Helias_Tancred Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 If you own the recent coffee table picture book Visions of Heresy that came out last year .... go to the part about the Blood Angels and the Fear to Tread part. Wow. What a screw-up. Did anyone bother editing that? Or did they just copy and pace for the text for the previous Visions of Heresy? In summary Sanguinius was laid low by Kha'Banda, his legion went nuts and killed everything including sending Ky'riss back to the warp! Sanguinius finally woke and had trouble walking at first because his legs were so damaged and still recovering. I read this section the other day and immediately felt ripped off lol. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 It's old fluff. If anything, Fear to Tread messed with it. It was one of the contrived changes and moments in the book that made me think poorly of it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342334 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xisor Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 To be very (unnecessarily; apologies to Jim Swallow!) snarky, Fear To Tread screwed up Fear To Tread. :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342383 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 Every year when Blood Angels end up in the spotlight, be it during the Heresy, or with stuff like Shield of Baal, Dante, The Devastation of Baal etc, I feel like I should re-read Fear to Tread to give it another shake. Then I remember the disappointment from my original read, and the anger I felt at the re-read I did months later, and I am dissuaded from giving it the time of day. ...I'd rather re-read the much-maligned Battle for the Abyss. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342550 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helias_Tancred Posted July 6, 2019 Author Share Posted July 6, 2019 I figured this may have been the case, that the original part in the Visions of Heresy books over the years were written before Fear to Tread. That's fine and all but that's some super lazy-arse editing work by GW not to update it! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342652 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarvek Val Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 I have one of the older versions of Visions of Heresy, I must have gotten it at least four years ago. There were definitely some continuity errors throughout the piece that clashed with novels in the Horus Heresy series, but I can't say I was much bothered by them. I bought Visions of Heresy for the artworks, which I think were well worth the price - the sketches by John Blanche and all of the pieces by Sam Wood especially blew me away. Perhaps I made the purchase with different expectations, but I didn't buy VoH for a stunning narrative or precise, factual blow-by-blow of the heresy I agree that the newer editions could certainly benefit from revisions, but the real draw of the purchase should surely be the expansive artwork contained within. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342683 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xisor Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 I figured this may have been the case, that the original part in the Visions of Heresy books over the years were written before Fear to Tread. That's fine and all but that's some super lazy-arse editing work by GW not to update it! Or super-lazy work on Jim/BL-Editor's part not to make FTT match the original. Or super-lazy work on the reader's part not to reconcile two distinctly things in their own head. Or... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342767 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel_of_Blood Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 Every year when Blood Angels end up in the spotlight, be it during the Heresy, or with stuff like Shield of Baal, Dante, The Devastation of Baal etc, I feel like I should re-read Fear to Tread to give it another shake. Then I remember the disappointment from my original read, and the anger I felt at the re-read I did months later, and I am dissuaded from giving it the time of day. ...I'd rather re-read the much-maligned Battle for the Abyss. I at least enjoyed Mhotep and Skraal in BftA for what it's worth, along with the :cusse. Where as Fear to Tread was just....awful in every conceivable way. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342807 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 I figured this may have been the case, that the original part in the Visions of Heresy books over the years were written before Fear to Tread. That's fine and all but that's some super lazy-arse editing work by GW not to update it! Or super-lazy work on Jim/BL-Editor's part not to make FTT match the original. Or super-lazy work on the reader's part not to reconcile two distinctly things in their own head. Or... Or maybe the editor thought that the Fear to Tread version was weak as well, so they kept the original Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5342837 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carach Posted July 7, 2019 Share Posted July 7, 2019 ...I'd rather re-read the much-maligned Battle for the Abyss. true dat. it is still better than VL though thanks to at least a decently dark and foreboding beginning Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5343214 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriegsmacht Posted July 8, 2019 Share Posted July 8, 2019 I might be in the minority but I enjoyed reading Fear to Tread. I think it's because I didn't know a lot about the lore behind the setting of the novel so I didn't have a bad reaction to any changes made. Probably because I didn't know of any changes. lol Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5343524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted July 8, 2019 Share Posted July 8, 2019 Fear to Tread screws up Fear to Tread Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5343553 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angel_of_Blood Posted July 8, 2019 Share Posted July 8, 2019 I might be in the minority but I enjoyed reading Fear to Tread. I think it's because I didn't know a lot about the lore behind the setting of the novel so I didn't have a bad reaction to any changes made. Probably because I didn't know of any changes. lol Oh it's nothing to do with changes It's just awful. Boring, bland and one dimensional characters. The whole cheesy as :cuss planet coming to life, and them being attacked by lampposts. Added exactly zero character to the Blood Angels legion, unlike Scars, Know No Fear, First Heretic, Legion, Prospero Burns etc etc. Yeah, just nothing redeeming about it at all. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5343827 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted July 8, 2019 Share Posted July 8, 2019 The most infuriating part to me was how whimpy, wet blanket-ish the greater daemons were. I did not feel an ounce of dread from them. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5343865 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kriegsmacht Posted July 8, 2019 Share Posted July 8, 2019 Wonder if Fear to Tread might have benefited from the Horror line of books Black Library has been releasing. I liked the scene where one of the ships just disappears in the darkness and never returns. Maybe if the book was more like that instead of the big battle at the end it would have been more interesting. Just my 2 cents...which don't mean since my country doesn't have cents anymore. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344127 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roomsky Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 I do genuinely think that Fear to Tread's greatest weakness is dropping the ball on expectations (And being at least 100 pages too long). Kriegsmacht isn't the first person less familiar with that lore / the Blood Angels I've heard praise the book, hell, when I first read it I didn't know anything about Signus or the IXth, and I liked it quite a bit. But you just come out of it with so little, the Angels are barely defined, I only recognized the cast on a re-read because they get more character later. The story changes that aren't Erebus and Horus stepping each other's toes don't really add anything either. Changing the beats from Sanguinius getting revenge on Terra to Sanguinius slapping Ka'Bandha around again on Terra is such a mind-boggling decision; Kyriss would have made a perfectly serviceable final boss. I do, however, maintain that the epilogue is great. Oy Kriegsmacht, don't mislead the masses. Just because we don't have pennies doesn't mean we don't have conceptual cents. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344182 Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 "Added exactly zero character to the Blood Angels legion, unlike Scars, Know No Fear, First Heretic, Legion, Prospero Burns etc etc." "how whimpy, wet blanket-ish the greater daemons were" "the Angels are barely defined, I only recognized the cast on a re-read because they get more character later" It didn't help that I went into the book shortly after reading a 10/10 shill review Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344184 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Carnelian Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 Still think Fear to Tread is fine. It simply suffers from sharing a series with Scars, Know No Fear, The First Heretic, etc. The changes it makes are inoffensive in my eyes but I also acknowledge that Sanguinius has no real purpose at Terra now except his own death. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344406 Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted July 9, 2019 Share Posted July 9, 2019 Agreed in that Fear to Tread is a serviceable albeit utterly lacklustre novel. It's not atrocious. But compared with the actually good legion -building novels, it really suffers. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344414 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xisor Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 Yeah - I've got to echo those sentiments. FTT isn't an actually bad or unenjoyable book - it's fairly serviceable and has some lovely bits to it. (I even quite enjoyed the whole planets coming alive bit. Very David Annandale from not-Annandale-people.) As others say, the main 'issue' with the novel - and it's close to one of those annoying 'the problem with This Book is that it isn't a completely different book' complaints - remains that it's a bit boring. Not in terms of pace or plot - that's fine. (Length is a sort of fair consideration, but usually long/short/medium/just-right doesn't bother me.) Instead, it's that the characters are a bit faceless, that the Legion and enemies are a bit faceless, the supporting cast aren't up to much, and the likes of Raldoron isn't good 'epic' boring (cref: many of Chris Wraight's 'boring' characters [e.g. Ludwig Schwarzhelm]), but just... ??? Which is a shame, as Jim Swallow can manage to do 'very light', almost non-existent world building really well. (See Flight of the Eisenstein - ostensibly almost no flesh, let alone bones, to the Death Guard& their characters - yet a deeply intense, well-liked & memorable book.) So that leaves FTT in a nuisance position. I think the contrast with Battle for the Abyss is a great one - both similarly questionable stories that slightly puncture setups that could have been elevated for elsewhere in the setting, both have deep problems with the main protagonists and antagonists being thoroughly forgettable, but also plainly show a serviceable synopsis with some tremendous scenes in amongst it all. The thematic & wider contributions to the team-project of the Horus Heresy are a touch messy in both cases, but they both have strong elements to them. Dropped balls, so to speak. (Not adolescence; sporting metaphor.) And sadly, Battle for the Abyss has the benefit of the early-Heresy rockstars of Skraal and Mhotep (and to a lesser extent: Brynngar), amongst a few other relatively descriptive incidental characters. FTT, on the other hand, suffers as the only character of much note was Amit, and even then, he had no-one (character-wise) of interest to interact with. Skraal/Mhotep at least had Mhotep/Skraal. (& Brynngar.) (But despite all that, both BftA and FTT sit massively higher in my esteem than several other HH misjudged contributions. And even then, they're all perfectly interesting and entertaining reads. I'm just fussy.) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344830 Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 "FTT, on the other hand, suffers as the only character of much note was Amit, and even then, he had no-one (character-wise) of interest to interact with." What a missed opportunity for some great interaction between Amit and the SW guy (Redknife IIRC) Also, Malevolence injects Custodes into Signus, but it strikes me as inconsistent with how Fear to Tread never mentions them, but then I suppose that's like the SoH at Prospero Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344970 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluntblade Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 At least the SoH were out of side of those books' POV characters, and on reasonable grounds. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5344984 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 Those changes FW has been doing with injecting force x and y into conflicts that never needed them seriously bugged me from the start, and is part of the reason why I can't be bothered to read the black books. As for Amit, that, too, I felt was diminished by Amit being handled better by Andy Smillie. Flesh of Cretacia released in November 2012, only a few months after Fear to Tread, and elevated Amit massively, with Smillie's Heresy work putting a ribbon on events pre- and post-Signus, despite only writing short stories and audio scripts for him. It was an awesome example of one of the best-written characters in Fear to Tread still being written poorly compared to what another author did with the same dude. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5345013 Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluntblade Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 How come Smilie never did a novel? I haven't read any of his work but it seems to be respected. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5345076 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Lunkhead Posted July 10, 2019 Share Posted July 10, 2019 =][= This topic is getting off track..... Let's refocus please =][= Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/356978-visions-of-heresy-screws-up-the-fear-to-tread-part/#findComment-5345104 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.