New 2019 spring FAQ changes.

[Raven1]

Rubricae starting to look a lot more viable now, with beta bolters in effect and perils less of an issue. If only they lower the point cost of the icon from 5 to 1 and I'd be super stoked (or rather, even more stoked)

I wouldn't take the icon if it were free. If it were like AOS then we can talk, but as is the rule needs to be rewritten.

[Panzer]

Why not if it were free? You'd only gimp yourself for not taking something free lol

[Ahzek451]

Heh, I get your point Raven. Of course if it were free, who cares. But yeah...GW has a rules writer in there that really loves things going off on 6's. But this one screams last minute and super unimaginative. Such a cool bit, and yet soooo terrible. 

 

The icon and Athenaean Scrolls are easily some of the worst rule/equipment paces in our dex. 

[BoomWolf]

The Athenian Scrolls are a special case of not thinking something through, as if anyone ever bothered running the math before printing it it would reveal just how embarrassingly unlikely it is to ever come up. (heck, for a WC7 spell, there is only 1/18 chance that its even relevant before the opponent even rolls! and that's assuming he'd bother rolling against a 10.)


But yea, the Icon of flame needs a rework.

Heck, I'd say ALL of the icons need reworks, the only one being used is the khorne one, and even that's a bit dubious seeing how there are other sources for that ability.

[Ahzek451]

The Athenian Scrolls are a special case of not thinking something through, as if anyone ever bothered running the math before printing it it would reveal just how embarrassingly unlikely it is to ever come up. (heck, for a WC7 spell, there is only 1/18 chance that its even relevant before the opponent even rolls! and that's assuming he'd bother rolling against a 10.)

 

Exactly this. I'm not sure why I get so passionate about this relic but I am. Any time I write to the 40kfaq I bring it up. I really don't understand how this one made it out the door. I get why not every relic needs to be a winner, but nothing needs to be this bad. I think it's because I wanted a relic that I could slap on anything not ahriman and feel good about having a decent casting bonus of some sort. And this thing just utterly fails. Oh well, I geuss I will continue to bring it up.

[Sonoftherubric21]

I run lots of Rubrics so I can speak to their current viability: it shot up dramatically this past few months with the them dropping to 18ppm as well as the most recent Bolter Discipline going into effect. 

 

Its a very solid ruleset for Rubricae and as of this moment as far as I am aware "warp time" does not negate the use of Bolter Discipline RAW. (I am fairly certain this is correct.) 

 

Either way: Rubricae benefit proportionally far more then other marines from the rule, and in my case (barring fighting an army full of T8 models) it REALLY shows. 

 

A unit of 10 with Reaper now comes up to less then 200. From my perspective its a very solid unit that will do fine on 90% of tables. 

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

 

Rubricae starting to look a lot more viable now, with beta bolters in effect and perils less of an issue. If only they lower the point cost of the icon from 5 to 1 and I'd be super stoked (or rather, even more stoked)

I wouldn't take the icon if it were free. If it were like AOS then we can talk, but as is the rule needs to be rewritten.

 

Yeah, in AOS the Icon has entire army builds that revolve around it. Tzaangor Bug Zapper cheese is real. :)

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

I run lots of Rubrics so I can speak to their current viability: it shot up dramatically this past few months with the them dropping to 18ppm as well as the most recent Bolter Discipline going into effect. 

 

Its a very solid ruleset for Rubricae and as of this moment as far as I am aware "warp time" does not negate the use of Bolter Discipline RAW. (I am fairly certain this is correct.) 

 

Either way: Rubricae benefit proportionally far more then other marines from the rule, and in my case (barring fighting an army full of T8 models) it REALLY shows. 

 

A unit of 10 with Reaper now comes up to less then 200. From my perspective its a very solid unit that will do fine on 90% of tables. 

Yeah....Bolter Discipline is murderous for us. Both for the regular dust bunnies and our terminators. I was actually trading punches with Deathwatch a few weeks ago and getting the better of it until I dropped my Termies just a little too far away from an objective and lost by 1 point because I couldn't get there by game end.

 

Having a phalanx of 20 Rubrics get to midfield, plant their feet, and blast away is great. Even better when the opponent charges them and they Overwatch, fight, and then Dark Crystal out on my turn. :)

[Prot]

I run lots of Rubrics so I can speak to their current viability: it shot up dramatically this past few months with the them dropping to 18ppm as well as the most recent Bolter Discipline going into effect. 

