Primaris and Blood Angels

[t-dog1996]

I should preface this post by stating that I don't use Primaris Marines in my Blood Angels army, at least not yet. This isn't out of any particular aversion to them as a concept, but simply because I favour an assault-based army and they don't have any genuine assault units. I do have shooty units for fire support, but again the assault theme of my army means that I prioritise mobility, either through shenanigans with deployment, wargear such as jump packs or the ability to take a transport. Mobility is one thing that Primaris Marines generally don't have (I am tempted by Inceptors, but as yet I don't have any). I also find that my Stormraven and my Land Raider Crusader, between them, fulfil most of my fire support needs.

 

I also love the Primaris models and can see why they are so popular from a visual standpoint.

 

My question is how people feel Primaris fit into Blood Angels right now. A big problem I have is their lack of flexibility. Most OG Marine units can be tooled to counter a variety of threats, whilst Primaris units generally only work against one type of enemy. Intercessors strike me as particularly underwhelming in that sense. Despite their extra wound and attack they get cut to pieces by any actual assault unit, and in a ranged gunfight they will usually be targeting units in cover so their AP -1 seems of limited value. Compare that with a Tactical Squad, their most direct competition; although Bolters are even worse than Bolt Rifles, a 5-man Tactical Squad can be equipped with a special weapon and a combi-weapon, and can take any transport. Meanwhile, Scouts are cheap, can deploy ahead of the main army and can pack a heavy weapon for added kick. I have a similar problem with Reivers. They are supposed to be the Primaris assault troops but compared to Death Company, Sanguinary Guards, Vanguary Vets or even normal Assault Marines their lack of options seriously limits their usefulness for me. I just feel that the Blood Angels are a fast army designed to fight in close quarters, and the Primaris Marines, *mostly*, seem a dramatic departure from that ethos.

 

The new Vigilus box set and the Vanguard Primaris look interesting and some of the stuff in there seems more up our alley, but even so I don't feel as though I'll be phasing OG Marines out of my army any time soon. What do people think about this? I didn't want to make this post into a rant about GW replacing old marines, I just feel that from a gameplay standpoint the motivation to leave old marines behind is limited for us.

[Pathstrider]

I've replaced my tactical squads with Intercessors. I prefer to field on foot and have the option to hang back, so I find them better with the extra range over bolters.

 

I also feel like the Blood Angels benefit Intercessors quite a bit - the standard of sacrifice makes up for lack of transport in terms of protection, and the +1 to wound tips them over into a situationally useful close combat unit - or at least gives some enemies second thoughts.

 

I sometimes use hellblasters, but generally don't use other primaris. It's a real shame there isn't a viable CC unit.

 

I like the look of the vanguard unit, but don't think there's anything I'd take - hopefully the full release with more options will help that.

[Leonaides]

Rievers arent primaris assault troops. Or at least not the ones you throw into the enemies big bad unit to flatten it. They are the equivalent of a cc scout unit. Situational supporting unit or able to bully really weak things like IG or tau. Currently there isnt a primaris dedicated cc unit. Look for a termie equivalent cc unit in gravis maybe?

[t-dog1996]

Rievers arent primaris assault troops. Or at least not the ones you throw into the enemies big bad unit to flatten it. They are the equivalent of a cc scout unit. Situational supporting unit or able to bully really weak things like IG or tau. Currently there isnt a primaris dedicated cc unit. Look for a termie equivalent cc unit in gravis maybe?

Fair enough, but honestly if I want a Scout unit I’ll just take Scouts. They’re much cheaper and can be given a heavy weapon as well. The points cost is a real consideration with BA needing as many free points as possible to pump into elites. It’s still the best section of our codex. Scouts with combat knives can already bully Guard and their equivalents in cc anyway.

[PaladinStormlord]

I am in the process of putting together a competitive army similar to Neonmole's, which is all primaris. My every day builds exclusively use Intercessors. I find Inceptors to be quite handy and powerful. Much like everyone else I am waiting on a GOOD melee unit to arrive. The vangard stuff looks interesting, but the points costs have me holding off pulling the trigger on a preorder. Once I get my Hellblasters painted up I plan to take them out for a spin. When it comes to the intercessors, the lack of a heavy weapon does hurt some, when compared to the classic marines, but double the wounds causes my opponent to put forth more firepower to clear them off the table, and the better bolters make up a lot of ground of not having a heavy weapon. The Aux grenade launcher is nice too.

