Help a non-Tau player understand the Drone mechanics.

[ValourousHeart]

We have one Tau player at our LGS.

He loves running lots of shied drones with Battle Suit HQs.

But he isn't very good at explaining the rules for his army.

 

The problem is me just not understanding where the savior protocol fits into the sequence.

How does the savior protocols work in a simple example?

 

How do savior protocols interact with weapons like the Dark Talon Rift Cannon and the Knight Valiant Thundercoil Harpoon, both of which inflict additional mortal wounds if any damage is suffered?

Would those mortal wounds revert back to the original target and need to be blocked by drones, does the drone unit become the target and therefore the mortal wounds would wrap around the drone unit, or would savior protocols prevent those extra wounds from even happening?

 

If a unit of drones is near a unit in CC, but the drone unit isn't in CC itself, can they use the savior protocols to prevent damage from CC attacks?

[GrinNfool]

Ya drones are annoying I had to learn them because my wife plays Tau lol.

 

Drones work different than most "look out sir" type abilities, the simplest explanation is if there is a drone w/ in 3" if what you want to shoot a multi damage weapon at, don't bother until the drones are dead.  The explanation is the wording, the majority of these protection rules happen when the model LOSES a wound, meaning you make your save with the model first, then pass off each point of damage as a mortal wound.  Drones however state when the model is wounded, so this means no save is rolled, the drones just automatically take a mortal wound on a 2+ (damage is irrelevant as thing of it like your las cannon shot the drone instead the drone only has 1 wound).  Also watch tau players seen more than a few try to make their 2+ or 3+ save fail it then try to pass the wound off, if they take their save they are no longer able to pass the wound off to the drone.  Shield drones is where it gets a bit more complicated, they get to roll a 5+ FNP against that mortal wound, but due to multi damage being negated, its just 1 FNP instead of say 3-4 that the weapon might have done.  The way I look at it generally is the drone has a 5++ against the attack you made.   Melee doesn't stop this from happening it stops any attack doesn't matter ranged or melee.

 

GW has been pretty consistent with weapon damage and mortal wounds being treated separately, a mortal wound wouldn't trigger an ability on the weapon because the weapon didn't do the damage.... a mortal wound did quirky as that is.  My best advice is shoot drones unless what you are targeting something t4 or less with 1 damage weapons in which case it is actually in your favor to make the tau pass off a bunch of single damage attacks instead of shooting the drone because the non shield drones just die and the shield drones get a 5+ instead of the 4++.  Crisis suits and better are t5, so there is no advantage to shooting them over the drones unless they aren't shield drones, in which case you should shoot the suit, ghost keel excluded because you gotta get rid of that -1 non sense.  Avoid shooting multi damage weapons at anything that has drones around it unless you just don't have another choice.  They still have to roll that 2+ to pass it off so 1 in 6 that fails.  For me I just spend the first turn shooting drones or marker light units with everything, and save my big guns for last hoping to clear drones off a suit unit.  Generally with a good list you can drop most of the tau drones in a turn of shooting, and if your opponent is spread out you can just focus on the unit of drones protecting what you want to actually kill.

 

You can read it in the Tau FAQ if you want but here is a copy paste

 

Q: How does the Saviour Protocols ability work when a T’au Empire unit is hit and wounded by a powerful weapon, like a lascannon, when it is near to some friendly Drones?

A: Let’s imagine a T ’a u S e p t unit is targeted by a model firing a lascannon whilst a friendly T’au Sept Droneunit is within 3" of it. The hit roll and wound rolls for the attack made with the lascannon are both successful. The T’au Sept player then rolls one D6, scoring a 3 – this is more than 2+ so they choose to allocate the wound caused by the lascannon’s attack to the nearby Drone unit instead. Instead of resolving the damage normally against the Drone unit (i.e. taking a saving throw, and if it is failed, inflicting damage equal to the weapon’s Damage characteristic – in this case D6), the Drone unit suffers 1 mortal wound, typically resulting in the destruction of a single Drone model.

 

Q: For the purposes of the Saviour Protocols ability, what exactly constitutes an attack?

A: In this context, it is an attack made with a ranged or melee weapon.

[Marshlands]

So kill the drones first or use mortal wounds.

