Today in Titanicus I...

[Pacific81]

Hey guys - Warlords.

 

Now in Epic despite being firepower powerhouses these were always a bit vulnerable in 1st/2nd edition, thanks to it being possible to hit the reactor from the front arc (this in some ways actually made the Reaver more durable, and even the Warhound sometimes as shots often scattered off them and missed!) Which meant that you had to kind of be a bit timid with their use and just keep them sat at the back and tooled up with Volcano and Quake cannons. Certainly if you tried to go toe to toe with something like a Gargant everyone just went for the reactor, moment the void shields were down it didn't take an especially lucky dice roll and you were toast. 

 

This always felt a bit off to me. To the uninitiated, how are things in AT? Is it much more survivable than the Reaver or does it have a similar achilles' heel like in Epic Space Marine?

 

 

Welcome Pacific81, I can’t wait to see what you do! I started with AT just a couple months ago - everyone warned me not to start with the Reaver!

 

Cheers man! Haha yes it wasn't too bad in the end. I don't think I helped myself by swapping the power fist and gatling cannon (so power fist on the right), but got there in the end with only minimal swearing and trying to prise off the part before the plastic glue had set. 

[painting.for.my.sanity]

Warlords do kind of need resin guns. It’s a bugbear of mine that they sold them with paired weapons when that’s almost never a good plan. Unfortunately this makes resin the only way to get the best load-outs, which makes warlords far more expensive to run than reavers and hounds - especially since those can be bought cheap in the starter.

 

Anyway, my advice is to place the following order:

 

- 1 or 2 mori quake cannons. These go with the apoc launchers and maybe a bellicosa to make a good support engine. Double quake is a very cheap, durable engine that doesn’t generate any heat, which can be good in an Extermigus maniple.

 

- 2 macro-Gatlings or volkite destructors. These are very similar weapons that can be used very effectively with a Sunfury. They break shields, the Sunfury smashes a hole in the target’s armour, these then put accurate fire into the hole.

 

A pair of gatlings for the roof. These are a great all round weapon, though their range isn’t amazing. I rate them much higher than laser blasters for a warlord as they’re much better for shield stripping and targeted shots.

 

This will allow you all sorts of options. You can run your engines both as effective midfield brawlers armed with plasma and Gatling/volkite. Stick missiles on one and gatlings on the other. Or else use one as a support engine and one as a midfielder. Or of course Sunfury and claw is a scary proposition, especially for Legios that are good at moving Warlords forward.

Absolutely agree with this assessment - as a starting setup for my pair of Warlords (one of each weapon sprue) I picked up a Quake, a Volkite, a Macro Gatling and some carapace Gatlings.

 

If you're not opposed to 3rd party options/struggling with FW stock issues, there are some nice alternative options out there for all of the above (I have a mix of FW and BattleBling). I also picked up more AMLs that way - having some cheap weapon options when needing to tweak costs to meet a points limits seemed like a good idea.

[Mandragola]

Hey guys - Warlords.

 

Now in Epic despite being firepower powerhouses these were always a bit vulnerable in 1st/2nd edition, thanks to it being possible to hit the reactor from the front arc (this in some ways actually made the Reaver more durable, and even the Warhound sometimes as shots often scattered off them and missed!) Which meant that you had to kind of be a bit timid with their use and just keep them sat at the back and tooled up with Volcano and Quake cannons. Certainly if you tried to go toe to toe with something like a Gargant everyone just went for the reactor, moment the void shields were down it didn't take an especially lucky dice roll and you were toast. 

 

This always felt a bit off to me. To the uninitiated, how are things in AT? Is it much more survivable than the Reaver or does it have a similar achilles' heel like in Epic Space Marine?

 

 

Welcome Pacific81, I can’t wait to see what you do! I started with AT just a couple months ago - everyone warned me not to start with the Reaver!

 

Cheers man! Haha yes it wasn't too bad in the end. I don't think I helped myself by swapping the power fist and gatling cannon (so power fist on the right), but got there in the end with only minimal swearing and trying to prise off the part before the plastic glue had set. 