[Grazcruzk]

I've been using at least two 5/6 man squads of intercessors with fists on the sgts for my troops pretty regularly along with either a lascannon tac squad or scouts, sometimes both. I usually try to get them a little forward into the middle ground. I find them to be fairly flexible shooting and assaulting anything that gets close, especially with the fist at three attacks. Occasionally I stick two 5mans in a repulsor and rush them into the enemy lines to assault and try to grab objectives but the repulsor is such a fire magnet that they end up on foot most of the time anyways. I think the most fun I have with a heavy primaris list is using a walking gunline. I know it isn't straight out assaulting, but sticking the standard of sacrifice in the middle of all that 2w infantry really makes a difference. If you're moving up the board you're also going to have a good anchor point for inceptors, which I love for BA. Toss in a novite or priest and let the frustration commence. I've been using a novite with a jump pack lately, super cheap and he can get where he needs to be. 

 

Personally I'm really looking forward to shadowspear. There may not be a sold dedicated melee option yet, but imagine how great it will be to setup a couple 10man infiltrator squads close to your enemy and using Upon Wings of Fire to stick your banner next to them first turn. Even moving, popping smoke, and assaulting first turn will cause a headache that will need to be dealt with. I'm hoping at some point that infiltrators will be able to at least put a power weapon on the sgt, but who knows. Until then I'll be happy just being able to set up in concealed positions.

[Karhedron]

My Inceptors have been doing very well ever since the price drop last year. The Bolter versions are cheap and very effective and a good counter to horde armies while still being able to drop MEQs thanks to AP-1 and buckets of dice.

 

The Plasma version require a bit more support but since we often run JP Captains, they are easy to fit into a BA army. If you want an elite infantry army, run them as second wave to Sanguiary Guard with Standard of Sacrifice. Have them hug the Banner's bubble on T1 for some extra survivability and then peel them off T2 when the SG hit and take out nearby units.

[Panzer]

There's really just one way I could describe Intercessors. They are solid. They don't feel weak or underwhelming in any way and also not exactly strong in any way. You take them and they will fulfill their purpose. Period.

Visually and functionally probably the Marine unit I'm most pleased with right now.

 

Inceptors are a bit swingy for me. I only use the Bolter variant currently and my dice always decide to roll badly for either hits or wounds for some reason (same number of S5 AP-1 shots on my Redemptor Dread feel like they are way more reliable lol). However together with a unit of Reiver they often contribute a lot to me actually winning the game as when I drop both units on a less well protected flank they can usually overwhelm it and secure a few objectives I'd otherwise wouldn't be able to get without having to mow through my opponents army first.

 

Hellblaster are often more or less an ace in the hole type of unit for me. I put a unit of 5 in my Repulsor and they sit there until a high threat target gets within 24" (3" disembark, 6" move, 15" rapid fire). Sometimes I also put 5 Reiver with combat blades inside in case some infantry unit comes to close despite all the anti-infantry dakka on a Repulsor.

Since I don't play on tournaments and I usually protect my Repulsor with the 5++ psychic power and also have 1-2 Redemptor Dreads walking in front of it I usually don't have a problem with protecting it for most of the game. T8 Sv3+/5++ is not something many people like to shoot at when there are also two T7 Sv3+ Dreads with a degrading profile as alternative targets. 

 

Now this is just general Primaris gameplay for the most part though. The only things I get from playing BA there are the 5++ psychic power and that Reivers and Intercessors are a bit more solid in melee. My list usually also contains a Librarian Dread and a JP Captain with Hammer (not always Captain Smash) though which I feel helps out a lot.

Last match I took a Gravis Captain together with the JP Captain and it was great that I could throw the Gravis Captain via HI into a Flyrant without having to worry about losing my re-roll aura. Even better that I managed to take the Flyrant down and Red Thirst helped a lot with that (he used the fight after getting killed Stratagem to kill the Gravis Captain as well but it was worth it I'd say). ^^

 

 

tl;dr

Primaris fit into Blood Angels like the fit into any other chapter, really. They don't gain a lot from being BA but what they get makes them more decent and other BA units help a lot where Primaris themselves are lacking. As long as there's no JP melee unit for Primaris it's definitely recommended to play a mixed army or to focus on the shooting with only minimal melee support via Reivers, Redemptor Dreads and HQs.