State of Black Templars

[Smirnov]

I'm slowly getting my mind to trying to pick WH40K up again. I've fallen out of the game with folding of BT codex... I kinda felt betrayed by GW or whatever. Anyway, I've been thinking of maybe making a return. What's the current state of Templars compared to, ay, 6th edition? I've heard a lot has changed for Space Marines? (I know about primaris and stuff ofc)

 

(sweet Sigismund, this userpic of mine, I haven't seen it in ages)

[Marshal Valkenhayn]

I personally don't think the feeling of betrayal is going to be any less stark if you jump back in right now. We are the worst to second worst faction of marines to play pure, even if you play Primaris, which I don't. We really feel the lack of deny and utility for not having librarians, and it feels bad to see UM get bumped over, and over, and over. The only good thing is that solidarity with other chapters is up, so if you have a local friend who plays Salamanders, Ravenguard, etc you are going to have someone decent to get a beer with.

 

That out of the way, we still have Crusader squads, we still have the EC (though he'll get merced by any other HQ designed for melee, even with his rules), and we've gotten a little bone throne to us in Vigilus to buff our Company vets and give us proper Sword Brothers. The issue being there that the detachment costs CP to use, and the special abilities it grants also cost CP to use. In the end it usually doesn't turn out to be worth it when you can use the generic strategems like Counter Strike and Fight Again to much greater effect. The only semi-effective Templar list I know of is Black Tide crusader spam.

 

If you want to get back into the game because you love Templars and feel like fighting it out despite GW spitting in our face, we'd love to have you back. We're still a strong community and still supporting one another where we can. The guys at my local hobby shop even joined the call for a Templar codex during the survey. But if you want to get back into the game because you like the idea of melee marines and kicking psychers in the head? Hard pass. Consider playing Blood Angels, they're doing better than us. We are not on the winning team of late, but we're still here.

[TheForgottenAngel]

I’d do it brother! Black templars have regained some of their character via vigilus and it’s always good to add another crusade to the chapter! Check out implausiblenature blog. Lots of good info on Black Templars tactics and he’ll be diving into tactics more too!

[Smirnov]

Have we got any special rules besides Vigilus detachment? And any rumors about index astertes or we're the new salamanders?

[Marshal Reinhard]

Currently, we're just waiting to see if we can get that bone thrown our way any time soon. Vigilus were some neat scraps, but ultimately just scraps.

 

While I do think we'll get something eventually, it remains to be seen wether it'll be a worthwhile something. But I'm here regardless.

[Smirnov]

...so Iron Hands 2.0 then but with butchered lore. Oh wait...

I got the picture, thanks Guess I'll see where it all gets me )

 

On a side note, am I the only one who can't load impalusible nature? It times out every time

[Marshal Laeroth]

Have we got any special rules besides Vigilus detachment? And any rumors about index astertes or we're the new salamanders?

 

On a side note, am I the only one who can't load impalusible nature? It times out every time

 

There are rumors about some content being released for us this summer, including some new minis, but I would treat it just as that...rumors that are heavily salted.  Apparently a GM spilled the beans about upcoming releases.

 

I tried on a couple different devices and Implausible Nature seems to be working for me.  What browser are you using?

[Smirnov]

 

Have we got any special rules besides Vigilus detachment? And any rumors about index astertes or we're the new salamanders?

 

On a side note, am I the only one who can't load impalusible nature? It times out every time

 

There are rumors about some content being released for us this summer, including some new minis, but I would treat it just as that...rumors that are heavily salted.  Apparently a GM spilled the beans about upcoming releases.

 

I tried on a couple different devices and Implausible Nature seems to be working for me.  What browser are you using?

 

I expect something in the upcoming Apocalypse - at least back in 6th we were pretty well representet in Apoc.

 

I usually run Firefox and also tried Chrome mobile. Maybe it has to do something with me being in Russia and our web watchdog banning all internet. Will try a proxy

[Marshal Laeroth]

 

 

Have we got any special rules besides Vigilus detachment? And any rumors about index astertes or we're the new salamanders?

 

On a side note, am I the only one who can't load impalusible nature? It times out every time

 

There are rumors about some content being released for us this summer, including some new minis, but I would treat it just as that...rumors that are heavily salted.  Apparently a GM spilled the beans about upcoming releases.

 

I tried on a couple different devices and Implausible Nature seems to be working for me.  What browser are you using?

 

I expect something in the upcoming Apocalypse - at least back in 6th we were pretty well representet in Apoc.

 

Usually running Firefox also tried Chrome mobile. Maybe it has to do something with me being in Russia nd our watchdog banning ll internet. Will try a proxy

 

 

Supposedly, it is like a mini-dex, not related to Apocalypse.  However, again, heavily salt this since I simply saw this on Facebook by a random person I am not familiar with.  I am not sure about the credibility of this person and, if I am being honest, I typically get a heads up about BT related content being worked on at GW from my own contacts...and I have not heard anything about a summer BT release.

