New Blood Angel Rules

[FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants]

Like everything I see. Shock assault will be good on DC, SG and our other heavy hitters, as well as pretty much anything in the codex. Good we got the drop pod upgrade, also flame storm cannons and hand flamers both seem more appealing. Only thing I don’t like is the Reiver upgrade on the phobos Lt as he neither has a grav chute nor concealed positions making him pretty useless for vanguard marines.

[Panzer]

It may not be news to anyone else but I was pleasantly surprised to see Incursors get paired combat knives for exploding sixes rather than the regular knives Reivers get. With Phobos Libby's having access to BA powers that opens up some really strong potential with Unleash Rage.

 

3 attacks base, +1 for shock assault, and a potential +1 from a Libby or Sanguinor stacked with exploding sixes is pretty decent.

 

The paired combat blades are worse than the combat knives though.

A unit with 5 combat knives gets +5 attacks. For paired combat blades to give the same bonus on average you'd need 30 attacks.

[Bonzi]

 

 

It may not be news to anyone else but I was pleasantly surprised to see Incursors get paired combat knives for exploding sixes rather than the regular knives Reivers get. With Phobos Libby's having access to BA powers that opens up some really strong potential with Unleash Rage.

 

3 attacks base, +1 for shock assault, and a potential +1 from a Libby or Sanguinor stacked with exploding sixes is pretty decent.

The paired combat knives are worse than the regular combat knives though.

A unit with 5 combat knives gets +5 attacks. For combat knives to give the same bonus on average you'd need 30 attacks.

Ah poop. I thought the paired combat knives gave the +1 base attack AND had exploding 6s. Bummer.

[Panzer]

 

 

It may not be news to anyone else but I was pleasantly surprised to see Incursors get paired combat knives for exploding sixes rather than the regular knives Reivers get. With Phobos Libby's having access to BA powers that opens up some really strong potential with Unleash Rage.

 

3 attacks base, +1 for shock assault, and a potential +1 from a Libby or Sanguinor stacked with exploding sixes is pretty decent.

The paired combat knives are worse than the regular combat knives though.

A unit with 5 combat knives gets +5 attacks. For combat knives to give the same bonus on average you'd need 30 attacks.

Ah poop. I thought the paired combat knives gave the +1 base attack AND had exploding 6s. Bummer.

 

 

That would be great but would make Reivers even more useless I guess. Though it's probably because Incursors have Paired Combat Blades and not Combat Knives. :P

[Karhedron]

I’m guessing they’re saving points adjustments to chapter approved.

Seems plausible although possibly the big October FAQ. The optimist in me would like to think we get our real 2.0 codex before Chapter Approved comes out but we all know where such hopes can lead.

[The Unseen]

Us not getting any of the points adjustments leads me to believe one of two things.

GWs rollout of this was handled incredibly poorly (some evidence, like the mess around doctrines, to this being the case)

The other, is that we should expect a codex/supplement/something sooner, rather than later.

I doubt GW is going to wait to change pts for the other marine factions for ~6 months to wait for CA, and GW doesn't do pts changes in FAQs anymore, unless it's an "emergency".

 

But I'm not getting my hopes up.

The new units are at least some new toys to play around with.

[Morticon]

Mess around doctrines??

[The Unseen]

Mess around doctrines??

As an example, Gabriel Angelos' updated rules in like, last month's white dwarf, didn't get errated to have Angels of Death.

Therefore if you take him, RAW he turns off your combat doctrines.

Even better, his old index rules from FW DID get errated.

That and the (probably unintended but no way to be sure) fact that using Operative Requisition for an assasin for marines also turns off doctrines for some reason.

 

Just sloppy rules writing basically.

[Morticon]

I think the decision to not change points was a very deliberate and thought out one. To change one thing would have opened the floodgates to changing more and then if the points were change a, what of the abilities and then what of the associated strats...

 

I think they've made a clean stop gap move so that there's no transferable issues. I just hope the dex comes sooner than later.

 

The issue with doctrines is unfortunate though. There are a lot of things that slipped through

[FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants]

When they get around to redoing our codex, as much as I'd like something bespoke instead of combat doctrines, if we do get them we can ally with nilla, DA and SW armies without penalty. Also if DA and SW don't get them and get something bespoke instead, the Lion and the Wolf strat will pretty much never get used.

[Panzer]

When they get around to redoing our codex, as much as I'd like something bespoke instead of combat doctrines, if we do get them we can ally with nilla, DA and SW armies without penalty. Also if DA and SW don't get them and get something bespoke instead, the Lion and the Wolf strat will pretty much never get used.

 

I don't think that will be an issue. GW can always write exceptions in the Codexes that are ... well, exceptions.

If anything, I'd say the fact that we got Shock Assault but not Combat Doctrines is a clear sign that we won't be getting those.

[aquamarine]

Having got hold of Codex:SM today and read the wordings on doctrines et al., it's now 100% certain we won't get them in that form, and that BA will get a full codex not a supplement as predicted by others here

[MrZakalwe]

 

 

 

He's not. White Scars Champion of Humanity Smash Captains are harder to get in position but way more powerful than anything BA have.

 

 

As a Guard player the Smash Captain can generally kill my Knight in one round of combat if the Knight is even lightly damaged beforehand or anything else in my army from 100% so I'm not sure how much value additional killing power has.

 

On the other hand move/charge blocking things without fly is rather easy (I can often Move Move Move a squad of guard to form a circle around key melee threats and that wastes at least a movement phase).  

