Best Codex for an all-Primaris army?

[GenerationTerrorist]

Hi guys. As per the title, what do you think is the best Codex (including DA, BA ans SW) for an all-Primaris army?

 

What reasons (fluff especially) do you have for this opinion?

 

I am essentially sitting on the following unpainted mass of grey plastic that I want to turn into a fully painted army by the end of the summer:

 

- Gravis Captain

- 2* Lieutenants

 

- 4*5 Intercessors

 

- 5 Reivers

- 1 Redemptor (easy build)

- 1 Primaris Ancient

 

- 2*3 Inceptors

 

- 2*5 (or 1*10) Hellblasters

 

I also have the Primaris half of Shadowspear to assemble.

 

Problem is that I am stuck on choosing a Chapter.

 

Please help a fellow Astartes decide who my Primarch shall be ☺

[Cleon]

Honestly I think right now it's the Blood Angels, as our 'chapter trait' helps mitigate the lack of a Primaris melee unit, but as soon as such a unit exists we'll probably tumble down the ranks.

 

Fluff wise the BA took massive losses (two companies gone even before the Tyranid attack on Baal) and were then rebuilt by the Primaris crusade, so almost certainly have pure Primaris formations running around.

[Ishagu]

I actually think it might be Death Watch?

 

They have access to good rules and great strats. The special issue ammo is really powerful.

[Lemondish]

Crimson Fists are a pretty solid Primaris only force given they can make use of two different Primaris focused Specialist Detachments. They also bring Primaris specific relics and rock a pretty compelling backstory as to why they're so heavy on Primaris.

 

When Snagrod's WAAAGH! hit Rynn's World, it was with a force unseen among Orks since the Second War for Armageddon. The Chapter recalled all of its forces to Rynn's World, in preparation for a defensive action against the oncoming Ork horde.

 

Tragedy struck when one of the planet's defensive missiles suffered a catastrophic failure. The weapon never made it out of the atmosphere, and instead crashed back into the Crimson Fists' fortress-monastery from which it had been fired. There, it detonated and in the course of the explosion also set off the structure's vast and ancient arsenal. Over 600 Marines simply evaporated.

 

What followed was an 18 month slog that saw the chapter fight back and survive against the Ork siege.

 

History seemed doomed to repeat itself when Rynn's World was struck by daemonic incursions during the Warp Storms that followed the birth of the Great Rift. The chapter had managed to rebuild to half strength, but they were once again hopelessly outnumbered. When Guilliman's Indomitus Crusade arrived, the Crimson Fists were grateful for the arrival of Primaris Space Marines bearing their own heraldry.

 

The Fists became one of the first recipients of Primaris marines and the means to make them, and they were finally able to rebuild their decimated Chapter.

[Guest Triszin]

I actually think it might be Death Watch?

 

They have access to good rules and great strats. The special issue ammo is really powerful.

deathwatch imho.

 

the mixed squads fixes some of the issues with single types

[Lemondish]

 

 

I actually think it might be Death Watch?

 

They have access to good rules and great strats. The special issue ammo is really powerful.

deathwatch imho.

 

the mixed squads fixes some of the issues with single types

This is true, but you also won't be able to use the Shadowspear stuff with DW just yet.

[Dracos]

Hi guys . . . . I am essentially sitting on the following unpainted mass of grey plastic that I want to turn into a fully painted army by the end of the summer:

Whichever color scheme excites you the most. Everything else is malleable through DIY Chapter creation if needed. :) after color, I’d go by what narrative you appreciate he most. Choose an army by its rules and you run with the same problems of the Black Templars.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I actually think it might be Death Watch?

They have access to good rules and great strats. The special issue ammo is really powerful.

Deathwatch is a poor choice all Primaris because they don’t have storm shields.

 

There’s lot of solid chapters. I’d play test the ones you find appealing. I rate Ultramarines, Crimson Fists and Raven Guard as really good.

[Kallas]

Deathwatch is a poor choice all Primaris because they don’t have storm shields.

That's a pointless statement when talking about a Primaris-only army, as the only Storm Shields available are the Honour Guard.