 

The shield drones are very good, through saviour protocols they have a better chance of surviving a wound from some weapons than a character would

[ValourousHeart]

Ok, so I think I have this.

 

Valiant fires Thundercoil Harpoon at Tau Suit HQ

1. IK player rolls 3+ to Hit
2. Ik player rolls 2+ to Wound
3. Tau player rolls 2+ to block with a shield drone
4. If successful Tau player rolls 5+ FNP for Shield Drone
5. If fails Tau Suite HQ takes 10 damage
6. Either result the Harpoon is prevented from using its special rule to add d3 MW.

[GrinNfool]

 

Ok, so I think I have this.

 

Valiant fires Thundercoil Harpoon at Tau Suit HQ

1. IK player rolls 3+ to Hit
2. Ik player rolls 2+ to Wound
3. Tau player rolls 2+ to block with a shield drone
4. If successful Tau player rolls 5+ FNP for Shield Drone
5. If fails Tau Suite HQ takes 10 damage
6. Either result the Harpoon is prevented from using its special rule to add d3 MW.

 

Close but not quite up to 4 is correct, if the 2+ intervene fails the suit takes a save as normal assuming it gets one (basically the drone doesn't intervene and the rest of the phase proceeds as normal), if that fails then you go to damage, if your weapon causes a mortal wound then that would still happen as normal as long as its due to the weapon.  The added mortal wound from the weapon only fails if the drone intervenes and takes the mortal wound, as that would no longer be considered weapon damage.

[Panzer]

GrinNfool has it right.

 

Another small thing, since the Shield Drone has a 5+ FnP it can soak up the whole thing and be fine. That's right, this little 10p Drone just took your big Knights scary weapon to the face and lives to tell the tale after just one 2+ and one 5+ roll.

 

This all sounds pretty discouraging and indeed Drones are the best bodyguards in the game but there's still a chance so just keep shooting at the suits. If you would shoot that same weapon against the Shield Drone directly you'd still kill only that one Drone but without having the chance to damage the suit at all ... also the Shield Drone would be avle to use its 4+ invul instead of just its 5+ FnP.

Use only real anti-infantry stuff against the Drones directly and everything that could realistically damage the suit just shoot at the suit.

[Marshlands]

Except the roll to wound may be very different and if an attack doesn't have rend your opponent may prefer it hits a 2+ save suit

[Panzer]

Except the roll to wound may be very different and if an attack doesn't have rend your opponent may prefer it hits a 2+ save suit

 

Hence why I wrote "Use only real anti-infantry stuff against the Drones directly and everything that could realistically damage the suit just shoot at the suit."

[Marshlands]

 

 

Except the roll to wound may be very different and if an attack doesn't have rend your opponent may prefer it hits a 2+ save suit

Hence why I wrote "Use only real anti-infantry stuff against the Drones directly and everything that could realistically damage the suit just shoot at the suit."

You're missing the point. Even non "real anti infantry stuff" is worse if you shoot it straight at the battlesuit. Shoot that at the drones first too.

 

Battlecannon can wound some drones on 2s etc

 

I always want the opponent to shoot everything at the suit so I can spread the damage as i see. A battlecannon that's only rend -2 I can still have a 4+ save against with a riptide and if he's got a lot of health left but there's some Melta coming next I'd take the cannon on the tide to save drones for scarier Meltas. It's almost never better to shoot the battlesuit first IMO. You just let the tau player control it. 1 Melta and 1 bolter against 1 crisis suit and 1 gun drone and you know which way its going down

[Panzer]

Alright you go and shoot Drones with your Lascannons and equivalents. Nothing would make me as T'au player happier. Literally. ^^

[Focslain]

Dealing with drones is just a matter of proper targeting and firing protocol.

 

In the case of your Valiant if your going after his commander the basic firing sequence should be:

 

Siegecannon -> Drones
Conflagration Cannon -> drones
Meltaguns -> Suit
Harpoon -> suit

 

In that order. This means that the drones are taking multiple FNP rolls which should wipe them out, giving your better multi-damage weapons a clear line.

 

This is generally the same sequence I use for my castellan.

 

In general using anti-infantry weapons against the drones is not a bad idea in the least. Clear the chaff to give your heavier weapons a better shot.