 

What?  Russia hates me?  Sadness.  Haha.  In all seriousness though, if you can't get it after using a proxy, I will reach out to my host and see if there is an issue on their end.

[Schlitzaf]

Also in regards to our treatment this edition? Honeslty, we are actually quite well off. We have a superb set of special characters especially the Emperor’s Champion. Our Crusader squads remain a solid unit and best tactical squad variant. If we get a point’s reduction on Neophytes it’s the gravy train.

 

Our stratagem, actually useful and one of the stronger ones in the game. No more feeling awful when someone Warp Times, Dooms, or Mental Onslaught. Our chapter tactic not great. But having a 50% chance to succeed a deep strike charge and no 4”-7” “I feel bad failing this charge” because of our rerolls.

 

Our warlord trait is....the better left unsaid. It’s good for trolling. Our relic is simply solid, gives you a lot more room to maneuver that you otherwise wouldn’t have.

 

Vigilus detachment? It wasn’t scraps, to reiterate we have a comparable or as good as Slamganius via its warlord trait. It’s relic isn’t amazing but it has its place (see it as 1CP smite if you have 2 relics). Suffer Not is simply awesome. And uphold....well no one ever took its vow anyways.

 

So long story short? This best place we have been in sense fifth edition.

[Smirnov]

What?  Russia hates me?  Sadness.  Haha.  In all seriousness though, if you can't get it after using a proxy, I will reach out to my host and see if there is an issue on their end.

 

Yup, VPN worked just fine. Weird server bans are weird. You are probably hosted on Amazon cloud, they were hit pretty hard

[Marshal Valkenhayn]

Our strategem is only good if we're playing soup and have some other way of denying on top of the 4+, otherwise it's a 50 percent chance to stop one of many bad options that costs a cP. IE, laughably inadequate. Which would you rather stop, the Ork about to give that 30 man blob an extra 1 attack a piece, or the ork about to Da Jump a unit of heavies into your face? You only get one. Choose wisely, and if it fails, well, you can spend anothe rCP to reroll it and have another 50 percent chance to fail, or you can cut your losses and be completely ineffective. When you get into the meat of denying against Nurgle armies it gets really tricky, because they have a habit of giving you nothing but bad options.

 

Crusader squads are more tactically flexible than tactical squads. They are also more point efficient by a tiny degree. But tactical squads are an awful bar to measure yourself against. You have to play your crusaders like guard. Either put them exactly where they are needed with all the help in the world piled on top, or spam the hell out of them. Anything else will see you struggling to make their points back. 

 

The Emperor's champion will kill any HQ that isn't kitted out to be a melee monster. but if that HQ is melee Nurgle, , melee Eldar, or even just a smash captain, it'll wreck him without much trouble. He's a fun unit to field, but having to transport him around and his weapon doing d3 damage really hurts his effectiveness. I say this as someone who fields an EC in every game I play, no exceptions. i love the model and the theme, but power creep has made it difficult for him to do his actual job. He's better used trimming the edges of support characters, not challenging the biggest scariest guy and going for throat. Compare his raw damage output to someone like Skulltaker and you start to realize just how far we're falling behind. Skulltaker hits so much harder, and the only down side is he's 10 points more expensive and gets a 3+ 5++ instead of a 2+ 4++.

 

Vigilus is a joke. We have to pay 1 CP to get what Imperor's Spears get inately, and even then only for a single character. We still aren't nearly as efficient as a Blood Angels smash captain, and we probably wont' ever be. 2 CP is too expensive for +1 attack and reroll wounds unless you're playing soup with a CP battery, or Black Tide, which I've mentioned is probably the only real way to go. It's almost always better to save those CP for interrupting combat, fighting a final time with a character,  or fighting again. I'd say that I find a place to sneak in the 2 CP strategem maybe one in four games, but my local meta is pretty stiff and I'm usually fighting uphill battles.

 

In short, there are ghosts of good ideas, and hints of flavor in the Black Templars. But nothign to be excited over. even our coolest things, IE, EC, are way out of date and struggling to match their competition. I'm not saying this just because I'm bitter. I want so hard to be happy with what I'm working with. But these days I feel so much more satisfied when I put my Khorne Daemons on the table rather than my BT, and Khorne Daemons aren't exactly top of the pack either. But at least they still feel like they're Khorne. Playing BT feels more like giving my opponent a handicap.

[Closet Skeleton]

Not having librarians is pretty minor, lots of marine players don't bother with them anyway.

 

The Champion of Humanity Warlord trait combined with the shield eternal and a thunder hammer will give you an okay main codex smash captain, he just can't deal with those non-character vehicles and monsters that seem less and less common.

 

Its the reliance on special characters to get above average melee power that keeps my Black Templars on the shelf (and those two characters basically give what Blood Angels get from Corbulo on his own). Crusader mounted Crusader squads still being in the 500 point range isn't exactly playable either.