 

Deathwatch Primaris are pretty potent as they do have some good synergies in the Intercessor squad, and with SIA. Main problem is that they become more expensive than they already are; and they're not Veterans, but that's not their fault.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

From my experience playing Primaris for Deathwatch they die to a stiff breeze as soon as the enemy targets them. Veteran squads can take Storm Shields for 2 points each, Terminators and bikers to tank wounds. On paper they look good but not in practice. Which Primaris Honor Guard are you referring to here ? I’m not aware of any .

[Kallas]

From my experience playing Primaris for Deathwatch they die to a stiff breeze as soon as the enemy targets them. Veteran squads can take Storm Shields for 2 points each, Terminators and bikers to tank wounds. On paper they look good but not in practice. Which Primaris Honor Guard are you referring to here ? I’m not aware of any .

You missed my point: this thread is about a pure Primaris army.

 

There are no Veterans with Storm Shields.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

You missed my point... if you’re going to run DW then Veterans are the superior choice. And what is the Primaris Honor Guard unit ?

[Kallas]

You missed my point... if you’re going to run DW then Veterans are the superior choice.

Veterans might be superior, but DW Primaris aren't bad. But Veterans aren't an option so stop bringing them up.

 

And what is the Primaris Honor Guard unit ?

It came out with Primaris Calgar, the two-man unit. It's not available to Deathwatch.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Don’t tell me what to do... it’s a valid point. To optimize an army you bring the best units. And I don’t even know why you bothered mentioning a unit not available to DW.

[Kallas]

Don’t tell me what to do... it’s a valid point. To optimize an army you bring the best units. And I don’t even know why you bothered mentioning a unit not available to DW.

You're talking about a unit that the thread is EXPRESSLY against taking. It might be optimal for the Codex, but that's not the point, so your point is NOT valid.

 

As for the Honour Guard mention, it's literally as relevant as your Veterans comments in a thread about an "all-Primaris army."

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

My point is their are better factions for Primaris so no you’re wrong. If there are better factions, which there, then focus on those.

 

And so by your logic it’s okay for you but not me - that’s hypocritical.

[Kallas]

My point is their are better factions for Primaris so no you’re wrong. If there are better factions, which there, then focus on those.

I strongly disagree that DW Primaris aren't worthwhile. In fact I'd say that there are few that compete with them in a straight up comparison; there are some Specialist Detachments that are solid (eg, Liberators and Indomitus Crusaders) but as far as raw Primaris are concerned Deathwatch bring the best.

 

SIA is a pretty reasonable cost for Intercessors; Mixed Units works very well, as it not only helps bring more Troops to the table, it gives multiple different benefits for the different specialist units (eg, Fall Back and Shoot for those Intercessors/Hellblasters with an Inceptor).

 

What are the Chapters you think are better, and why? BA are certainly a decent pick because of the Red Thirst and things like the Standard of Sacrifice.

[Gederas]

I'm not even gonna comment on the shenanigans above, but bringing up an option that doesn't exist for Primaris (outside of an Ultramarines-only unit) when saying Deathwatch Primaris are bad is really, really silly.

 

Now, to answer the original question:

Hi guys. As per the title, what do you think is the best Codex (including DA, BA ans SW) for an all-Primaris army?

What reasons (fluff especially) do you have for this opinion?

I am essentially sitting on the following unpainted mass of grey plastic that I want to turn into a fully painted army by the end of the summer:

- Gravis Captain
- 2* Lieutenants

- 4*5 Intercessors

- 5 Reivers
- 1 Redemptor (easy build)
- 1 Primaris Ancient

- 2*3 Inceptors

- 2*5 (or 1*10) Hellblasters

I also have the Primaris half of Shadowspear to assemble.

Problem is that I am stuck on choosing a Chapter.

Please help a fellow Astartes decide who my Primarch shall be ☺

After having played three of the six Marine codices that allow for Primaris, and not being a WAAC fool, the best Codices for Primaris in my opinion are Dark Angels and Deathwatch.

 

Dark Angels because the Stratagems, combined with the Chapter Tactic is amazing. Because Primaris generally seem to go towards a gunline-based army, which the Dark Angels Chapter Tactic is built specifically for. Yes, Dark Angels likes their named characters, but you don't need any of the named characters to win games. I've done it several times. Like, they even have a Stratagem that allows the to Fall Back and fire without any penalties.