This isn't a factor in AT as the reactor isn't its own separate location. Reactor leaks are an effect of crits to the body, but in general you can hit any location from any side if you can see it.

 

So yes, Warlords are very tough. It's still sometimes possible to wreck one very quickly but it takes a lot of effort, luck or foolishness on the part of its princeps (getting out of position or too hot) for that to happen. Killing them at long range and from the front is very hard to do.

[LameBeard]

From my very limited experience, the weakness of the Warlord is either heat (because you got 2 volcano cannons in the box so you shot with them) or manoeuvrability (Warhound sneaked behind you), but straight up toe-to-toe, tougher than the smaller titans, really needs some effort to take them down if their own Princeps hasn’t done the job for the enemy!

[Pacific81]

Thanks guys! I was hoping you would say that... *starts looking online for deals for Warlord Titans* 

 

Amazing how big the new plastic Reavers are. I would say at least 50% taller than the old metal kit. Although in terms of Epic, I would say they actually scale better with certainly some of the current 3D print Epic and Vanguard miniatures etc. 

 

The biggest challenge now might be bulking out (or stretching) Gargants so that they are similarly larger, as the old miniatures in particular now look tiddly compared to the new AT Titans!

[Gattopardo]

Yes as the others have said, Warlords are tough.

 

In my experience, Warlords present bigger problems to Reavers than they do to Warhounds. A Warhound can hurt a Warlord very badly if it can get plasma blastgun shots into it. Reavers struggle though, as they don't have any guns that can reliably do multiple strength 10 or greater hits to a single location. Melta cannons and Volcano cannons have the strength (Meltas particularly), but they can only do two hits at most and can't target. Even the Reaver melee weapons are a little under strength to really hurt a Warlord from the front, until the bonuses kick in for damaging a location. I've found it tough when facing lots of Warlords with a force of Reavers, for this reason. The best strategy seems to be to rush them - ideally put two or more engines on full stride on turn 1 and try to get inside the Warlords' carapace guns, at which point they are much less threatening, and spread out and try to make them turn so they open up flank shots.

 

It's very good game design really - all the major engines have their strengths and weaknesses. Warlords are very powerful if they can hit the enemy with clear shots in the 10 - 24" sort of range (or further away with the missiles, quakes and the like) but really start to feel cumbersome and a bit toothless if smaller engines can get within 10" or into their flanks.

[Mandragola]

Yeah there’s a little bit if rock/paper/scissors with warlords, reavers and warhounds. Reavers with melee weapons are a big problem for warhounds.

 

I’m not sure how much of this is great design and how much is accidental. The warhound plasma and bolters are both arguably better than anything a reaver can have on its arms. Actually with the PBG there’s really no argument- it totally outclasses reaver arm weapons. I don’t think it’s meant to be quite that devastating.

[Dulahan]

So true story -  the first game of Titanicus I ever played, I drew the short straw and ended up with a Reaver and a Warhound against a Warhound and a Warlord.  Yeah, didn't go well.  I did get the mulligan of helping arm my opposition so I had a touch of an advantage, but... not much since I didn't know the rules yet.

 

Also full disclosure we played a lot of rules wrong to very wrong.  I don't remember what exactly.  But I won.  Handily.  Early luck taking out the enemy Warhound and then my Reaver and Warhound kept behind the poor warlord and murdered it.  If we'd done things right I don't know if it would have been quite so bloody (Amongst other things we didn't ever remember the Warlord's defense cannon thingie).  Maneuvering is huge in this game, no question!

 

But anyways, different story!  Melee weapons... I shy from them.  Mostly because I've legit had a destroyed titan swing a game against one player in every single game of Titanicus I've ever played barring two (The aforementioned first one, and a different one that ended up a terrible turkey shoot where my poor Knights and Warhounds got murdered by a bad pairing of objectives and terrain).   Legit every other game I've played a destroyed titan tends to blow up, and hurt others.  To the point I don't WANT to be close enough to destroy one with a melee weapon.  Heck, I'm afraid of being within 10 inches of a Warlord in case it goes BOOM! 

