Thunderfire Cannon viability

[Kallas]

The Tremor Shells stratagem doesn't work on Titanic targets though, so can't slow down knights.

But it does affect Lord Discordants.

[Exilyth]

So, looking at the enormous list of indirect fire options available in the codex, we have

• the thunder fire cannon (+ techmarine gunner)
• the whirlwind
• eliminators with that indirect fire round

When would a thunderfire cannon be a better choice than the other options?
(obviously, when you park it behind some vehicle the techmarine can repair, but when else?)
 

I am still wondering about the size comparison, I hope the Kataphron tracks are close in size to the Thunderfire cannon tracks.

Over on dakka, there's a thread showing a size comparision:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/779960.page
TL;DR: the kataphron tracks have ~2cm less width than the TFC tracks.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Kataphrons really don't make good thunderfire counts as. Rapiers, sure, but TF are rather large.

[Kallas]

So, looking at the enormous list of indirect fire options available in the codex, we have

• the thunder fire cannon (+ techmarine gunner)
• the whirlwind
• eliminators with that indirect fire round

When would a thunderfire cannon be a better choice than the other options?

(obviously, when you park it behind some vehicle the techmarine can repair, but when else?)

TFCs are the best for anti-infantry firepower and for utility (ie, Tremor Shells).

 

Whirlwind Vengeance is best for anti-armour (Castellan is worse than the TFC vs pretty much everything, point-for-point).

 

Eliminators are anti-character.

[Exilyth]

Techmarine gunners being characters makes TFCs less useful vs. eliminators and Raven Guard.

[Kallas]

Techmarine gunners being characters makes TFCs less useful vs. eliminators and Raven Guard.

Meh. They're 4W/2+ and likely out of LoS (so Eliminators are only using Mortis and not Executioner rounds). It'll take quite a few Eliminators to kill off even one Gunner.

 

Statistically it takes 17 Mortis shots to kill off a Gunner; 11 with Devastator Doctrine and Guided Aim, but not Surgical Strikes; and 18 with Devastator but neither GA or SS.

 

That gives plenty of time to get at the Eliminators. Also bear in mind that the TFC has a 60" range. It can happily sit back and pummel away - if the Eliminators are being deployed forward enough to even make their shots, then they'll be in serious danger that far forward; even Raven Guard can only put so much in the midfield early on.

[Mandragola]

I played against a guy with 3 TFCs and 3 knight crusaders at the LGT. It was game 5 and we’d both gone 4:0 up to that point.

 

I finished 5:0. Actually some of my skitarii lives despite the TFCs, three ironstorm pods and Chronus in a whirlwind. It was a pretty brutal game though, which I only won by killing everything and having enough units to camp all four objectives for bonus points.

 

On balance I think one is enough. That’s what gets you the slowing effect. They aren’t all that great at actually killing things or holding ground - though that depends on the mission. ITC missions don’t let you hide objectives all that much.

[Ishagu]

I agree there's no need to bring extras. One is perfect for the utility it brings, and if you want to punish someone with indirect fire get a Scorpius in addition lol

[Kallas]

I agree there's no need to bring extras. One is perfect for the utility it brings, and if you want to punish someone with indirect fire get a Scorpius in addition lol

 

I tried an Artillery-style list recently, and the multiple ignore-LoS sources of firepower was immensely useful:

2x TFC

3x Land Raider Helios (because I love Land Raiders, and want them to be decent!)

Combined with the Ultramarines Chapter Tactic (Inheritors) and the Calm Under Fire WLT.

 

The two TFC were brilliant. My list remained in Devastator Doctrine until Turn Three (as most of my infantry in that list is intended to just dig out the Land Raiders and provide objective-sitting bodies), and the extra AP is nice on the TFCs too.

Turn One one of them Tremor Shelled two units of Boyz, and the second with the three Helios helped pummel a unit of Boyz that had Da Jump'd at me into the dirt; they also brought down a Deffkopta out of LoS.

 

One of the Helios got targeted by a bunch of Rokkits (Deffkoptas, Tankbustas, and the Rokkit Buggies, I forget their name) bringing it down into its second bracket: the Techmarine Gunner then repaired it just above into full functionality, so that was damn helpful too.

 

They're a great unit, and for 92pts including the Gunner they're a damn good deal. With 60" range and 5/-1/1 they're a solid profile for just pounding away at medium/light infantry, and in a pinch they can provide additional firepower into tougher units, especially with Devastator Doctrine.

 

They have some obviously amazing utility in Tremor Shells, which is their main draw in my opinion: I didn't run the full lockdown list that I want to try at some point (Tremor Shells, Psychic Shackles, and Tenebrous Curse to lock down two units super hard, or up to four units pretty well) but I did try out TS+PS, and that meant that one unit of Boyz did literally nothing except die (even if they'd used Da Jump, they would have been unable to make a charge at 2d6[with rerolls]/2 -1, for a max of 7" including Evil Sunz).