Brother Lunkhead Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 "The Graven Man"......I like that a lot Very fine job on the bios of these three characters. They are significantly different in personality and temperament without looking contrived. All very interesting. Nice work Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5622200 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjorn Firewalker Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Good job on the Special Characters' bios. Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5622447 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted October 29, 2020 Author Share Posted October 29, 2020 (edited) Ta for your feedback, Bjorn and Lunk! Since today marks one year since the Strigoi made their debut on the forum, I figured I'd show you another miniature: Hidden Content Enter Captain Gavril - Leader of the 9th Battle Company, the 'Spiteblades'! As Master of the 9th, Gavril holds the title of 'Keeper of the Tomes'. As concerned with making history as studying it, the Keeper is immersed in the Chapter's deepest lore, knowing more about their past than virtually anyone save the chapter council and the librarius. The position is also notable for having been occupied by several Chapter Masters-to-be - Commander Ionel Ardelan, for example.Gavril's temper is well-suited to the task. A relatively young officer of 122 years, he is known for level-headedness and the ability to look at any given situation objectively. Together with his company's command cadre, hand-picked by the Captain himself, he deduces exactly how the 9th Company can bring their ferociousness to bear most effectively.When engaged in battle, Captain Gavril is little different from most other Strigoi, preferring to get up close and mutilate his foes in the throes of the Red Thirst. To this end, he carries with him one of the chapter's prized inferno pistols as well as the chainsword Wrathslaker, an heirloom weapon that has been at his side since it was gifted to Gavril by his scout sergeant. Captain Gavril here as well as the Lieutenant you've seen previously (although he underwent a couple of small changes since then) will be part of a Strigoi force I intend to start sometime in early 2021. If you're interested in how I'd envision my homebrew to look in the, uhh, plastic, keep an eye out for that in the WIP forum - though I'm pretty sure I won't forget to mention it here when the time comes. Edited October 29, 2020 by AHorriblePerson KBA and Brother Lunkhead 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5624290 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjorn Firewalker Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 (edited) Gavril's model looks appropriately fierce. An age of 122 seems young for a Space Marine Captain, though; the 50-year-old Leandros was considered "young and inexperienced" in the 2011 video game Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine. What acts of valor did he perform to EARN that rank? Did he kill an Ork Warboss to end a Waaagh! and save an Imperial world? Or did a cunning foe subject the Chapter to a decapitation strike, forcing his promotion to fill a vital leadership position? Edited October 29, 2020 by Bjorn Firewalker Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5624308 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Lunkhead Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 Nice work Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5624332 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted October 29, 2020 Author Share Posted October 29, 2020 Thanks again, you two. Gavril's model looks appropriately fierce. An age of 122 seems young for a Space Marine Captain, though; the 50-year-old Leandros was considered "young and inexperienced" in the 2011 video game Warhammer 40,000: Space Marine. What acts of valor did he perform to EARN that rank? Did he kill an Ork Warboss to end a Waaagh! and save an Imperial world? Or did a cunning foe subject the Chapter to a decapitation strike, forcing his promotion to fill a vital leadership position? Good question! I wrote Gavril's lore on the fly, so the question didn't really occur to me. I'd imagine that the circumstances of his promotion are not unlike your second guess. The high-intensity warfare conducted by the Strigoi causes severe casualties, a circumstance officers are naturally not exempt from. Gavril was likely the most suitable canidate available after his predecessor fell. Taking command of that was left of the 9th company, he'll have grown into the role out of necessity and earned his place at the proverbial table. Bjorn Firewalker 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5624430 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Lunkhead Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 Another thing to consider is that rare soul who demonstrates natural affinity for command. Upon recognition, these individuals are singled out and groomed for command. A real world example is Dwight Eisenhower, who within two years rose from Lieutenant Colonel to Supreme Allied Commander in Europe during World War II. A 40Kverse example is Iron Snakes Brother Sergeant Priad of Damocles Squad. He was trained by Brother Sergeant Raphon for command of Damocles upon his election to the squad. Five years later Priad was leader of Damocles upon the death of Raphon. A lot can happen to a young space marine in 122 years Deadass and Bjorn Firewalker 