 

Its a very solid ruleset for Rubricae and as of this moment as far as I am aware "warp time" does not negate the use of Bolter Discipline RAW. (I am fairly certain this is correct.) 

 

 

 

I would like to be very certain of this. I still wonder if someone could argue that the framing of the wording of on table reinforcements through the use of Artefacts or Psychic counted as moving for all purposes. I thought that translated into literally meaning we needed to treat such units as having moved their full movement range.

 

Don't get me wrong I want to believe this would work, I just think they put that wording around that kind of reinforcement mechanism to prevent this very thing. 

 

Specifically here's where I'm getting that 'I can't do this' sort of feeling:

 

 

 Q: What rules apply to units that are removed from the battlefield after deployment (via abilities, Stratagems or psychic powers), and are then set back up again on the battlefield?  A: If a rule or ability causes a unit to be removed from the battlefield and subsequently set back up, the following rules apply to that unit:

 

 

Among the answers:

 

2.  Models in that unit count as having moved a distance equal to their Move characteristic that turn (and so suffer the penalty to their hit rolls for moving and firing Heavy weapons). If the unit has a minimum Move characteristic, it counts as having moved its maximum Move characteristic.

 

 

- It just occurred to me that your intention might just be to get the Rubrics within 12" of an opponent using Warptime?

 

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

 

Post FAQ I feel like it -might- be worth painting and playing my second Magnus! (Sold the first one). 

 

Am I crazy? I thought he was a terrible idea, and now that snipers are everywhere, and mega "I win" Knight builds are reduced, I have to wonder if it just might be safe to try him out again? (I know Tau will still roast his feathers in T1 but still.)

[Raven1]

Knights haven't gone away they are too good for the imperium lists. I believe the shift will be to 2-3 smaller knights. That being said I would still be wary of bringing Magnus, if an army could kill the old faithful dominus castellan in T1-T2 Magnus is toast T1.

[Prot]

Knights haven't gone away they are too good for the imperium lists. I believe the shift will be to 2-3 smaller knights. That being said I would still be wary of bringing Magnus, if an army could kill the old faithful dominus castellan in T1-T2 Magnus is toast T1.

 

haha... no way did Knights go away. I didn't say that... In fact I'm certain we'll see more Triple Crusader lists. BUT... the day of a volcano cannon ripping Magnus apart in Turn 1.... dare I say... Might be over??? 

 

I like to have feedback though so if you guys think it's a crazy notion, I'd like to hear it.

 

The thing I've always said since we got the goat release codex is the result is it feels in a very confined space. I have never been big on Daemons but obviously I should be. My hope was the FAQ would give us some reason to try new stuff, or go back to old stuff. 

 

What about smaller models? I think Snipers are getting stupidly popular. Snipers of all kinds, not just Vindicares. I'm thinking this might justify me pulling out Exalted Sorcs more often. 

[Raven1]

Snipers getting stupid loose popular. I just played against 8 assassins. 3 culexus ants 2 vindicare ripping apart my HQs and making spells near impossible to cast. It was so much fun...

 

Its better that swiss army assassin is 2cp and not 1.

 

 

Bringing Magnus to the table. I'm not I've played a game where he doesn't get annihilated T1. He is a fancy paperweight most of time. I'm not sure switching out one large knight for 3 regular knights is going to change that much.

[WarriorFish]

Which answer do I need to give to see you paint another Magnus, Prot?

 

I've been pondering "big bads" a fair bit recently, not just because of my fresh new KoS but also Magnus (one day). I still feel that it can be very tough if your meta is one heavy on AT - which sometimes feels a long winded way of saying "has Knights in"

 

As Son outlines I think Rubrics are looking the happiest they have in a long while, which is great for those of us who want to focus on them. There are wider issues that I've not experienced that are more important however, such as the assassins, but obviously I can't add much there.

[Prot]

Well I just had this nasty game with my Black Legion vs a tournament style super shooty Dark Eldar. I did not face snipers per say but you guys who play competitively will know how character sniping goes when facing that kind of DE list with three flyers... you have to be exceptionally careful or they move, block and snipe.

 

So some observations... Magnus would not have lasted T1 ( I went second). The volume of Ravagers, and disrupters, and flyers were capable of taking out a Castellan in T1.