 

Also: Weapons of the Dark Age + Hellblasters (especially in Rapid-Fire Range) + Re-roll Hits of 1 if they don't move + Lieutenant = Bye bye anything that doesn't have an Invulnerable Save and/or 2+ armour. Even not overcharged, that's still 2 damage each shot, but overcharged it's 3. Additionally, Weapons from the Dark Age is also SCARY on Plasma Inceptors because they become some of the deadliest assassination units in the game because they're using what amounts to an Plasma Cannon that's an Assault Weapon instead of Heavy.

 

Deathwatch because Special-Issue Ammunition is really, really good. Especially when combined with Primaris' better ranges on their weapons. And the mixed squads can shore up a lot of the Primaris' weaknesses. Also: You can Teleport them into battle instead of having to use Repulsors all the time to get them places.

 

Dark Angels have the edge because they can use ALL of what you listed, whereas Deathwatch (for now) cannot use the Gravis Captain, Lieutenants, Ancient and Shadowspear. If the multipart kit comes out for the Shadowspear stuff and a multi-part Gravis Captain comes out, I could see Deathwatch getting access to them. Ancient and Lieutenant, not so much. Well, the Lieutenants can be made into Deathwatch Intercessor Sergeants if put onto 32mm bases.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I didn’t say they are bad... Veterans are clearly a superior choice. I’m not suggesting playing Veterans either. My point is pick a faction where Primaris are the stronger choice. You can always go with two detachments to work in some Deathwatch to cherry come units and take advantage of their strengths.

 

Ultramarines, Crimson Fists and Raven Guard I believe are the best overall choices plus they all have specialist detachments in Vigilus.

[Ishagu]

The Ultramarines detachment in Vigilus is strictly for classic Astartes and not Primaris, unfortunately :-(

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Indomnitus Crusaders. It’s not Ultramarines specific but good.

[Kallas]

My point is pick a faction where Primaris are the stronger choice.

 

If one is discounting all non-Primaris options (as the OP is in this thread) then it's irrelevant if Primaris are better/worse than non-Primaris. Deathwatch Primaris bring some good utility, period.

 

You can always go with two detachments to work in some Deathwatch to cherry come units and take advantage of their strengths.

 

That's definitely a good option. There's no reason to necessarily limit oneself to a single Chapter; Deathwatch especially is an easy one to make secondary units fit in with a primary Chapter force. Hell, you don't even need to go full Deathwatch colour scheme, if you don't want - you can easily just paint them black with the normal Chapter symbol, slap on some Bolter add-ons for weapon differentiation and you're golden!

[Ishagu]

I feel that Deathwatch get around some Primaris issues by allowing various units including Dreadnoughts to teleport in, and by greatly increasing the damage output of even the most basic infantry units like Intercessors. I wouldn't say Veterans are particularly Durable, personally, even with a Storm Shield. They have a single wound and still fail 33% of all saves, keep in mind there are units that could shoot/hit them 100+ times. They do offer a nice defence against high AP, low number of shot weapons, however those weapons don't generally target infantry.

 

You'll need to hit critical mass of units in order to make the list more durable. 5 Primaris will die quite easily but 40/50 or more become very durable, especially if you add a few vehicles into the list. 2 Repulsors are useful, or alternatively 3 Teleporting Redemptor Dreadnoughts, just as an example.

 

If you love plasma Dark Angels do it best. They have some great synergy with units within the book but they require non-primaris units to get the most out of what makes them unique. I'm careful to recommend various things as the topic specifically asks for an all Primaris army.

 

Others have mentioned Raven Guard and Ultramarines. Those work well too.

[Lemondish]

You missed my point... if you’re going to run DW then Veterans are the superior choice. And what is the Primaris Honor Guard unit ?

That's not the point of the thread. Don't compare DW Primaris with DW Veterans.

 

Instead compare DW Primaris with BA Primaris, because this discussion is for a Primaris only force.

[Dracos]

Come on guys. It looks like everyone is agreeing with the end result (advice) just different thought processes on how to get there.

 

I’m committed to my Warhawks as a Raven Guard successor but I have enough Inceptors and Hellblasters I could be talked into a Dark Angel proxy pretty easy with all the plasma benefits from that Chapter. Really hoping Primaris get there own Codex or at least stratagems in the next Vanillas (read Ultra :() Marine book