Baal Predator loadout?

[Commissar potato]

Hey everyone, just wondering what y’all like to put on your Baal preds. I personally prefer the Dakka version, as it can put out a crazy amount of heavybolter-type shots. I can’t seem to get the inferno version to work though. If you use it, what are some tips?

 

Thanks!

[Karhedron]

I agree, the Heavy flamer and even Inferno cannon seem very overpriced for what they bring to the table and are not even assault weapons. I agree that the Dakka build is best but I keep feeling that an Assault Cannon razorback is even better value for the points. The basic Predator chassis is just too expensive. It needs to be T8 IMHO like some of the other Rhino-variants or have some other advantage.

[Arkaniss]

Everyone loves a Baal dakka Pred loaded up to the max! :D For a Flamestorm Baal itself I usually run it barebones - just the turret (and Stormbolter if I have a spare couple of points) as I want it points efficient. Not having the Sponsons makes it a bit cheaper and less of a loss if it gets itself perished by being too close to the foe.

 

My main advice for actually using the Flamestorm Baal is that it needs support nearby - be it infantry/other Baals/Dreads/whatever - to work best. A lone Baal rushing up to the enemy lines for one good shot is easy to deal with. As part of a group of threats it's more likely to do better :)

[Commissar potato]

I’m looking for some good midrange Dakka for my bloody bois. How about Redemptor dreads with Gatling cannon? I feel like that would serve a similar purpose to the preds. What do ya think?

[Majkhel]

Redemptor

[Panzer]

Full Dakka Baal Pred is definitely the better of the options. Unfortunately it's still overcosted with other dakka sources we have available (especially since Primaris bring a lot of S5 AP-1). If it's just about having such kind of shooting looking into the full dakka Redemptor Dread or Repulsor is a good idea for sure but if it's about finding good use for the Baal Pred then just go with it.

The flamer Baal Pred is an awesome unit fluff-wise but unfortunately has multiple design flaws in 8th. One being that he can't advance&shoot with heavy flamer and the flamestorm cannon and the other is that 3 flamer, no matter how high the strength or AP is, still have only 3d6 shots and that's not enough to protect it from getting caught in melee once it's within 8" of the enemy.

 

 

 

Everyone loves a Baal dakka Pred loaded up to the max! For a Flamestorm Baal itself I usually run it barebones - just the turret (and Stormbolter if I have a spare couple of points) as I want it points efficient. Not having the Sponsons makes it a bit cheaper and less of a loss if it gets itself perished by being too close to the foe.

 

My main advice for actually using the Flamestorm Baal is that it needs support nearby - be it infantry/other Baals/Dreads/whatever - to work best. A lone Baal rushing up to the enemy lines for one good shot is easy to deal with. As part of a group of threats it's more likely to do better

 

Not giving it all the guns makes it less cost efficient though because the overcosted chassis would be distributed to less damage output. ;)

[Karhedron]

I’m looking for some good midrange Dakka for my bloody bois. How about Redemptor dreads with Gatling cannon? I feel like that would serve a similar purpose to the preds. What do ya think?

I think the Redemptor is pretty good following the price drop in Chapter Approved. It has a similar level of firepower to the Baal but is slightly more durable and can fight competently in melee. Downside is that it is not so fast. Go for both Gatling cannon options and take storm bolters IMHO.

 

Personally I have developed a fondness for Bolter Inceptors for my horde clearing needs. They are mobile, shooty and can be put in Reserve if necessary. You can redeploy them using "Upon Wings of Fire" if necessary and they have the FLY keyword meaning they can withdraw from combat and still fire at full effect.

[Karhedron]

Another option for maximum dakka is the lovely new BA Leviathan Dreanought from Forgeworld with dual storm cannon arrays. This thing has near Knight levels of firepower and durability while still benefiting from our buff auras and techmarine repairs.

 

[Panzer]

I love my Bolter Inceptors but they are pretty much a fire&forget unit in my games.

I can count on one hand in how many games they survived the following shooting phase since with their 18“ they are usually in range of most enemy units and a mobile unit with two Heavy Bolters per model has a huge bullseye over their head T5 or not. :D

[FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants]

What do people think about mixing weapons ie AC and HF or FSC and HB? Also magnetizing seems a good idea, to future proof your tank.

[Jolemai]

If it helps, some info can be found on the Baal Predator here:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/343614-unit-of-the-week-baal-predator/

 

The trouble with mixing the Baal as opposed to the other variants is that it's niche role becomes more niche.

 

For example, you want to blast forward to get into range for the flamestorm, which means your heavy bolters aren't shooting. It also lessens your overwatch potential as you will be assaulted at that range. Conversely, the heavy flamers increase the overwatch defense but it paired with the assault cannon, you have to move closer than you would if you had heavy bolters.

 

You're likely looking at screens or flanks. Objective sitting for a T7 tank isn't ideal either especially given how tanks don't get any cover saves by strict RAW.

[Majkhel]

To add to what Jole has said, when you mix loadouts, you have to move to get at least some of your guns in range. And this means hitting on 4+ for whatever non-flamer weapon you've chosen. Still better than a guardsman, but not ideal either.

[Jolemai]

But it is as it is; even a Whirlwind has to move sometimes because games are in a state of flux and it's rare things in the BA army can sit still all game. The key is to mitigate it where you can (i.e re-rolls).

[Commissar potato]

I was thinking about trying Either Baal predators or Redemptor dreadnoughts running up the field with Dante, then turn 2 dante could join the forward assault.

[Karhedron]

I was thinking about trying Either Baal predators or Redemptor dreadnoughts running up the field with Dante, then turn 2 dante could join the forward assault.

I would go for the Redemptors personally. 2 extra wounds each and slightly cheaper than the Baals. Plus if the situation warrants it they can keep moving up the field and hit things in melee. A Baal in melee is tied up, at least a Dread will stand a good chance of doing some damage to the enemy. The only real benefit of the Baal is speed.

[FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants]

Bit off topic for the thread, but what do people think of running dual LC Mortis dreadnoughts instead of quad LC predators? Seems you lose some mobility but you wouldn't have a degrading stat line which would mean firing at full accuracy until the bitter end. Also you could pop the WoA stratagem off, giving the dreadnought reroll 1's to itself and nearby units if no captain was close, and it would also perform in CC if :cuss hit the fan and you get charged, benefiting from RT too I might add.

[Panzer]

Bit off topic for the thread, but what do people think of running dual LC Mortis dreadnoughts instead of quad LC predators? Seems you lose some mobility but you wouldn't have a degrading stat line which would mean firing at full accuracy until the bitter end. Also you could pop the WoA stratagem off, giving the dreadnought reroll 1's to itself and nearby units if no captain was close, and it would also perform in CC if hit the fan and you get charged, benefiting from RT too I might add.

 

That's more than just a bit off topic considering this is about the Baal Predators which can't take Lascannons at all lol

 

But to give you an answer: Predators of any kind are bad and should feel bad. They are overcosted not just compared to other factions, they are also overcosted compared to other units we have ... like the Razorback for example. Losing mobility doesn't matter as you really don't need much mobility on a Lascannon platform, especially not if it means only hitting on 4+ due lack of Power of the Machine Spirit.