 

My last game I was losing, but a Reaver kill caused it to take out a Warhound too.  It was crazy. 

[malika666]

Today in Titanicus I’m wondering if these would work as Eldar Knights…

 

https://vanguardminiatures.co.uk/shop/eloi-federation-fire-banshee-detachment/

[Noserenda]

Today in Titanicus I’m wondering if these would work as Eldar Knights…

 

https://vanguardminiatures.co.uk/shop/eloi-federation-fire-banshee-detachment/

Those are warhound sized apparently so maybe as Acastus? Wraithguard work absolutely perfectly as the various Cerastus knights already though! 

 

Did a lil intro game today which was fun, may well have another convert! :D Though the dice gods were against him, my poor blinded melee Reaver managed to kill two Warhounds in one Vulcan burst :D 

Edited August 9, 2021 by Noserenda

[malika666]

They are about the size of a Lancer Knight, tiiiiiiny bit bigger.

 

Edited August 10, 2021 by malika666

[malika666]

This might in handy for rocky terrain?

 

https://www.waylandgames.co.uk/dystopian-wars/85298-islands-and-archipelagos-set

[Lord_Borak]

I saw those on FB Malika and the look awesome. I'm very tempted to try a little force. Is there any plans on making any other sizes? I.e. Titans?

[malika666]

I’ve seen some concept art of a larger warmachine, no clue when the design will be ready let alone be produced. Even the Fire Banshee took a really long time.

[Lord_Borak]

Ok, cool, thanks!! Maybe one day when I finish all my Titans I'll start a Xeno force. :D 

[Zopha]

Finally picked a purple!

And got a test armour plate painted up. I just need to stick with this purple and not get distracted by inks.

 

 

Edited August 12, 2021 by Zopha

[Mandragola]

Finally picked a purple!

 

And got a test armour plate painted up. I just need to stick with this purple and not get distracted by inks.

 

 

That looks good. Are you going with gold trim?

 

Interesting to see the stages of your paint job. I always think that masking these shapes and spraying them looks like more hassle than painting them by hand, but whatever works for you is good.

[noigrim]

well, I always kill them with shots to the chest

[Zopha]

 

Finally picked a purple!

 

And got a test armour plate painted up. I just need to stick with this purple and not get distracted by inks.

 

That looks good. Are you going with gold trim?

 

Interesting to see the stages of your paint job. I always think that masking these shapes and spraying them looks like more hassle than painting them by hand, but whatever works for you is good.

 

 

Xestobiax is supposed to have silver trim, I might paint half of this test plate silver and half gold to see which I like more but it will probably be silver.

 

I find freehand difficult, fustrating and never get the results I want, so masking tape is less of a hassle for me :) I might be eating those words when I try to do a diamond pattern :D

[Mandragola]

Diamonds are pretty tricky, yes. Here's my attempt on a Mortis Reaver.

 

 

I did this by drawing out the pattern in pencil first. I actually drew a grid in the other direction (straight up and across) and then drew the diagonal lines through the corners of that, because I didn't trust myself to do diagonals first. It's way too easy to draw wonky lines. After that, painting in the squares honestly wasn't all that difficult, though I made lots of errors that needed fixing.

 

If you want smaller squares then transfers are available. Your best bet might be to go for white ones and slap them on over your purple. Have a google and see what you can find.

[schoon]

The purple stripes came out very nice - good work Zopha.

[Pacific81]

I think that's a fantastic job, if something looks that good with a close-up camera shot then it will look excellent on the tabletop. 

[Zhiv]

Today in Titanicus I finished painting some models I bought in 2019.

[Zopha]

Today in Titanicus I finally painted some purple :D

 

I'm not sure about the second one (with all the arrows). It seems a bit wonky in spots , I'll get the trim done and see if it grows on me but I still have my test carpace plate if I really don't like it.

 

 

 

 

 

Still some engine plates, shin plates and two heads to do.

[Pacific81]

Very nice Zopha, unusual colour but think it works really well!  Can I ask how you achieved the chequer pattern on the bottom right? It looks great. If you say freehand I shall kill you :D