CSM Start: Advice

[General Strike]

So, I got my hands on the Apocalypse box for Chaos dirt cheap, it seems like a good start to a Chaos core. I really like the new models, but am unsure where to go. I had three thoughts, Red Corsairs with massed CSM and Havoks, Word Bearers and grab the Shadowspear stuff and some possessed, or convert the 30x CSM into Khorne Berserkers for a WE army? What do you guys vote?

[Marshal Loss]

As a dedicated acolyte of the XVII Legion I am obligated to say that you can't go wrong with the Word Bearers (although their rules are lacking and the old Possessed models are very dated). I started with the Shadowspear box and added a few of the new kits (Havocs, Terminators, Lord Discordant) and have been very happy with the results so far.

[MegaVolt87]

I would say Red Corsairs, then you could add chaos knights without getting too far into a lot of CSM for a smaller force. 

[MegaVolt87]

Yeah I hope that red corsairs detachment gets another generic version so anyone can use it, so any CSM could do tide style lists better. 

[Hannibal]

So, I got my hands on the Apocalypse box for Chaos dirt cheap, it seems like a good start to a Chaos core. I really like the new models, but am unsure where to go. I had three thoughts, Red Corsairs with massed CSM and Havoks, Word Bearers and grab the Shadowspear stuff and some possessed, or convert the 30x CSM into Khorne Berserkers for a WE army? What do you guys vote?

 

Go and get what YOU like most! Just play what´s cool. Don´t bother with rules unless you want to fight for tournament wins. And even then, CSM might not be the beast choice.

 

You can also build Berzerkes and run them in diferent Legions, no problem here (besides being Elites instead of Troops).

[Aothaine]

I’d say beware of picking a scheme based on any kind of new rules or traits. The way codices tend to come out unannounced and change play styles might make you regret choices you make today.

 

This is one of the most important facts to consider when choosing your army. It is also an excellent reason to make up your own chapter/legion and paint scheme. This allows you to jump between the rules and play what ever you feel like and I honestly feel that it is the best way to approach Warhammer 40k. This is unless you really really like a specific chapter/legion.

[Doom Herald]

All those bikes would do well as Red Corsairs. 20" advance +D6" charge. Throw a hard hitting weapon on the champ and take advantage of the speed and toughness. Going competitive, them for Renegades or Black Legion for legions are probably the best. If you go Red Corsairs, that relic on a Bike Champ is pretty sweet. Black Legion probably has the best rules, but that may or may not change if other legions get new rules.

 

Personally, I would convert the CSMs with a chain weapon and pistol into Berzerkers. I would do that with any choice of <LEGION> though.

[Guzzlrr]

I think if your patient read/listen to a few different books.

 

3 armies I have a passion for just because of the stories Ive read Thousand Sons, Iron Warriors & Black Legion.

 

or another way If i were you id just buy what i thinks cool and play about with things till you found a style of play you enjoy and pick a Warband that Fits that style.

 

for me i created my own Warband to begin with, until i read a storm of iron & then i repainted all of my Army in the colours of the IV legion.

[Sgt. Blank]

Beyond the background and imagery, what tactics do you enjoy? Each of those suggestions brings something different to the table and it's worth thinking about what you like playing.

 

In particular, full Worldeaters give access to a great assault unit but cut off psykers - Berzerkers can be devastating but they aren't particularly fast or durable, so they need a delivery mechanism and a way to defeat screens to get to high value targets.

[ChazSexington]

Red Corsairs, m'boy! Hoist the Jolly Roger! Yarr! 

 

 

Pick up Huron for your 2nd HQ, and voilà - you have a Battalion. Add Havocs, and you have some solid firepower. You might consider picking up the Shadowspear stuff down the road to bulk out your CSM squads too!

[Leonite]

I can't give good advice in faith - I play four chaos armies, two of which are DG and TS. And the third is Word Bearers

 

I do find my Emperor's Children are fun, but that's more for converting and the fact I have a Retro Noise Marine as my Sorceror.

[Trevak Dal]

I’d say beware of picking a scheme based on any kind of new rules or traits. The way codices tend to come out unannounced and change play styles might make you regret choices you make today.

 

I have a sneaking suspicion the Red Corsairs benefit will either change or be applied somehow to chaos as a whole. Word Bearers will most likely get another bonus to their current trait as well.

 

Definitely play whatever you want, but don’t be surprised if anything is changed down the road.

Yeah, it's generally best to come up with "Your own guys". My Nightblades are my own guys then try to fit them into a legion/Warband tactic, because GW are fickle and give and take that away.

 

You generally can't go wrong going with a mainline Warband or legion (Black Legion, Ultramarines, etc) since they are mainline forces and will almost certainly always have favorable rules.

 

If its straight fluff you want, play whatever you like.

[General Strike]

So, I've decided on a World Eaters warband. A custom one, so that if I decide to add stuff I can. I'm worried about giving them all chainswords and axes, and them losing it and redoing all the work, but I have some FW chainaxes on their way without hands on them. Do you think it's okay to model them holding a bolt Pistol and chainsword, but have the axes on their waists or backs? Also, I am having trouble getting my hands on any berserker heads, the only ones available, including blood warriors and the like, are the old skull faced ones. They just look kinda cartoony on the new models. Any advice for alternatives? Would all bare heads be okay?