[Vermintide]

As long as Shock Assault stacks with Black Rage and powers like Unleash Rage... I'm very happy.

 

(Please confirm )

[Panzer]

No reasony why it shouldn't stack. Different rules with similar effects and none says it can't stay with other abilities.

[Morticon]

As long as Shock Assault stacks with Black Rage and powers like Unleash Rage... I'm very happy.

 

(Please confirm )

 

Used this last game. Was lovely. 

[t-dog1996]

You know, I've seen people complaining about us not getting chaplain litanies but you know what? I'm actually delighted that we haven't got them. The new litany of hate is objectively inferior to the one in our codex. We get an absolute guarantee of rerolls to hit, they get it on a 3+. None of the other litanies are worth giving up that guarantee of rerolls either. Frankly I'm glad that our chaplains have remained as they were, especially Lemartes. If Fury Unbound got nerfed I would be very annoyed to say the least.

[Klod]

You know, I've seen people complaining about us not getting chaplain litanies but you know what? I'm actually delighted that we haven't got them. The new litany of hate is objectively inferior to the one in our codex. We get an absolute guarantee of rerolls to hit, they get it on a 3+. None of the other litanies are worth giving up that guarantee of rerolls either. Frankly I'm glad that our chaplains have remained as they were, especially Lemartes. If Fury Unbound got nerfed I would be very annoyed to say the least.

Exactly. I have mentioned it a couple of times. It would be more of a nerf than a buff for us.

[Panzer]

I don't want litanies because I think it would make us stronger. I want litanies because I think it's more interesting than the current aura. Big difference. ;)

[Klod]

I don't want litanies because I think it would make us stronger. I want litanies because I think it's more interesting than the current aura. Big difference.

It is more interesting, I agree, but the way it works means it is hard for us to make use of it since the way we fight is by dropping down at the end of the movement phase. Keeping the Chaplain back with the army just feels wrong for me.

[Leonaides]

No. It really isn't. That might be the way you specifically interpret it, but in no way is that 'the way we fight'.

 

We can use uwof, but equally you could trigger a chaplain in your backline, give blessing to a squad then uwof them elsewhere to charge while gaining the effect or just move up first then charge turn 2.

[Klod]

No. It really isn't. That might be the way you specifically interpret it, but in no way is that 'the way we fight'.

I would argue that it is exactly the way we fight.

 

 

We can use uwof, but equally you could trigger a chaplain in your backline, give blessing to a squad then uwof them elsewhere to charge while gaining the effect or just move up first then charge turn 2.

I probably have expressed myself wrong. Eventhough I do like a good buff, I'm not as concerened about how much stronger/weaker it will make us, but how much sense it makes. If you want to get to the crunch of this then there are several points that make the Litanies clunky for us. First, I might be wrong, but if I remember correctly some Litanies work only as an aura type ability. So you couldn't buff and UWOF them. The Chaplain would stay behind. Second, unless you go first or have great LOS blocking terrain, those DC are unlikely to survive the first turn if they start on the board(depends on the enemy ofcourse).  But what I dislike the most is how little sense makes the fact that simply because a Chaplain arrives by a jumppack/teleport he can not insipre or provide his guidance (in a narrative sense) to a squad he arrives with.

[Blindhamster]

Its "A" way blood Angels fight, jump pack assault is something they're meant to be very good at. But it shouldnt be ALL they're good at. They're still codex adherent.

 

I could see us getting some close combat related doctrines but we would be handicapped if nothing buffs our shooting honestly

[Klod]

Its "A" way blood Angels fight, jump pack assault is something they're meant to be very good at. But it shouldnt be ALL they're good at. They're still codex adherent.

 

I could see us getting some close combat related doctrines but we would be handicapped if nothing buffs our shooting honestly

Yeah, that is how I see it too. We fight tactically, making use of everything that is availiable to the Chapter, while laying emphasis on close range shooting, assault and excelling at melee. I didn't mean that it is the only way to fight, but that it is what defines us.

 

I would have liked if we got a strategem that is similar to the one in C:SM, the one that let's you reroll failed wounds and damage with Grav weapons. I would have prefered the same but for melta. I think melta fits us better.

[SnorriSnorrison]

 

Its "A" way blood Angels fight, jump pack assault is something they're meant to be very good at. But it shouldnt be ALL they're good at. They're still codex adherent.

 

I could see us getting some close combat related doctrines but we would be handicapped if nothing buffs our shooting honestly

Yeah, that is how I see it too. We fight tactically, making use of everything that is availiable to the Chapter, while laying emphasis on close range shooting, assault and excelling at melee. I didn't mean that it is the only way to fight, but that it is what defines us.

 

I would have liked if we got a strategem that is similar to the one in C:SM, the one that let's you reroll failed wounds and damage with Grav weapons. I would have prefered the same but for melta. I think melta fits us better.

 

 

I'd actually prefer the Grav strat because of 4 shots per weapon. Re-rolling wounding and damage is *huge* against heavy infantry and even vehicles because of the number of shots and the cost of only 1 CP. Meltas don't really need it that much because there's 4 shots max per Dev squad, 5 if you give the Sergeant a combi-melta. Just stick a captain or Lieutenant around, they'll do the same. Ish.

 

But yeah, it would be cool to have combat doctrines eventually. Perhaps you could choose between assault and tactical doctrine from the second turn, or advance straight through to the assault doctrine after the devastator doctrine for a turn 2 assault. Or something else entirely.

 

Primaris Dark Angels have been confirmed to be on the horizon...perhaps they'll get an update to their codex as well.