombers. Apparently no one had been ready for that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5294191 Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 I mentioned it, but the full list was: Deffskullz Brigade - Dreadwaaagh! Specialist Detachment Big Mek w/ Relic SAG Bug Mek w/ KFF Warboss on foot w/ Da Killa Klaw 2x Kommandos, 5 each Mad Doc 5x boys, 10 each. Big choppa and 5 shootas, big shoota. 1x boys, 20. Same as above, but doubled. 3x Deffkoptas, big shootas 3x Mek Gunz, Smasha Deffskullz battalion Warboss on warbike Weirdboy Boyz, 10, same as above 2x gretchin, 10 each Badmoons battalion 2x Weirdboy 3x gretchin, 10 each Lootas, 15 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5294351 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 I'm not really sure about that list with out transports I don't know. I guess it's just a lot of scoring units. Looks really shooty too. I guess the combat power is in the bosses. Kinda looks like a lot of units no one really wan't to spend a lot of time shooting at so maybe that's the trick to it? I have no idea why it doesn't have another 10 lootas in it. Points maybe. The Sag Mek is probably the warlord, I read stuff about that over on Dakka. I wonder how fast it plays? I know time is a thing ITC players worry about. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296530 Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 My guess is he made liberal use of Mob Up. Other than that, it's really reliant on the Lootas and SAG to do damage, though at least both of those can fire twice a turn (he had 25 CP!). I don't know what the missions were like, since I'm pretty sure they didn't do ITC. But the list would have a lot of scoring ability.In all, very interesting. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296569 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamingDeth Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 The mad dok in that list is also interesting. He has some decent advantages over a regular dok but the price increase over the regular one is so huge that I haven't taken him this edition. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296658 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 Not to change the subject but is anyone using Blood Axe Mega Nobz set up in hiding? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296689 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamingDeth Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 Man, them gitz are sneaky and unproppa, I wouldn't touch 'em wif a lot foot pokey stick. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296716 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 Man, them gitz are sneaky and unproppa, I wouldn't touch 'em wif a lot foot pokey stick. I thought they were better now. No? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296763 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamingDeth Posted April 14, 2019 Share Posted April 14, 2019 I have no idea, I don't play blood axes, the post was in jest rather than an actual rating of their in game performance. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296769 Share on other sites More sharing options...
toaae Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 Not to change the subject but is anyone using Blood Axe Mega Nobz set up in hiding? They would have the same problem every other non-Evil Sunz clan has: without the +1" to charge, it's hard to rely on. For 1 CP more, you could just put the unit in a Tellyporta and be Evil Sunz, making the charge much more often. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296831 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted April 15, 2019 Share Posted April 15, 2019 Not to change the subject but is anyone using Blood Axe Mega Nobz set up in hiding? They would have the same problem every other non-Evil Sunz clan has: without the +1" to charge, it's hard to rely on. For 1 CP more, you could just put the unit in a Tellyporta and be Evil Sunz, making the charge much more often. I was thinking about also using the tellyporta on another, Evil Sunz unit in a clan soup list. Basically the more units I can set up that close the better. I used a Kommando based list this time last year prior to the "rule of 3" and it seemed to me at the time to save time during my turns, less models to move and move and move again. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354303-the-state-of-orks/#findComment-5296969 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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