Battlebuddies: Thousand Sons and The Scourged?

[Minsc]

I miss some of my old "MoTz"-stuff that was made illegal in 8th Ed.
(Or was it already during late 7th? Can't remember.)

Anyway, I'm pondering about adding some The Scourged renegades and using as Allies to my Thousand Sons. 

I would basically add some old units that I have lying around, currently unwanted and unloved, and then split my Thousand Sons in two halves.
Then put everything that shoots and isn't a psyker in the Scourged-detachment and then everything else in the Thousand Sons-detachment. 

Should add a bit of flavor and option to the army without being unfluffy, and would basically look like this: 

Thousand Sons:
Daemon Princes, Sorcerers, Ahriman, Tzaangors, Rubricae* (maybe), Scarab Occults, Enlightened, Shamans, Spawns. 

The Scourged:
Chaos Lords, Dark Apostles, Warpsmiths, CSM, Rubricae* (maybe), Helbrutes, Terminators, Chosen, Obliterators, Havocs. 

Doesn't matter: 
Tanks, Daemon Engines and everything else that can be taken by either Thousand Sons or The Scourged.
(Avoid spamming melee-focused units. Neither Thousand Sons nor The Scourged really benefit them.) 

(*Rubricae greatly benefit from the Scourged's Renegade Trait, so it's a tradeoff that might be worth doing.)

Thoughts?
 

[Darnok]

Sounds good to me. Do you plan to have "proper" armies for both?

 

As for the Rubricae: I would put at least one unit in each force. To me at least, a TS army without Rubricae feels not right.

[BoomWolf]

The underlying question is "what do the scourged add to the TS?"

Or alternately "What do the TS add to the Scourged?"

 

Now, to answer that you need to first figure out what do the Scourged DO

 

And the answer is...sorta gunline?

Their renegade trait is helping your overwatch, and helps you with shooting high-quality low-quantity guns.

But...chaos units are not really built for that, and our better guns are all about the dakka. unlike Tau who make great use of both these traits (they actually got them as two seperate traits) the CSM don't really have linchpin low-quantity shots like markerlights are (and railguns technically, except these needs to be 2d6 damage to be good)

They got a warlord trait that is honestly just weird. its not enabling your own CC, but disables the enemy CC a bit so your own CC units can go to town on it.

As for the stratagem, its decent, but requires to have some quality infantry dakka, plus its utterly reactionary.

 

 

Honestly, I'm just not seeing Scourged really panning out. they have really good tricks but they just do not match with the CSM unit lineup very well-had they been for a shootier army, they would be amazing. but as it stands-I just don't see them shine.

And if Scourged as a whole are not worth your time, then either allying them to the TS or vice versa is not going to help, especially how our TS are currently non-functional outside HQ and the tzaangor bomb gimmik.

 

 

 

Now, on the grand subject of the new renegades, a few pointers must be made.

First and foremost there is NO RULE limiting the renegades to spesific alligences, meaning if you are willing to murder some bunnies (and as chaos players we should) you can pull off some nasty unexpected combos

In addition, the Purge stratagem is pretty nutty with mass flamers, allowing you to entangle an enemy with a unit, then roast it with another. (and possibly breaking the melee, allowing the entangle unit to shoot as well), but is still extremely good with "merely" prescience, as you will never EVER hit your guys. (Apperantly its unmodified roll, so only rerolls, or not rolling at all, is helping)

Lastly, flamer rubrics are a(n often forgotten) thing, and nobody would EVER see that coming, at least until it hits them once. and it will hit like a godamn truck

 

Purge flamer rubrics, for maximum heresy.

Purged also have a nice warlord trait.

But above all their tactic synrgises REALLY well with psyker shenanigans throwing mortal wounds.

Not with flamers, as they auto-hit anyway, but its a sort of an alternating punches stratagy, you can reserve your bulletbuffet against the targets you smite, and let loos the flamers on anything not getting lit up.

 

So what I CAN see being the new path for combined TS-CSM army, is a Tzeentch Purge main detachment and a TS supreme command lending a few psykers to initiate the shenanigans-every unit you hit a smite with gets full to-hit rerolls? yes please.

 

 

Actually, no need for them to be Tzeentch even (except the rubrics). pile them up as Slannesh and you got yourself endless cacophony piled up.

 

You can add a crown to make your purge rock some invuls, and further empower the psykers-though I'm not sure that's cost effective.

 

 

 

Also, corsairs Spiky 17 is alaways nice for CP farms.

Crimson slaughter are just a weaker CP farm, I don't see a reason to ever run these guys.

Flawless host are...meh.

Brazen beasts seems like they are made for zerkers, maulers, and little else.

[Minsc]

Sounds good to me. Do you plan to have "proper" armies for both?

 

I do. 

In 7th I split my (at the time, massive) CSM-army into two parts: A World Eater part and a Thousand Sons-part.

 

Since I've been playing CSM since 3d Ed. I also had a bunch of models that my World Eaters had no use for, and that my Thousand Sons couldn't use at all.

(Mostly about 50 CSM with bolters and mixed special/heavy weapons, some old Chaos Dreadnoughts, Obliterators, converted Chosen, regular Terimators, possessed, etc.)

I now plan on making a The Scourged-warband out of these.

 

 

*Text*

 

With all due respect BoomWolf, but from reading your post I quickly noticed that you and I play in vastly different metas and have different expectations on the game.

I would never run a MoT Purge-detachment as allies to my Thousand Sons, even if it is technically "legal" to do so. 

 

Perhaps I should've made this clearer in my OP, but I don't expect The Scourged, or a TS+Scourged combo to win a tournament.

I fully agree that players who are looking for the best shouldn't look at a Scourged+TS combo, or at the Scourged in general.

 

I'm simply asking what people think about combining Thousand Sons and The Scourged, essentially restoring the Thousand Sons/Tzeentch CSM-army to what it was during 4th-7th Ed, before GW took away most of our toys.

 

- - - - - - - - - -

 

Edit: Here's my current WIP Scourged Warband, "born" less than a week ago.

 

With the exception of the Oblits, it's entirely made up by model's that have spent the last couple of years in a box, unwanted and unloved, not fitting in with (or being needed in) either my World Eaters or my Thousand Sons.

 

Seems such a shame...

 

http://images2.imagebam.com/25/45/cc/7ea8a41185494814.jpg

 

All in all:

 

2x10 CSM with Tri-Plasma.

1x10 CSM with Tri-Melta.

2x10 Thousand Sons. (Old ones. My TS got the new plastic ones.)

1x10 Chosen with Plasmaguns.

1x10 Terminators. (Ironically painted as "The Purge" back in 5th when I used them as MoN Terminators. Don't judge me. )

2 Dreads with Twin-Las and Missile Launcher.

2 Obliterators.

A bunch of CSM/(old)Havocs with Heavy Weapons.

(Not on the picture, but there's also 1x10 Possessed.)

 

A Lord in Terminator Armour.

A Lord on Disc.

A Sorcerer with "Jumppack".

A converted...something, most likely a Master of Executions.

 

So yeah, a lot of models that's currently doing nothing, when they could be a fully working ally to my Thousand Sons.

 

 

 

[Sonoftherubric21]

Hah Minsc as it turns out we had similar issues: collect a bunch and eventually you own a secondary army...without ever really meaning to! 

It is actually how I ended up with Black Legion, Thousand Sons, and most recently....Iron Warriors......