[Marshlands]

Alright you go and shoot Drones with your Lascannons and equivalents. Nothing would make me as T'au player happier. Literally. ^^

Well ideally I wouldn't want to shoot a lascannons at either. But as a tau player often is prefer it against say a riptide than a drone, because if I'm running low on drones I can attempt the invuln. If youre about to be charged by a damage 6 knight id rather keep the drone.

 

There's obviously infinite scenarios but the point is as long as the drones are alive the tau player can manage the situation to their advantage, hence it's almost always better to kill them first

[Panzer]

 

There's obviously infinite scenarios but the point is as long as the drones are alive the tau player can manage the situation to their advantage, hence it's almost always better to kill them first

 

 

See I don't completely agree with that. The way you say it you want to take the decision away from the T'au player (good!) and go with the worse decision anyway (bad!).

If a weapon has a decent chance to deal damage to a suit it's better to just shoot it at the suit directly. Sure the T'au player can decide whether he wants to put it on the Drone or not (only if he manages the 2+ roll though) but usually he wants to put it on the Drone anyway so if you make that decision for him beforehand you play right into his hands since he doesn't even have to pass the 2+ roll to protect the suit in the first place PLUS in case of a Shield Drone it doesn't just get the 5+++ but also the 4++ to soak up the shot.

 

I'm not saying it's a bad idea to kill the Drones first but don't waste the weapons you want to shoot at the suit for that. The right weapon for the right task!

Now if there's only a very limited amount of Drones able to protect the suit and you only have a very limited amount of shots left you of course have to do some target priority management and in that case it might be better to try to take out the Drones with a strong weapon so you can score with the super strong weapon afterwards, however that case should be the exception and you should take care of the Drones before actually getting to shoot with those strong weapons in the first place. Exceptions are not the rule. You almost always want to shoot the good weapons directly at the suit and only in such corner cases you want to bite the bullet and 'waste' your good weapons on Drones.

[Marshlands]

 

 

There's obviously infinite scenarios but the point is as long as the drones are alive the tau player can manage the situation to their advantage, hence it's almost always better to kill them first

 

See I don't completely agree with that. The way you say it you want to take the decision away from the T'au player (good!) and go with the worse decision anyway (bad!).

If a weapon has a decent chance to deal damage to a suit it's better to just shoot it at the suit directly. Sure the T'au player can decide whether he wants to put it on the Drone or not (only if he manages the 2+ roll though) but usually he wants to put it on the Drone anyway so if you make that decision for him beforehand you play right into his hands since he doesn't even have to pass the 2+ roll to protect the suit in the first place PLUS in case of a Shield Drone it doesn't just get the 5+++ but also the 4++ to soak up the shot.

 

I'm not saying it's a bad idea to kill the Drones first but don't waste the weapons you want to shoot at the suit for that. The right weapon for the right task!

Now if there's only a very limited amount of Drones able to protect the suit and you only have a very limited amount of shots left you of course have to do some target priority management and in that case it might be better to try to take out the Drones with a strong weapon so you can score with the super strong weapon afterwards, however that case should be the exception and you should take care of the Drones before actually getting to shoot with those strong weapons in the first place. Exceptions are not the rule. You almost always want to shoot the good weapons directly at the suit and only in such corner cases you want to bite the bullet and 'waste' your good weapons on Drones.

I agree with what you're saying in theory but in practise I'm finding that exception to be constantly in play, there's always a tier of weapons and the best weapon can't get to the suits until the drones are dead.

 

I totally get that granting the shield drones a 4++ is worse, but actually in the case of a multi damage weapon it's not that much worse if they're unlikely to pass multiple FnPs (still worse, but shield drones are a bitch to kill no matter what you do).

 

Sure the drones might be the worse decision for a specific weapon but once theyre dead the tau player has no decision. Do you not (reluctantly) take wounds on your healthy Battlesuits to preserve drones for more dangerous hits you know are coming? I mean a 3++ riptide is fantastic for doing that. It happens to be in every game, probably every turn. And with a command reroll saviour protocols is too reliable for a gamble shot to do much, especially against something with lots of wounds. I can't recall the last time I've lost a battlesuit model (not wounds, a whole model) whilst there's a drone nearby, but once the drones are dead they're 'just' still pretty tough units (honestly it almost frustrates me that we never get to show off some of our Battlesuits innate resilience)