 

The table next to me was Tau vs GSC. Magnus might have survived T1 vs GSC but hard to say with bomb drive by and all those Genestealers zooming across the table.

 

The Tau was another no go for Magnus 2 Riptides and tons of the Heavy Suits built after a winning Tau tournament list.

 

That’s not even including a sniper based list. It doesn’t look good for any big models right now without at least done bodyguard mechanism.

[Sonoftherubric21]

Can someone explain to me why "snipers" are a big deal with Magnus in particular? 

 

I get the Assassin issue for sure because a Cuelexus will make us rip our hair out trying to cast.....but why the Snipers? Magnus is huge already and can't hide regardless. Or is it one particular unit I am missing when thinking about snipers? 

 

Interestingly I have never had Magnus get gimped on turn 1. It is possible the opponents are "playing nice" or the 4++ just puts in work, or I go first and put down a buff spell that makes Magnus really hard to nail... but I haven't really had that experience though I know people who have. I have a hard time believing something like Magnus is a "paperweight" just from my experience.... Though facing something like my Iron Warriors list which can nail a Castellan top of turn 1 might be an example of what most of you are talking about. 

 

If I came up against a very tough anti-air/tank ranged opponent I would probably take a Changeling as well given I also field daemon engines. That aura 6+ FNP helps more then you'd expect. 

[PiñaColada]

I agree, snipers wouldn't seem to be the biggest deal against Magnus IMO but maybe there's something I'm missing. Unless people are talking about the full on sniper spam list revolving around Guilliman, but to be honest I've never seen that list fielded anywhere except by my friend as a quirky list. For reference, that list is basically 60 sniper scouts with a few heavy weapons, 9 eliminators, a librarian, an ancient, 3 vindicares and G-man in the middle just enabling a crazy amount of mortal wounds being spammed.

Speaking about Magnus and those types of characters; how well does the Lord of Change hold up post point drops? This would be in a Thousand sons army for reference. Kairos looks almost strictly better but I don't like playing with named characters. I guess the big get with the LoC is that he can take a relic and you get to choose the warlord trait. So -1 to damage and the impossible robe should make him reasonably tanky, even if you don't go first. Then you couple this with the fact that <fly> is better again, and the castellan nerf and they might be pretty decent. The problem I guess I'm having (and this is just from looking at their datasheets mind you) is that I'm not sure if he'll deliver enough damage. He's decent in CC but against a dedicated CC army you'll probably want to stay away so at that point you're paying 280 points for 2-3 casts every psychic phase. And for him to be that durable he needs to be your warlord which in and out of itself can be a problem since he's targetable. Anyone has any experience running him, maybe not post-FAQ but at least post-CA 2018?

[Sonoftherubric21]

Speaking about Magnus and those types of characters; how well does the Lord of Change hold up post point drops? This would be in a Thousand sons army for reference. Kairos looks almost strictly better but I don't like playing with named characters. I guess the big get with the LoC is that he can take a relic and you get to choose the warlord trait. So -1 to damage and the impossible robe should make him reasonably tanky, even if you don't go first. Then you couple this with the fact that <fly> is better again, and the castellan nerf and they might be pretty decent. The problem I guess I'm having (and this is just from looking at their datasheets mind you) is that I'm not sure if he'll deliver enough damage. He's decent in CC but against a dedicated CC army you'll probably want to stay away so at that point you're paying 280 points for 2-3 casts every psychic phase. And for him to be that durable he needs to be your warlord which in and out of itself can be a problem since he's targetable. Anyone has any experience running him, maybe not post-FAQ but at least post-CA 2018?

 

I can only speak to a regular basic Greater Daemon. The Chicken has great casting, and the spell list is solid. I usually use him in my "monster mash" build, which is Magnus + 1 of each engine + some walkers/dreads/contemptor + Leviathan if applicable (depending on points). 

 

I toss in a changeling and the Greater daemon chicken with a single unit of brims/blues (20 man) for cheap troop slot daemon detachment. The changeling 6++ FNP puts in GREAT work in this list usually saving either Magnus or the Chicken a bracket + any of the engines that happen to be nearby. Within this list the Chicken does very well. I would also imagine Chicken + maggy would be a very solid core for a 2k list with incredible casting and 2 big boys to deal with, target saturation is the name of  the game this edition.