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5624606 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Perils Posted March 5, 2021 Share Posted March 5, 2021 I'll admit, I really like the idea of an "out" blood angel's successor, though it does raise the question of whether they keep their cousins' secret. I also really like your article's presentation - it makes it much nicer to read and I definitely appreciate the effort you've put into it :Tu: (TBC) Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5674719 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 (edited) Hey, thanks! Glad you enjoyed the read. I wanna get a couple of models built and take some pictures soon, just to make the article a little more interesting to look at. I'd imagine the Strigoi would still keep the Flaw under wraps, kinda like how Chapters like the Flesh Eaters or -Tearers would. They might embrace their heritage, but that doesn't mean they judge everyone worthy of insight into it! At the moment I'm working on a rather sizeable update for the LASC, including an expanded history, a revamp of their organisation and their chapter cult. Hoping that I'll have it ready come next weekend, but I can't make any promises! Edited March 5, 2021 by AHorriblePerson Doctor Perils and KBA 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5674826 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted March 26, 2021 Author Share Posted March 26, 2021 (edited) It's certainly been a while, but here we are. I've pushed out another update for the Strigoi - and it's a big one! I'd usually put the sections that were overhauled here, but since almost the entire thing got rewritten, I'll stick to a few notes: The history section got expanded upon, describing how the wider Imperium was made aware of the Chapter. Veriad and the Veriad System got renamed to Maragrad and Marag respectively - names I am much more happy with. I made another attempt at describing the Strigoi's warrior culture and finally got the concept I had in mind across (I think). I added more pictures! The first one is a piece I commissioned from the talented Polina Zubareva - I highly recommend getting in touch with her because her Blanche-esque style fits perfectly into 40k. The other pic is of a 5-man squad of Strigoi that mark the beginning of a 500pt force I'm hoping to have completed once it's safe to visit stores again. If Brother-Sergeant Matei seems vaguely familiar, it's because I based him on a marine made by The Observer - the Marines Revenant, his own IX Legion-inspired homebrew, were an invaluable reference to get the aesthetic for my own guys right. This isn't everything, of course - most of what is coming are a few new phrases here and there, some tweaks to two of the characters and the battles (hence why they're not in the article for the time being). But as I mentioned to Doctor Perils, I also want to have another go at the organisation section. This is especially necessary after describing the Strigoi as a Crusade Chapter in the header - something I've always imagined them to be, but never really wrote down anywhere before. The other big thing that needs coverage is the addendum that replaced the Blooded Maw: the Waning, a genetic phenomenon that should add a bit of extra flavor to a Chapter full of warmongers. More on that when it's time. Even though the main themes stayed the same, I highly encourage a re-read of the article - not only to help me spot any mistakes, but also because I'd like to know whether you think the Chapter has sufficient depth! I'm very excited about the feedback. Being very busy both hobby-wise and irl means that progress here is slow, but don't worry - I'm far from done with the Strigoi. -Horrible Edited April 2, 2021 by AHorriblePerson KBA, TrawlingCleaner and Brother Lunkhead 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5683289 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bjorn Firewalker Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 The additional details are welcome. Initially identified via auspex as a cluster of subterranean storage facilities, subsequent expeditions performed by veteran kill teams revealed the satellite had been hollowed out to accommodate a Terran star fort of ancient provenance.Is this star fort still Warp-capable, and deployed when the Strigoi need its firepower to support campaigns on distant worlds? Or is it permanently grounded within the moon? Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5683299 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted March 26, 2021 Author Share Posted March 26, 2021 Nope - the Duskhold is completely stationary, as explained later on in the section: A Fortress Between the Stars [...] Centuries later, the Duskhold still stands firm as a symbol of Imperial supremacy. That it is confined to Maragrad’s orbit does not impede its deadliness, far from it: no effort was spared to ensure the monastery’s defences can stymie any threat to the home world at considerable range. In truth, the monastery isn't much more than a gene-seed repository and a training ground for recruits to the Chapter (which I'll work into the article when I tackle the 'Organisation'-section again). In that regard, it is a lot like Vilamus, the fortress of the Marines Errant. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5683445 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KBA Posted March 26, 2021 Share Posted March 26, 2021 Really great read. The prose, especially in the beginning of the origins section reminds me very much of the HH black books’ narrative. Boarder-line gymnastics yet concrete enough in its cryptic delivery to convince me it’s been written in-universe by a realized character. Some thoughts below: Although the hope of one day restoring such precious knowledge is a feeble one at best, those who yen for it are not restricted to baseless supposition. Yearn? Ken? Chapter history proper begins in M.35 as they are discovered fighting insurgencies following the secession of Nova Terra. Given their complete ignorance of these warriors’ mere existence (one among countless victims of Imperial bureaucracy, no doubt), the High Senate dispatches an Inquisitorial envoy to find and learn more of this unknown quantity. Their efforts are met with little success as they can barely determine a Blood Angels descent and purported ident-code (Cross-ref.: ‘Chapter 101’) before the Astartes depart, decrying the entire affair as “idle prattle.” So has most known intelligence on the Strigoi been gathered: collected piecemeal in the wake of unnumbered battlefields. It is not the only custom born that day, for their apparent skill at slaying traitors did not go unnoticed. Stamping out these would-be revolutions has caused the Chapter to hold a special grudge for those enemies hiding among subjects loyal to the Golden Throne; a hatred the Lords of the Imperium do not refuse to call upon. I found the shift here to somewhat of a present tense a little awkward, especially as it switches back later in the paragraph, and it took me out of the article briefly. Love the content though. A quick edit: Chapter history proper begins in M.35 as they were discovered fighting insurgencies following the secession of Nova Terra. Given their complete ignorance of these warriors’ mere existence (one among countless victims of Imperial bureaucracy, no doubt), the High Senate dispatched an Inquisitorial envoy to find and learn more of this unknown quantity. Their efforts were met with little success as they could barely determine a Blood Angels descent and purported ident-code (Cross-ref.: ‘Chapter 101’) before the Astartes departure, decrying the entire affair as “idle prattle.” So has most known intelligence on the Strigoi been gathered: collected piecemeal in the wake of unnumbered battlefields. It is not the only custom born that day, for their apparent skill at slaying traitors did not go unnoticed. Stamping out these would-be revolutions has caused the Chapter to hold a special grudge for those enemies hiding among subjects loyal to the Golden Throne; a hatred the Lords of the Imperium do not refuse to call upon. Of course it is their more aberrant quirks for which the bloodline is famous; the twin flaws that have coloured their history for millennia. Most prominent of these is the Red Thirst, that primal craving for flesh and blood which has to be held in check constantly lest its bearers tear themselves apart. The Black Rage on the other hand manifests itself at the end of a battle-brother’s lifespan. Simultaneously the strongest tie to their Primarch and the greatest burden they possess, it forces them to experience their progenitor’s final moments in a delirium from which there is no escape. It is a wicked irony, then, that their very flesh ensures that these Space Marines die as they lived; caked in gore, screaming oaths to a father that cannot hear them. I’m always a little cautious of retreading well-known facts in IA articles, but I can’t argue the beauty of this paragraph, especially that last sentence. Of particular note is the regular custom of gladiatoria, ritual combat serving not only to establish individual skill-at-arms but as an outlet for the mania perpetually gnawing at the Chapter’s spirits. Death is no stranger among the contestants despite the duels’ cathartic purpose, a circumstance that cannot be explained away entirely by debts of honour or slights avenged. This is a fantastic touch. The beliefs section really gave some great insight into how the chapter thinks. Well done. There was a little bit of slow-down for me in the Homeworld section. I think this is because it only describes a feral world that makes for great recruitment— it’s impact not really felt in the article beyond being a place for the Hold to float around. Any thought to abandoning the home world if you are wanting these guys to be a crusading chapter? Maragrad doesn’t seem to inform the Chapters’ culture much— that seems to have come from the mysterious events post-heresy and their genetic afflictions. Anyways, just some thoughts. Overall, a fantastic read! Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5683448 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted March 26, 2021 Author Share Posted March 26, 2021 Hey KBA, glad to hear you enjoyed giving it another read! I promise to give your Omega Hounds another thorough look soon; I just need to find the time. I'll work the edits and suggestions you made into the article now, thanks for spotting 'em! I hear you about regurgitating known lore. I definitely agree, but decided it was important to give a little context given that Blood Angels gene-seed inevitably plays into their beliefs. For most people, that's gonna be useless exposition, though, that's true. Maragrad... yeah. I added a homeworld simply because I wanted one at the time, I think. On one hand, I'm finally pleased with how it's described, on the other, you're right - the Chapter honestly doesn't need it. Maybe I'll shift the Hold to being situated in an asteroid field or something... I'll have to give this more thought once the other pending updates are dealt with. Again, thanks for your feedback. That was certainly an eye-opener! KBA 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5683463 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebulon Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 Having read this properly, I fear I have no criticism. I enjoy a darker take on the lineage of the Blood Angels, and when a loyalist chapter appears possibly more savage and brutal than the servants of the Dark Gods. In short, well done. Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5683922 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted March 29, 2021 Author Share Posted March 29, 2021 Glad to hear you dig the Chapter, but I'm sure I can still improve upon the lore! Hope you'll feel the same way once I crank out the next update (whenever that may be). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5684111 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Perils Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 Hi, the continuation of my previous post was a long Time coming, sorry. 1 - again, great presentation: obviously the content is great too, but the presentation is exemplary. Headers, correctly sized paragraphs, easy punctuation help the legibility, and images and text boxes really brings the article to life. Well done :Tu: 2 - if there is one thing I feel is missing from the article, it's broad line description of a couple of exemplary battles. I'm not saying to go into black library style bolter porn, just at least an overview of a few important chapters of their history 3 - do they have any particular trials and rites for an aspirant to become a neophyte, or a neophyte to become a full Astartes? 4 - what are the relations between the blood angels and other successors, and the Strigoi? Do they know the reason the Strigoi were stripped of their colours? Do the Strigoi in fact? 5 - what of their relationship with other chapters and imperial institutions? 6 - is "Strigoi" the high gothic name, or a local dialect one? Is it derived from the name of their founder? Do they have a low gothic translation of the name (one that resembles English words like "Space Sharks" to the Carcharadons)? 7 - did anything particular in their history push them to adopt the 8 battle companies? Even crusading chapters (apart from BTs) seem to follow the Codex Astartes in its broad lines, so why don't these? As you'll see, these are mostly nitpicks, which really is the sign of a great IA article, very good job :) Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5684579 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted March 30, 2021 Author Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) Welcome Back, Doctor! No worries - I'm happy to receive any feedback, belated or not. 1. - Glad you enjoy the formatting so much! I'm always worried the sheer volume of text is gonna turn people off reading it, so hearing that you found the article pleasant to look at is a huge relief. 2. - Battles would definitely be useful, yeah. The article contained two up until when I last updated it, which is when I removed them because they weren't up to my personal standard anymore. New ones will be coming, though; that's a promise. 3. - Honestly? Nothing worth mentioning. Maragrad, primary recruiting fief and nominal homeworld of the Strigoi, forges aspirants ideally suited to the exacting standards of a Space Marine Chapter. They have more sources for recruits, of course. Of the two briefly mentioned in the 'Organisation'-section, Vilis is a hive world permeated by dangerous radiation while I imagine Daumathar to be a lot like Bodt. The Chapter knows that survival on these planets matches any test they could throw at these youths, "only" testing them for purity of mind and genetic compatibility. The Strigoi need to be pragmatic like that - the Curse coupled with their high activity means that their ranks erode at a worrisome pace. I think this pragmatism would also show itself in how they train their neophytes as well, seeing how the Strigoi would be hard-pressed to advance them to servie alongside their line brethren. What would be the quickest way achieve that for this particular Chapter? Easy - even MORE cannibalism! Using the Omophagea to impart the wisdom of former battle brothers onto new ones seems like a given. Another possibility would be additional psychological conditioning, similar to what the Minotaurs make use of. Perhaps it's even some unsavoury combination of the two? I think that's something the narrator is gonna ponder on once I rewrite 'Hierarchy of the Host'. Thanks for this question. Gives me lots to think about! 4. - As touched upon in the introduction, the Strigoi are on bad terms with most, if not all of the Chapters of the Blood/ Sanguinary Brotherhood. I'd imagine that those Chapters more inclined to brutality have less of a problem with them, but claiming that the Emperor Himself willed them to be ravenous berserkers is sure to upset even some of them. The material on the Horus Heresy showed us in no unclear terms that He had a far less noble side, but most Space Marines would decry a statement like that as utter blasphemy. Still if something horrible were to happen, like, say, Tyranids attacking their Primarch's birthworld, I'm sure even the Strigoi would lend a hand. As for the other part of your question: Perhaps they do know, perhaps they don't. With all the bad blood between them (pun not intended, I swear!), it's certainly nothing they like to talk about. Being a huge proponent of the notion that 40k needs some mystery as part of its allure, I wanted to refrain from spelling out the past of a Chapter so obviously inspired by the lore of the Revenant Legion. I think there's enough information in the article to allow various possibilities without any one seeming more likely than another. I have my own ideas on just where the Strigoi originated from, but I don't feel the need to write it out in full - anything I present the reader with would be more boring than the theories they come up with themselves. 