DA 8.5 Codex wishlisting

[palin2222]

Honestly I would be happy with having access to Thunderfire Cannons

[Angel of Solitude]

Having listened to a few podcasts on the new Space Marine codex, there’s speculation that Alaitoc and Alpha Legion will go the same way as Raven Guard - I.e. no more -1 to hit, but instead some kind of cover save bonus. This led me to wonder what they may do to our beloved Darkshroud. If they left it as is, then we’d end up with one of the few -1 to hit bonuses in the game - which would be nice!

 

If they instead nerf it, then I can’t see what value it would have anymore.

[Neuralshock]

I don't think the dark shroud is as toxic as armywide -1 to hits. The problem with altioc is that it's criminally easy to stack -1 mods with great easy.

 

If you notice more closely, it's only vehicles that don't get the -1 and infantry only get that benefit if they're within terrain.

 

GW seems to be combating -1 stacks by changing the wording of rerolls too, pretty soon all chapter master equivalents are gonna get the flat reroll hits.

[Cpt_Reaper]

Discussing this at work today, a co-worker brought up an interesting idea concerning Wings.

 

Codex: Space marines has access to Traits.Codex; Dark Angels (or Unforgiven) has access to Protocols.

• Deathwing protocol
• Ravenwing protocol 
• Dreadwing protocol
• Ironwing Protocol
• Flamewing Protocol 
• Stormwing Protocol

 Now what exactly the protocol does needed further discussion, but each would essentially be akin to a Chapter Lineage from C:SM and would grant access to certain stratagems and traits. The Dark Angels themselves would have some sort of "jack of all trades" rule whereas successors would be specialised per deployment.

[SinnerBeta]

Assuming this is merely an update to bring it in line with the Space Marine codex rather than a complete rework:

- Deathwing Assault stratagem is removed and a similar ability is given to all Deathwing Terminators (aside from the Knights obviously)

- Fortress of Shields stratagem is removed and a similar ability is given to Deathwing Knights

- Deathwing units can ignore Tactical Reserves rule like drop pods, or a stratagem that you can Deep Strike 1-3 Deathwing units on any turn within 9" of a Ravenwing unit

- Return the Deathwing keyword to Masters by default, add it to Venerable Dreadnought

- give the option to upgrade Land Raiders to Deathwing Land Raiders as a stratagem or point upgrade, grants the Deathwing keyword and FNP 6+

- some way for Deep Striking Dreadnoughts

- teleport homers for Ravenwing units, perhaps as a stratagem to teleport a Terminator unit at any moment for 1 CP

- the original statline for whatever HQ gets Primaris'd

- when Tactical Doctrine is active, all bolter weapons with S5 or lower gain +1 to wound

- no Centurions or Thunderfire Cannons, please

[Cpt_Reaper]

Assuming this is merely an update to bring it in line with the Space Marine codex rather than a complete rework:

- Deathwing Assault stratagem is removed and a similar ability is given to all Deathwing Terminators (aside from the Knights obviously)

- Fortress of Shields stratagem is removed and a similar ability is given to Deathwing Knights

- Deathwing units can ignore Tactical Reserves rule like drop pods, or a stratagem that you can Deep Strike 1-3 Deathwing units on any turn within 9" of a Ravenwing unit

- Return the Deathwing keyword to Masters by default, add it to Venerable Dreadnought

- give the option to upgrade Land Raiders to Deathwing Land Raiders as a stratagem or point upgrade, grants the Deathwing keyword and FNP 6+

- some way for Deep Striking Dreadnoughts

- teleport homers for Ravenwing units, perhaps as a stratagem to teleport a Terminator unit at any moment for 1 CP

- the original statline for whatever HQ gets Primaris'd

- when Tactical Doctrine is active, all bolter weapons with S5 or lower gain +1 to wound

- no Centurions or Thunderfire Cannons, please

 

I don't see any units other than Drop Pods getting Turn 1 Deep Strike...unless:

 

Deathwing Protocol

When this protocol is in effect, DEATHWING units with the Teleport Srike ability may ignore the Tactical Reserves rule in Matched Play. DEATHWING units that do this may immediately make a shooting attack as if it were the shooting phase. This does not then prevent the units from shooting again in the shooting phase.

 

BAM! Something cool for the Unforgiven that is similar to C:SM doctrines but with our unique spin. Isn't active all the time so isn't potentially abusable like Drop Pods can be.

[SinnerBeta]

Or just put the same small note in their special rules like they did for Drop Pods, it's that easy. Unless you don't see it happening for balance reasons, but I would dispute that too. By protocol I'm guessing you mean Doctrine. 

[JimVandy85]

I think in our next codex, the ravenwing should have stratagems similar to what the white scars received. Seriously, Hunter's Fussilade screams ravenwing.

[Cpt_Reaper]

Or just put the same small note in their special rules like they did for Drop Pods, it's that easy. Unless you don't see it happening for balance reasons, but I would dispute that too. By protocol I'm guessing you mean Doctrine. 

In the Heresy the Dark Angels legion would activate a Protocol for certain wings. So in that regard it is just another name for doctrine, but also as Dark Angels wouldn't use doctrines I figured call them protocols.

 

But I don't think Deathwing units should naturally have the note that ignored tactical reserves. For balance it should be something that has to be activated. Perhaps by a HQ that has a relevant keyword. DEATHWING HQs can use the Deathwing Protocol, RAVENWING can use their protocol. The other 4 can be applied to HQs without one specifically granted (The basic Master is now a Swiss army knife). If you have multiple HQs with different Wing Keywords you could only have 1 protocol active per turn.

[SinnerBeta]

 

Or just put the same small note in their special rules like they did for Drop Pods, it's that easy. Unless you don't see it happening for balance reasons, but I would dispute that too. By protocol I'm guessing you mean Doctrine. 

