The terminator project

[Captain Idaho]

If Land Raiders don't get Assault Vehicle then it's proof that GW doesn't care for it's Classic Marines ;)

 

Only kidding, it's going to be great to see Terminators benefiting from Doctrines now.

 

Assault Cannons can be AP-2, Cyclones AP-3 and all those Storm Bolters...

 

And of course a Lightning Claw is AP-3, Power Fists can be AP-4...

[Joukernaut]

just in case, I started to work on a redeemer to get it game ready.

I got the stormraven game ready the other week.

Both still need a lot of work, but I'm going for game ready for a lot of stuff to test it out, then finishing things I'm sure of for the list.

[Joukernaut]

So the redeemer obviously still needs work but is battle ready, the preparations for my project and the new codex are going better than expected. Next will be either the regular land raider or a chaplain in terminator armour. What would you guys reckon will serve me best?

[Captain Idaho]

Get a Chaplain! They're due to be a really powerful boost to our Marines, especially multi wound models like Terminators.

[Stickeh]

From what I’ve seen the chaplain litanies take place at th beginning of he turn though, meaning they wouldn’t effect deep striking terminators? Great for the termies in the land raiders but makes them a little bit more one dimensional

[Captain Idaho]

True but it's only a single turn he can't help. Also, he can anchor the line Terminators better whilst waiting for the Captain to turn up.

[Joukernaut]

I'm definitely going to try the chaplain. Right now I'm powering through the vehicles, I've just got the blue done on a regular landraider and I'm boxing in the details tomorrow so I can use it in games. That way I have a storm raven and one of each of the land raiders to try out in games. I've got a game lined up on codex day! I'm hoping to throw some paint on the chaplain beforehand so I can squeeze him in.

I was thinking about the new ultramarine spell scryer's gaze. It might help me power my terminators longer if I combine it with a adapt of the codex since I won't behaving many command points. I'm probably looking at 2 vanguard detachments and cal gar for max 7 points. If I can add one each turn with the spell and get one back for every three spent I might be able to use anywhere between 10-16 CP during 5 battle rounds. Is it worth it? It's a trade off between useful spells and useful stratagems.

I'll be watching the internet closely the next couple of days to hopefully make up a plan before I get my codex.

*edited to add picture*

[Joukernaut]

So, I played my first game yesterday with an all terminator list and the new codex.

The first thing I did was scroll over the landraider profile to scan for the assault vehicle rule....only to be very, very disappointed

I played another maelstrom mission against chaos demons and the purge. He brought two units of obliterators some plague bearers, a prince and two other psychers, two warp smiths, some purge marines and a vindicator laser destroyer.

the mortal wound ability from the warp smiths synergies very, very well with the purge obliterators. The purge rerolls all hit rolls against units that were damage earlier in the turn. they can also shoot into combat with a unit. so no hiding in combat.

 

My findings about terminators in the new codex are mixed.

I absolutely love the new codex and terminators became somewhat more viable, but some things have not changed or need to be addressed by changing the list.

Powerfists are still no good, despite the extra attack. I think they might be better once I add in a chaplain, but without rerolls they were outperformed by lightning claws every single time. Lightning claws is one of those things that became infinitely better with the extra attack. I had two mixed squads of assault terminators, my idea was to add the hammers for the insulin and the claws for killing power, and this is exactly how it proved to be.

I had the stormraven fire three turns in a row with all it's heavy fire power in obliterators assisted by two cyclone missile launchers, only taking out one! I just can't get this thing to hit and wound without rerolls. 

The seal of oath is amazing and does what you expect it to do. Get the right units in range and it will make sure you delete what you point at, absolutely amazing.

I actually managed to win the game on points by hiding my captain, but I was reduced to just him, with my opponent still having half his army left.

 

I think I'm going to rework the list over time to try to include one or two chaplains (or a chaplain and a chaptermaster, god I hope terminator Calgar will be FAQ'd in) and two librarians. I need more psychic defense, because mortal wounds and death hex hurt, a lot! I would also like more CP, but that's only possible if index Calgar gets FAQ'd

I'm also thinking of dropping the raven in favor of a second landraider and running a regular and a crusader. I'm still debating with myself wether including chronus breaks my all terminator concept, or wether it's okay to have a power armored driver.

Then lightning claws, and lots of them.  need to get my cataphractii with claw/stormbolter painted and I'm considering getting some fast dual claw tartars as well.

If I go this route I will have to figure out a way to erase vehicles and monsters (seal of oath definitely helps here!). I might have to bring the trusty leviathan back in, but I don't want to rely on it. It is much easier to keep alive with the dreadnought stratagem now though.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Sounds like it was a very exciting game .

[Joukernaut]

Oh, it definately was.

It’s been a long time since I suffered so many casualties. Playing the objective game with terminators really hurts your ability to damage the opponent.

[Captain Idaho]

I totally agree on the lightning claws. I just finished a game and the 4 Lightning Claws models I have in my Vanguard squad just ate through enemies! 17 attacks first turn of combat!

 

How did you find Fury of the First go? A Chaplain with Catechism of Fire alongside this Strategum enables you to hit with +1 and wound +1.

 

Did you use Superhuman Physiology? I was hoping that would make a difference.

[Joukernaut]

I did use both superhuman physiology and fury of the first.

Both stratagems are very good. superhuman physiology does make a difference, the one time I was able to use it, my opponent had to pour a lot of shots into my terminator squad to finish them off. Unfortunately I ran out of command points before getting to use it a second time. Fury of the first cranks up the damage output. It helped me tremendously against plague bearers with their annoying minuses to be hit.

The tough choice is running bigger squads of terminators, or at least one big squad to make those strats more valuable, and have less CP, or run multiple small squads for more CP, although two vanguard is pretty much the max at 2000 points, maybe three if I forgo landraiders and the stormraven, but then I'll have serious problems against screened, high toughness targets.

[Joukernaut]

On the plus side, I do think a big unit of terminators (preferably cataphractii) can be viable in a regular army where you have at least a battalion worth of CP to keep the going.

[Stickeh]

I've been drawing up a new 1st company list for this codex (might post it in the old 1st company thread later) and agree about large terminator squads. From playing these lists, they always lack anti tank, so taking a ten man squad allows you to take 2 cyclone missile launchers.

 

You then combat squad into two 5 man squads, with both cyclones in one and all storm bolters in the other. Tactical doctrine in combination with ‘Fury of the First’ gives 4 Krak missiles hitting on 2+, with various options for rerolls, giving a huge amount of damage potential, with another 5 man unit on chaff duty.