Jorin Helm-splitter Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 I think soup has to lead yo most of the slowdown in the initial index phase most people weren't running allies at least in my meta. Personally I'll get the infiltrators and the eliminators from this release as both fill gaps in my force but I don't see the need for a whole box, because of how much primaris I have. I'm waiting for a close combat focused wave more than anything. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5271815 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Triszin Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 so I was thinking, How would the Relic Helm of Durfast be on one of these guys? atm: I am rebuilding my wolf army. I like the idea of suppressors assisting my bloodclaws/reivers. the eliminators while good, I think I might go with other units most of the time. Blood claws + Infiltrators look amazing together. (in my mind) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5271829 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteySödes Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 so I was thinking, How would the Relic Helm of Durfast be on one of these guys? atm: I am rebuilding my wolf army. I like the idea of suppressors assisting my bloodclaws/reivers. the eliminators while good, I think I might go with other units most of the time. Blood claws + Infiltrators look amazing together. (in my mind) Durfast is straight garbage this edition. None of our characters can take ranged weaponry of quality or quantity to make it worth it. I could see maybe taking a melta battle leader with a JP like a suicide tau fusion suit for a laugh but at that point why aren’t you just giving him a hammer like he wants. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5271852 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonewolf81 Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 The best thing with shadow spear so far is this warlord trait "target priority". Imagine a captain in phobos armour giving +1 to hit to a stormfang,, assault cannon razorback or dakka redemptor dread accompanied by a wolfguard battle leader ...ouch... that is a serious buff at last. And with his concealed position deployment can get in the middle of the board turn 1. Ofcourse youll need some infiltrators to screen him . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5271919 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karack Blackstone Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/03/07/mar-7-shadowspear-focus-vanguard-rulesgw-homepage-post-3/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5271951 Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteySödes Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 I like traits......buuuuuuut I'm not sure i'd take them over our stuff. Im curious how much gets expanded in Vigilus Ablaze and if we'll be able to get a field commander type deal. I'd spent 1-2cp to unlock it though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5271970 Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacepup Posted March 7, 2019 Share Posted March 7, 2019 Suppressors would be nice to have to support TWC or Wulfen charges at least. And the captains aura of 12" denying deep strike will be handy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272154 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasper_Hawser Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 Princeipts of deceit is also great, especially with the new Chapter Approved missions where it goes back to the days of deploying whole army at once. Reshuffling your deployment is always good, although others can potentially do it as well. Was it Eldrad Uthran''s specialty in the past, or currently does he do the same? And yes, Target Priority is cool too and thankfully, both warlord traits aren't just for the new Phobos units, it just says same "Chapter". Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272213 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluescope Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 The new units are cool looking but not that good ruleswise. The infiltrators are the most useful of the vanguard but they will probably cost more than the intercessors because if they won't, they will be a lot better for the same cost. Marines need cheaper troop units badly. The snipers are super cool looking but let's face it, they are shooting fireworks The suppressors have the super good in 8th fly rule, but they get -1 when they move, the autocannon is not that killy and the deny overwatch thing works only on units with multiple models, while most of the time the thing that shoots the cr@p out of you is a vehicle, super heavy etc. All in all, i wanted better rules for the units, the one thing left to see is their point cost which may change my view but I doubt it Latest rumor: Infiltrator 22 Sniper 21(18+3) Suppressor 33(18+15) Infiltrator is too expensive. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272238 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasper_Hawser Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 Latest rumor: Infiltrator 22 Sniper 21(18+3) Suppressor 33(18+15) Infiltrator is too expensive. Assuming the rumor is true..... ..... Youch, 22 ppm is a bit too much for a screen unit troop. Although they do come with double the wounds of a scout so will be a little less than twice the cost of a scout. Not to mention have power armour and camo cloaks to boot. hmmmmm, may have to playtest to see how survivable or useful they are although the competitive side of me says no. Then again, I don't play with cheap chaff units. Still won't park them in LOS, but hiding in ruins beyond deployment zone would still be useful. Plus they are troops and Obsec. Suppressors seem surprisingly cheap compared to Inceptors, although their weapons are heavy and so will suffer a bit from accuracy without rerolls or Keen Senses. I still can't wait to use those auto cannons though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272243 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Triszin Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 They might be a bit expensive but get one Max squad, split it. And put them on either side of your fire support and all of a sudden there's a rather large anti deepstrike zone protecting them. They are basically elites, but instead they are troops which I appreciate Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272410 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gherrick Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 I find it kinda sad that the only way SW get combat squads is with primaris. Why not make that a common adeptas astartes infantry trait at this point? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272418 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Triszin Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 I find it kinda sad that the only way SW get combat squads is with primaris. Why not make that a common adeptas astartes infantry trait at this point? Cause we're pack hunters :p Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272446 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Danjou Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 I not that sure if I am getting any of the new primaris, I have never liked the Phobos armour, but one thing I must say is that the Suppressors look awesomely ridiculous over the top, something I miss in 40k sometimes, if the AC had been under slung as the Kalibrax pattern AC are I would buy them in a heartbeat, and I would ignore those glide things on their backpacks. I also like the new lieutenant as I think he looks like he would fit in a SW force. But will probably not get them till they get down in points and are sold separate, as my pile of shame is to big at the moment. Cpt Danjou Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272448 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 But will probably not get them till they get down in points and are sold separate, as my pile of shame is to big at the moment. They will be available separately on eBay within a week. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272454 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt.Danjou Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 But will probably not get them till they get down in points and are sold separate, as my pile of shame is to big at the moment. They will be available separately on eBay within a week. Oh I am sure of it, but I have five dreads, several squads of original marines, plus truckloads of other things that should be painted first, and the discount I get in my FLGS always beats whatever prices eBay can throw at me. :) Cpt. Danjou Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272464 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 The best thing with shadow spear so far is this warlord trait "target priority". Imagine a captain in phobos armour giving +1 to hit to a stormfang,, assault cannon razorback or dakka redemptor dread accompanied by a wolfguard battle leader ...ouch... that is a serious buff at last. And with his concealed position deployment can get in the middle of the board turn 1. Ofcourse youll need some infiltrators to screen him . It is good but it only affects one unit per turn. Our shootiest units max out around 350 points (10 Hellblasters, tooled up Repulsor etc). Combined with the normal rerolls of 1s, that gives a 97% accuracy rate but only on that one unit. And you can bet that unit will get the full force of your opponent's army once he realises what it is capable of. If the ability was a rule of the Captain, I would snap one up. But as a Warlord Trait it is up against some fairly stiff competition from our normal selection. Now if you combine it with some of the FW Astartes super-heavy units, that is a combo you could build an army around. It just doesn't strike me as very..... Wolfy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272489 Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithonwings Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 The best thing with shadow spear so far is this warlord trait "target priority". Imagine a captain in phobos armour giving +1 to hit to a stormfang,, assault cannon razorback or dakka redemptor dread accompanied by a wolfguard battle leader ...ouch... that is a serious buff at last. And with his concealed position deployment can get in the middle of the board turn 1. Ofcourse youll need some infiltrators to screen him . It is good but it only affects one unit per turn. Our shootiest units max out around 350 points (10 Hellblasters, tooled up Repulsor etc). Combined with the normal rerolls of 1s, that gives a 97% accuracy rate but only on that one unit. And you can bet that unit will get the full force of your opponent's army once he realises what it is capable of. If the ability was a rule of the Captain, I would snap one up. But as a Warlord Trait it is up against some fairly stiff competition from our normal selection. Now if you combine it with some of the FW Astartes super-heavy units, that is a combo you could build an army around. It just doesn't strike me as very..... Wolfy. How about deploying it in the middle of the board and let a stormfang move up next to it in T1. Should do some propper shooting for a turn. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272665 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonewolf81 Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 That was exactly what I was thinking :).Are the new warlord traits phobos character exclusive?? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272721 Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithonwings Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 That was exactly what I was thinking .Are the new warlord traits phobos character exclusive?? The only problem I can think of is how to keep him alive if you don't get first turn. Deploy behind another unit? Needing to buy another unit makes it a very expensive combo. I need to puzzle on this. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272737 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 That was exactly what I was thinking .Are the new warlord traits phobos character exclusive??The only problem I can think of is how to keep him alive if you don't get first turn. Deploy behind another unit? Needing to buy another unit makes it a very expensive combo. I need to puzzle on this. Give the trait to a Phobos Lt and he can drop in from Reserves with his Grav chute. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272813 Share on other sites More sharing options...
faithonwings Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 Yes that would work. But reserves using grav chute can only come in play T2. I would prefer to get the bonus T1. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272962 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kallas Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 You could just deploy the Vanguard Warlord... Normally! Yes, they have Concealed Positions, but if that's going to leave them in too dangerous a position, just don't overextend! If you're trying to use the bonus on a flyer: your flyer should be touching your table edge. Given its 4/5" long base and 20" minimum move, you only need the Warlord about 4" in front: it'll need over 10" of overfly to fully clear his base, plus the initial 4" of deployment. It's turn only 6" or so in front of the Warlord - so you can move it up to 4" further and guarantee (with an Advance) that he can get within 3" for Target Priority. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5272990 Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonewolf81 Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 So the vanguard warlord traits can be used only by phobos units, you tube confirmed that. The best way to utilise the +1 to hit trait along with a stormfang without getting exposed with your HQ or keeping the gunship back is the following: You take the vanguard librarian who has the runepriest keyword and give him the trait. You also get a smash wolflord with jump pack as a second HQ for the battalion and a smash battle leader with jump pack if you have the points to go for a second detachment for the reroll 1s to hit and wound bubble. The librarian gets the coriidor power and the command point farming power. The librarian follows the fast moving force of jump pack HQs and gunship + razorbacks/rhinos with troops by using the corridor on himself. The succesful casting of corridor enables -1 to hit thnx to the 3CP wolf stratagem. If possible you use the second power to farm CP or you smite. Ps. 1. You can still use the chooser of the slain strat thnx to runepriest keyword making the stormfang fire 2. The libby doesnt loose anything passing his shooting phase unlike the captain or leutenant 3. You dont have your warlord at the front line, like you would do with your smash melee heroes if one of them was warlord Modified the post cause rievers can't move after arriving from reserves with the use of corridor power thnx to an faq :) Cheers!!! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5273187 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispy Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 Please stop calling him the librarian ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/354330-vanguard-wolves-thoughts-on-the-upcoming-primaris/page/2/#findComment-5273349 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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