5. - The article mentions that the Chapter maintains a cordial relationship with the forge world Medea Prime (which may get renamed in the future, we'll see) and has occasionally been called upon by the throneworld to eradicate enemies from within the Imperium - stuff like Chaos- or Genestealer Cults, renegade Militarum regiments and maybe even Space Marines. I'd imagine they are considered a valued asset, if not exactly a favoured one. I'll figure out whether I can emphasise this a little bit more in the future. Relations with other Chapters would likely depend on the Chapter in question - I'd imagine the Strigoi would get along fairly well with the Executioners while the White Consuls would shun their company, if possible. Apart from their blood brothers, there's noone worth noting. 6. - I believe 'Strigoi' is their name in high gothic (or a variation thereof). The introduction briefly mentions their "fabeled namesake", referring to the mythological creature and chosen for its restless nature. I figured if descriptions of manticores, gryphons, minotaurs and whatnot managed to survive into the 41st millennium, why not them as well? The way I understand it, names like 'Vlka Fenryka' and 'Carcharodons Astra' fell out of favor with the common folk because of their length and roots in languages not spoken by most Imperials. 'Strigoi' is fairly short and easy to remember, and so they get away with it. I'm not planning to expand on the origin of their name in the article, but given valid arguments, I'm open to being persuaded otherwise! 7. - I don't think there was any one historic event that made them reorganise to have eight battle companies, more that it was a natural progression for them as they saw their numbers dwindle due to the Thirst and attrition. The Codex Astartes is still at the heart of the Chapter's war philosophy, and it dictates that the battle company forms the heart of a Chapter Strike Force. The way I see it, the Strigoi believe that they can match the effectiveness of other, bigger Chapters by having more battle companies roam the galaxy. I'm glad you asked this - this helped me start organising my thoughts on the matter, but I'll try to be clearer in the revamped 'Organisation'-section. Nitpicks or not, these were great food for thought. I'll make some notes and be sure to take all of this into consideration! Edited March 30, 2021 by AHorriblePerson Doctor Perils 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5684695 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadass Posted April 3, 2021 Author Share Posted April 3, 2021 (edited) I've got no update for the article ready, but the artwork I commissioned made it here the other day. I made a high-res scan and did a bit of editing in Photoshop, figured I'd put the results here: Hidden Content I'm really happy with the job Polina did on the Strigoi. The plan is to commission a few more artists for an eventual pdf that'll go even more in-depth on the Chapter, tackling their heraldry and maybe even some bespoke character rules. Really excited to start working on that once the article is complete. Happy Easter Weekend, everyone! Edited April 3, 2021 by AHorriblePerson Brother Lunkhead 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5685744 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrus Manus Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 "Come not between the Dragon and His Wrath."- Strigoi Chapter Motto Nice I have to say in terms of the article, I don't really have any comments. It's pretty well written, and has a nice internal logic to it, and I rather enjoyed reading it. I think, if you were looking to add to it or expand the lore of the Chapter - even as an internal exercise, given the 'lack' of official Imperial records on the Chapter - it would be worth thinking about how various Imperial organisations deal with the Chapter, and how this affects them 'day to day.' I'd imagine that they all pretty much have a difficult/ aggressive relationship with the Chapter. So for example, in one of the side bars you mention about the Chapter's ties with the AdMech for their supplies. But given how untrusted the Chapter seem to be by other parties, why has the AdMech not turned their back on their oaths? Similarly, there are a lot of parallels here with the Sons of Malice. In that, they had cannibalistic tendencies which ultimately got them Excommunicated. So, why not these guys? Why does the Inquisition seem content to leave them be, given their natures? I think developing these relationships and the consequences of them really will help strengthen what is already a pretty good article. Deadass 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359532-the-strigoi-lasc-2021-updated-260321/page/4/#findComment-5690016 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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