In the Heresy the Dark Angels legion would activate a Protocol for certain wings. So in that regard it is just another name for doctrine, but also as Dark Angels wouldn't use doctrines I figured call them protocols.

 

But I don't think Deathwing units should naturally have the note that ignored tactical reserves. For balance it should be something that has to be activated. Perhaps by a HQ that has a relevant keyword. DEATHWING HQs can use the Deathwing Protocol, RAVENWING can use their protocol. The other 4 can be applied to HQs without one specifically granted (The basic Master is now a Swiss army knife). If you have multiple HQs with different Wing Keywords you could only have 1 protocol active per turn.

 

 

Not exactly how the Protocol worked when I played HH last time (dunno about the BL books, I'm not reading the series and ignoring everything about it), but I take it that you're talking about a new rule then. In that case I'll stop you there, I'm only talking about an update to bring us in line with the regular SM codex as I believe 100% that's what our update is going to be.

[Cpt_Reaper]

I was talking about a new rule. I'm hoping for a new codex but I'm expecting a treatment similar to Chaos 2.0. New datasheets, chaplain prayers and that's it. Same codex we have now in all other aspects.

[Berzul]

Would make sense for our "Chapter Doctrines" to follow the wing system, yeah.

I hope the litanies for Chaplains also come our way, and that there is a difference to the with Interrogator Chaplains.

[SinnerBeta]

I'm pretty sure we'll get all the new special rules and one modifier to one of the doctrines so that we're inline with the chapter  supplements. Interrogation Chaplin will most likely remain the same (but with the new litanies rules) as he already has better stats and additional abilities compared to a regular Chaplain, so probably no special litanies modifiers. Although I guess they could change Asmodeus to have a +1 modifier to his litany rolls, or be able to use two litanies per turn, but that would be more changes than I would expect from GW.

[Berzul]

Ok, whatever they do, I hope they do SOMETHING.

 

Sorry, venting rant time:

 

Just got finished with 2 games at 1000 points with an Astra Militarum friend.

 

My list was simple. 3*5 tacticals full of plasma with an ancient, 5 stock Terminators, 3 melta bikes with a multi melta bike, Azrael, a librarian and a lieutentan.

 

His list was 2 Wyverns, Pask and a Tank commander, 60 cadians, Company Commander, Lord Commisar and a Master of Ordnance.

 

I got my @$$ handed to me in a pink box with a golden bow and a kiss for good meassure, both times... IN LESS THAN TWO ROUNDS!!

 

My GOD it was a massacre...

 

And the only thing I could think, as I saw my army being wiped out, was: Why the $#&@ am I playing THIS codex and not the updated one.

 

I know the new codex might not have made regular marines fare much better. My army was a pretty casual list of tri wing, against something with an 8CP combo that could kill a list twice the Cadian force's size.

 

But still, it somehow made me 'feel' horrible. And that got augmented by the knowledge that playing vanilla marines is, right now, the better option, to level the playing field.

 

/Rant over

 

I really hope GW hurries up with an update for the DA.

[sneakybamsen]

Berzul, keep in mind you brought a casual list from one of the least good books against a not-so-casual list from what has arguably been the best book in the game since it was realease (at least untill the new space marine codex).

 

Now, I am looking at a marine list for competitive play for the biggest event in Denmark this year, and that is based on the new space marine codex, but I will no be using may dark angels with that book, as such. In the escalation league I will be taking part in from october till late april, I will be playing mono DA, new book or not. Afterall I have some recently painted green guys (aggressors and hellblasters) I want to see on the table, and some deathwing to assist them in mowing down enemies in droves.

[Berzul]

Yeah, I know. I know. I came in expecting one thing and got served another, and I should not be shocked. I'm just... Really drives in the power difference betweem codexes when you get shot out of the table turn one, you know?

[Grand Master Raziel]

In addition to ours being a weak dex, it also doesn't scale down well. We need at least 1500pts to be able to field a decently functional army. Imperial Guard, on the other hand, because all their stuff is so criminally cheap, can do quite well in lower point games.

[ValourousHeart]

Don't listen to the nay sayers Berzul.  DA can make effective armies at low points... Players just have to be willing to try something new.

 

But if you'll excuse me I'm being summoned to chamber 42.

[JJD]

I though today was the new white dwarf but it’s next Saturday isn’t it

[Isual]

I though today was the new white dwarf but it’s next Saturday isn’t it

There is hope though as the community page often does previews on Sundays.

 

They changed the scedule some time ago, next WD will be released on 20.09. as the backside of the current issue says.

[JJD]

 

 

I though today was the new white dwarf but it’s next Saturday isn’t it

There is hope though as the community page often does previews on Sundays.

They changed the scedule some time ago, next WD will be released on 20.09. as the backside of the current issue says.

/falls to knees ‘nnnnnnooooooooooooooooooooooooo’

 

Seriously though I was not aware of this change. Oh well another month to wait for guess. I’ll be fine......... is anyone else feeling itchy.

[G8Keeper]

So psychic awakening... Do we think it will hqve any bearing on DA?

[domsto]

So psychic awakening... Do we think it will hqve any bearing on DA?

Chances are it will be endless Spells for 40k.

Oh boy i can't wait to ignore this nonsense in my Games.

[G8Keeper]

 

Chances are it will be endless Spells for 40k.

Oh boy i can't wait to ignore this nonsense in my Games.

 

 

Yeah that's what my local group have surmised too. Some crazy wishlists for it range from a new GK codex to psychically awakened Necrons/T'au 

[Neuralshock]

The Psychic Awakening might not be endless spells, because the more recent codexes haven't made mention of a big psychic thing or anything that sounds like them.