(Legion) express removal of T3, 4+ in cover

[rendingon1+]

Since some time ago there was a talk about how annoying Tech Thralls are, I decided to take a closer look on (preferably cheap) methods of eliminating this kind on targets:

(up to 20 bodies)

Solar auxilia + shields + medic

Adsecularis with carapace and 5+ FnP

Other W1, T3, 4+, possibly FnP

Assuming they are all fearless or pass morale tests very easily.

 

My takes are:

- Storm eagle double blast Vengeance launcher (doesn't solve FnP problem, but thanks to mobility (and lucky scatter) it can bypass cover sometimes. My favorite.

- Whirlwinds, same (one blast per tank though) but fragile and not as universal and cost effective as Storm Eagle

- Master of Signals bombardment (for specific unit that holds important objective)

- Command squad with mauls (list dependant)

 

Of course medusas, basilsiks and Superheavies will do the job but they are certainly not cheap. About culverins HSS - heavy weapon on PA dudes = unwieldy, expensive and fragile. Never had any luck with these.

 

What are your tools of quick death?

[Pearson73]

I would imagine that heavy flamer squads in drop pods or Termites would burn out such troops pretty effectively, as well as providing a turn one distraction in the heart of the enemy lines. Decent overwatch potential there too. Similarly, a dread with flamestorm cannon and heavy flamer could pod in first turn, less damage output, however the higher strength negates fnp and being a vehicle may grant enhanced survivability.

[Charlo]

Rad Grenades!

 

These are your best bet. It takes them down to T2 in combat so that your basic guys can deny the FNP with S4. The issue is getting these, obviously a few legions (DG, DA, Black Shields) can take them in decent numbers but other armies are limited to:

• Forge Lords
• Moritats
• Techmarines
• Destroyers

Basically charge them with any of these and they're down to just carapace armour and being wounded on a 2+. However as they'll be fearless you need to ensure you try to wipe them in one round while the Rad is in effect, or it'll turn into a huge grind.

 

Of special note are Salamanders, who lose a few of the above options but instead gain S6 Heavy Flamers, the ultimate anathema to Tech Thralls!

 

Additional note: if you are a fellow Mechanicum player, you can bring a Magos with Rad Furnace, Rad Grenades and a Scyllax bodyguard to insta-kill the unit if you get a charge in, as they are reduced to T0.

[Gorgoff]

I had always killed them in droves with my trusty

"unwieldy, expensive and fragile" HSS with Volkite Culverine. 8)

[rendingon1+]

Mayby I should be a bit clearer in my first post. I'm looking for a small point investment units that can reliably and quickly kill mentioned chaff.

 

But challage has been issued so... culverin squad :

 

Min squad is about 200 points if you take AA on sarge. Auxilia las section or adsecularis is about 100 pts. Let's say they're not in cover. So assuming your HSS is in range, you roll 20 hits on BS4  you wound on 2+ and sure, they get no FnP but still have 4+ to pass. I know there is deflagrate of course, but you have to be really lucky to take them down one turn.

And most importantly you dedicated 200 points to kill 100 points unit.

 

Storm Eagle

Meanwhile, high in the sky flies a Storm Eagle. It costs 300 but has armoured ceramite, TL LC x2 and TL MM. It can transport 20 dudes AND has Vengence Missle Launcher that fires 2 Large heavy bolter blasts. It can ignore (some) cover (types) with good scatter/shot angle which is IN ADDITION to cracking tanks and being assault vehicle.

 

Usefulness:

vs Solar Auxilia - awesome since almost everybody is T3,4+

vs Mechanicum - less so but it partially solves adsecularis problem

 

Whrlwind

Dedicated Artillery. x3=215. 3x Ordnance heavy bolter large blasts, still more survivable, mobile and cheaper than culverins. Not fan though, depends on terrain.

Usefulness:

vs Solar Auxilia - good as Storm Eagle launcher is, but extremely fragile

vs Mechanicum - not very good since it will be thrall killer only.

 

Master of Signals Bombardment

- No save, no FnP, Wounds on 2+, D3 large blasts. Only problem is cover. And it costs almost nothing

Usefulness:

vs Solar Auxilia - awesome

vs Mechanicum - awesome

 

My dedicated macemen command squad:

Too much to write how I use them, they are awesome if played right.

155 pts. Depends on mission, they can go on foot if deployment zones are close and there's some reasonable terrain alternatively jump packs (230).

Usefulness:

vs Solar Auxilia - they kill everything quickly.

• 20 attacks on charge,
• no sv, no fnp, wound on 2+,
• 2+sv (more resistant to SA overwatch),
• fearless
• WS5 - immune to close formation fighting debuff

 

If they get there, they destroy everything "infantry" in one round (including sweeping). They even butcher haronites too. This not one use unit, In my experience they can roll through entire tercio before dying - that's assuming they are not a target of concentrated "punitive" fire after they slaughtered first section.

 

vs Mechanicum - Generally I don't take them unless I know there will be some big, fat unit of thralls and/or thallax. Vs said units works like vs Solar Auxilia. Can be modified with consuls for other targets (works only if you're DA sorry).

 

That's my personal experience. Tools above not always work (like everything else) but I find them reliable. On the other hand I'm lookin for some other ways.