[Hannibal]

You can build whatever you like. It´s your hobby, it´s your miniature. I´ve never had issues with "count as", even at tournaments. If you build yll your Berzerkers pistol – chain axe and you tell your opponent "all Berzerkers bear chainaxe and chainsword" then there won´t be any problem. Problems start to arise if you try to explain more than just a single easy to remember "count as".

 

And only because GW modelled their BErzerkers the way they are doesn´t mean that there aren´t any different ways to do it.

 

Maybe this will give you some inspiration:

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/04/03/kit-bash-chaos-space-marines/

[MegaVolt87]

So, I've decided on a World Eaters warband. A custom one, so that if I decide to add stuff I can. I'm worried about giving them all chainswords and axes, and them losing it and redoing all the work, but I have some FW chainaxes on their way without hands on them. Do you think it's okay to model them holding a bolt Pistol and chainsword, but have the axes on their waists or backs? Also, I am having trouble getting my hands on any berserker heads, the only ones available, including blood warriors and the like, are the old skull faced ones. They just look kinda cartoony on the new models. Any advice for alternatives? Would all bare heads be okay?

Just use holsters, there is your pistol for WYSIWYG. Models still valid even if it changes.

[General Strike]

We have a local FB group for everyone who plays warhammer together, including some TOs, and they all said they're cool with my idea as long as I paid the points and declare them and have it in my list. So I think I will put them on the belt or power plant.

[General Strike]

Alright, so I ended up getting another Apocalypse box. This nets me 2x Lords in Terminator Armor, and 60x CSM. I will be converting 24 into Khorne Berserkers, and one into an Aspiring champion. That leaves me with 35 CSM, I was thinking of making 3 Havok Squads, one with Missile Launchers, one with Heavy Bolters, and one with half and half. That leaves me with 20 bodies still. I could make 15x CSM, to be run in three MSUs, and a Squad of five chosen? What do you guys recommend.

[MegaVolt87]

Terrible, forget about heavy bolters. Autocannons are much better for the same points on havocs. I would have at least 4 lascannons in the havocs somewhere or just a full unit. You could turn those 20 guys into plasma spam chosen, that would be not expensive to get extra plasma gun bits. Or just make MSU with 1 lascannon, combi plas champ x3 units, have the 5 spare to make one of the squads 10 man later. 

[dread05]

Hello, sorry for highjacking this thread :P

I'm toying with the idea of starting a small chaos space marines force. I'm thinking black legion cause I like the color scheme and because I like the Abaddon model. That said, I'd like to start small and I'd like the models to be from the new range. Maybe a couple of squads at first. Where should I start?

[CMDR_Welles]

Hello, sorry for highjacking this thread

 

I'm toying with the idea of starting a small chaos space marines force. I'm thinking black legion cause I like the color scheme and because I like the Abaddon model. That said, I'd like to start small and I'd like the models to be from the new range. Maybe a couple of squads at first. Where should I start?

Either pick up a copy of Shadowspear if you can. Its got some great new models. That will give you:

 

Master of Posession, a 10 man Marine Squad, 2 Greater Possessed, 2 Obliterators, and a Venomcrawler.

 

If you just want the Chaos side, there should be a few Ebay vendors who are selling just the Chaos side.

 

To this, I would add one or two boxes of the new Chaos Marines. If you only get one box, you will need to break it down into two 5 man units to meet the 3 Troops for a Battalion.

 

I would then buy two boxes of Havocs.

 

After that, anything else that you want to get. Rhinos to help your squads weather some extra firepower, I'm fond of Helbrutes, but that is just me.

 

Hopefully we'll eventually get a full Obliterators kit.

 

People are going to say "just get Cultists"... But honestly, until they release an ACTUAL kit for them; they just arent worth getting now unless you are already sitting on a pile of Cultists from OOP Dark Vengeance starter, or are willing to convert them from Necromunda gangers... Cawdor would make for good Wordbearers Cultists IMHO. But that is still a lot of work.

[dread05]

I was thinking maybe get the chaos space marines from shadowspear, get another box of marines and a box of havocs. That will give me enough room to swap weapons around. Then later get Abaddon and some Terminators. The force doesnt have to be playable, I'm just a collector* anyway.

 

*that said, I prefer to build and collect competitive units. You never know ;P

[ChazSexington]

I was thinking maybe get the chaos space marines from shadowspear, get another box of marines and a box of havocs. That will give me enough room to swap weapons around. Then later get Abaddon and some Terminators. The force doesnt have to be playable, I'm just a collector* anyway.

 

*that said, I prefer to build and collect competitive units. You never know ;P

 

The Shadowspear Marines are monopose and weapons don't swap out that easy unless you're getting the hobby knife and saw out, just so you know :) 

[dread05]

yea yea I know but I figured if I get the shadowspear marines and a chaos space marines box I can make 1 ranged squad and one CC squad.

[CMDR_Welles]

yea yea I know but I figured if I get the shadowspear marines and a chaos space marines box I can make 1 ranged squad and one CC squad.

Very easily. The Champ and four Marines from Shadowspear are melee. With the other box, make five more with melee, and then make a Champ and 4 Bolter CSM to fill out the other squad.

 

That's what I'll probably do when I get a box of CSM.

[General Strike]

What is better for a Berserker army right now? Red Corsairs or World Eaters. I like advance and charge, but you lose an attack and Veterans. But with shock assault it makes up for the lost attack. Plus Red Corsairs gets me out of mono god.