Are Ravenwing bikes any good?

[SnakeChisler]

Ad-mech have an ability to have all units in cover whether they are or not, it's very annoying if you don't have ignores cover

[Maxamato]

Ah, that was it!

I had thought you mean a DA/RW rule.

[shabbadoo]

In reviewing all things Ravenwing, I noticed something I hadn't before: what were they smoking when they decided to stat out the Sword of Caliban to be roughly equivalent to (or better than) every weapon in the armory? So much for the "vaunted" capabilities of our character's unique weapons.   With Speed of the Raven, Ravenwing Champions have a maximum charge range of up to 33" (28" on average), and a 38" range with their plasma talons. Nasty! For a bit more than 100 points, Ravenwing Champions can do some real damage! Pretty much an automatic inclusion for any Ravenwing force.

[Grand Master Raziel]

In reviewing all things Ravenwing, I noticed something I hadn't before: what were they smoking when they decided to stat out the Sword of Caliban to be roughly equivalent to (or better than) every weapon in the armory? So much for the "vaunted" capabilities of our character's unique weapons.   With Speed of the Raven, Ravenwing Champions have a maximum charge range of up to 33" (28" on average), and a 38" range with their plasma talons. Nasty! For a bit more than 100 points, Ravenwing Champions can do some real damage! Pretty much an automatic inclusion for any Ravenwing force.

I don't think so. He's only got 3 attacks, doesn't have an invulnerable save, and is only T5. He's not going to do much that a Talonmaster you're going to take anyway can't already do as well or better, given a Heavenfall blade or a Monster Slayer of Caliban.

 

Also, all of the support Ravenwing characters suffer from having been lumped into the Ravenwing Knights box set, obliging GW to hang plasma talons on them, which jacks up their price. If I take one of those characters, it's for the support role they play, not for the slight firepower boost the plasma talons add - which actually winds up being a net loss, because the cost of one of those characters is the equivalent of 2 Black Knights. The plasma talons on characters are a mixed blessing, since they tempt the player to overcharge them, which can result in the loss of a pricey character. Plus, they give up Headhunter points, and are much easier to pin down and kill than the speeder characters. In short, they're overpriced liabilities. If we could get them without the plasma talons and pay prices closer to the costs of the equivalent Greenwing characters, then they might occasionally see use. Also, the standard bearer in particular is kind of useless - nothing the Ravenwing have is sufficiently fighty to make 100ish points for +1 attack in close combat per model an attractive option.

[shabbadoo]

Yeah, the Ravenwing Ancient kinda sucks. As to the Champion, Str 7, AP -3, D D3 on a WS 2+ and Att 3 (with re-rolls against characters) model is pretty nasty considering he can be in the enemy's face in one turn. The Talon Master's basic power sword is not all that threatening, even on an Att 4 model that re-rolls to wound. His bubbles are the main thing, as otherwise one can get two regular RW Land Speeders for 24 points less than a Talon Master, which is twice the number of wounds to take down. As you say, the same kinda goes for the RW Champion too. Proper use is [usually] the only thing than makes quality outshine quantity.

[Grand Master Raziel]

Shock Assault may put another spin on the Ravenwing Champion and Ancient. 4 attacks on the charge starts to look pretty impressive with the Champion's stats. You can probably realistically expect him to put 6 wounds on a T6 or less target in one turn, maybe a couple of more if he can hit them with his plasma talons first. I figure he's kind of a 100pt missile though. Point him at something, send him forth to kill it, and don't expect to get much more use out of him after that. And he's really apt to give up a Headhunter point too, so it better be worth it. Plus he doesn't fly, so he can be move blocked.

The Ancient, on the other hand... You've got 2 attacks per model from RW Bikes with chainswords and from BKs. +1 from the Ancient and +1 from Shock Assault...That's starting to look pretty solid. 

[Hellunder]

If our chaplains get the same litanies as space marines we can also give our vanilla bikers +1 to wound in shooting if shooting at the closest units. Pair that with all the CC attacks and fury of the lion and each bike can output 8 S5 attacks/turn. I think running big blobs of these can really do some damage even to T8 vehicles then.

[Guest MistaGav]

Where and how are you getting 8 attacks each turn?

[Hellunder]

A Ravenwing bike shoots 4 shots, and then charges next to a ravenwing ancient. That will be a total of 8 attacks per bike per turn. Unfortunately the update for Dark Angels was just released and our chaplains get nothing.

[Guest MistaGav]

Ah ok you were combining the two I thought you meant 8 CC attacks! Yes I've just read the update and it's a shame. Maybe we will get our own doctrines and Litanies in a 2.0 codex as the -1ap on boltguns would be a great boost for RW & Scout bikes too.

[dice4thedicegod]

Yeah, the Ravenwing Ancient kinda sucks. As to the Champion, Str 7, AP -3, D D3 on a WS 2+ and Att 3 (with re-rolls against characters) model is pretty nasty considering he can be in the enemy's face in one turn. The Talon Master's basic power sword is not all that threatening, even on an Att 4 model that re-rolls to wound. His bubbles are the main thing, as otherwise one can get two regular RW Land Speeders for 24 points less than a Talon Master, which is twice the number of wounds to take down. As you say, the same kinda goes for the RW Champion too. Proper use is [usually] the only thing than makes quality outshine quantity.

I was thinking that the talonmaster would be an obvious choice for a heavenfall blade - making him a real beast in combat. Thinking of trying to fit in him, sammael and a few bikes as a mobile fire/melee base.

 

Keep getting new ideas on this thread. I really need to investigate the Ravenwing medic.