[Vykes]

I always deal with them with my "over-priced, flying not-Fire Raptor" Storm Eagles, too -smirks-   I tend to just go cheaper with TL Heavy Bolter, twin LC Las and that's all.  Honestly, between that and chainaxe reavers, my sons of Horus don't typically have a ton of trouble with thralls and the like.  

 

A macemen squad... you know, I've never really considered it but I think I have enough bits to put one into action.  Hmmm, yeah, I may have to try that with a weaponmaster vet unit. 

 

Bit of an odd-ball though, what about Lightnings with Phosphex bomb clusters? They're pretty cheap with all the usual phosphex bits, and if it's a squad lingering around then the payload will linger with them. 

[rendingon1+]

Macemen - main selling point is that they rock artificer, fearless 2W guy and don't take Elite slot. Might work with vets though, they certainly will be more destructive.

 

I can't say anything about phosphex lightning because I literally forgot they can take something other than kraken lol. Looking at the rules again however, I'd rather take sunfury - no sv, no fnp, 2+ to wound, large blast... Phospex will wound them only on 3+ and they still have their FnP rolls.

[Charlo]

A note on the mace men, theres apparently a unit coming in book 8 that have boarding shields and power maces that have deflagurate and additional effects aganst psykers... Could be the perfect unit.

[Nomadic Thunder]

Boarding shielded deflagrating macemen sound like the . With a forgemaster with rad grenades in ZM they could take some names vs astartes...

 

"Squad. Prepare to repel boarders!"

 

 

 

vs Mechanicum - Generally I don't take them unless I know there will be some big, fat unit of thralls and/or thallax. Vs said units works like vs Solar Auxilia. Can be modified with consuls for other targets (works only if you're DA sorry).

 

 Why do you say the macemen only work vs Mechanicum with a dark angels consul?

[rendingon1+]

 

vs Mechanicum - Generally I don't take them unless I know there will be some big, fat unit of thralls and/or thallax. Vs said units works like vs Solar Auxilia. Can be modified with consuls for other targets (works only if you're DA sorry).

 

 Why do you say the macemen only work vs Mechanicum with a dark angels consul?

Well, I phrased it kind of bad. I mean, when you're playing Dark Angels you have toys (one would evevn say) tailored to kill Mechanicum:

 

Your consul with Terranic Greatsword can kill up to 4 full wound <Domitar on the charge when rad granades are on. Happens! (happens more if playing Ravenwing) it's the only occasion Terranic Greatsword works otherwise, it's nigh useless vs Legions. Also your opponent lears very fast not to leave greatsword DA heroes alive for too long.

 

Stasis shells: if you manage to hit with a small blast, any automata with WS3 is now WS2 meaning it will only hit your WS5 on 5+. It's just for safety really.

 

However, if you really intend to go heavy automata hunting (cc), I'd suggest Xenobane veterans - Maceman were invented to kill auxilia/tech thralls in a first place.

[MorgothNL]

Rad Grenades!

 

These are your best bet. It takes them down to T2 in combat so that your basic guys can deny the FNP with S4.

Alas, the rad grenade rules specifically mention it does not affect the targets instant death threshold. 

[Nomadic Thunder]

Alas, the rad grenade rules specifically mention it does not affect the targets instant death threshold. 

 

 

I believe it does. It states that they do in the weapons appendix in my copy of the age of darkness army list book p.127

"Note: This does affect the victims' instant death threshold"

[Gorgoff]

 

 

Alas, the rad grenade rules specifically mention it does not affect the targets instant death threshold.

 

 

I believe it does. It states that they do in the weapons appendix in my copy of the age of darkness army list book p.127

"Note: This does affect the victims' instant death threshold"

And even more important, because it would override it like said in the faq, the rulebook says likewise. :)

[Rabidbunneh]

Scorpius? I've seen people complain about tech thralls, but marines have access to one of the best ways to remove them, it's also almost the same cost as one squad, it doesn't suffer from the low AP issue that other suggestions do. The d3 extra shots are prone to spikes, but the s8 ap3 gets round their armour and FNP, barrage means you can snipe ones closer to the Tech Priest, if any, that are buffing the squad, s8 ap3 barrage means you can also use it against other Mechanicum, like flare shielded Krios (that you outrange) and Cybernetica units, a Castellax is wounded on 3s with only a 5++.

 

Defesnively it's better than a Predator too, barrage and cheap voxes means you can park it behind terrain and fire without much threat of it dying before it shoots.

 

A Scorpius is so damn good it's crazy.

[MorgothNL]

 

Alas, the rad grenade rules specifically mention it does not affect the targets instant death threshold. 

 

 

I believe it does. It states that they do in the weapons appendix in my copy of the age of darkness army list book p.127

"Note: This does affect the victims' instant death threshold"

 

 

 

 

 

Alas, the rad grenade rules specifically mention it does not affect the targets instant death threshold.

 

I believe it does. It states that they do in the weapons appendix in my copy of the age of darkness army list book p.127

"Note: This does affect the victims' instant death threshold"

And even more important, because it would override it like said in the faq, the rulebook says likewise.

 

Okay, brainfart. I always read it as 'does not' but you are both right, the word 'not' isn't there :P. I just assumed it said 'does not' because of the fact it was a specific mention. 

Carry on