Holy cow assault centurions

[brother_b]

I’m currently watching a ghost hunting show with Ozzy’s son as the lead investigator. How far I’ve fallen.

 

Anyway, I played against some assault centurions in a successor chapter army. The amount of shots, high save, high tough, and high WS was super surprising. They felt like what my assault robots should be. They’re pretty cheap points wise too. I don’t think they had an invuln but all in all I was really impressed.

 

Do any of you still run assault bots? Heh, wait let me rephrase that; have any of you ever run assault bots?

 

For the price I’m considering looking elsewhere. Maybe stick bros in a transport. I haven’t priced that out but would probably be comparable to my robots.

 

Also, I think the centurions had a way to score mortals on a charge. Gnarley.

 

Cheers.

 

I lost btw.

[Aothaine]

The Spider from Tabletop Tactics loves the assault bots and rates them very highly. They use them in a lot of their batreps. 

[brother_b]

The Spider from Tabletop Tactics loves the assault bots and rates them very highly. They use them in a lot of their batreps.

 

Not familiar with that specific arachnid. Any idea why he/she/it rates them highly?

 

I have used them as more of a distraction, especially with my Stygies move. When they get to punch it’s butter, but many times they’re shot down pre-punching. Double attack mode is nice, but I’m almost wondering if I should go full fist bot, like 4-6 instead of the pair I currently run.

[Xisor]

I had some good success with a big squad of four in a 1500pts game last night - against Necrons.

 

He'd a doomsday ark, but not much else of anti-tankness. But that's okay, as I had four Fistellans, a Dunerider and a Sydonian that just sat up backfield. (+30 Vanguard, Ten Rangers, three arc-brearchers, Engineseer, Dominus, Daedolosus, Manipulus, Datasmith and 5 Ruststalkers)

 

A fair amount of LoS blocking terrain and cover too.

 

He rolled relatively badly for the Ark and for some reanimation protocols, but it was essentially: 1 Ark, 30 Warriors, 5 Immortals, 4 Wraiths, 4 Destroyers, 6 Tombblades, 6 Scarabs, Overlord & 2 Cryoteks, Mephrit dynasty too.

 

The bots did alright. Tanked *a lot* of fire that would have swept away my Skitarii had he gone for them - and the weight of fire my Vanguard put out is enough to do some damage, which is nice.

 

They got into combat turn two, and I was pleasantly chuffed with the bonus they get having a manipulus nearby. Make that mani warlord and part of the Cybernetic maniple, and I found he was mighty.

 

It also left the Dominus & Daedo as a handy duo sat right amidst two big squads of Skitarii Vanguard blasting away at 15-18" range. (+1BS Protocol on one, Daedolosus on the other, reroll 1s for all... Lots of S3 dice that people don't know quite what to make of.)

 

 

I digress.

 

Bots: lost one immediately to shooting; ark wasn't able to draw a line on them fortunately. Took out a Destroyer by virtue of Aegis+Forcefield

 

Shortly pummelled the Immortals thanks to punch protocol, Ryza and Chant of the Remorseless Fist... But even then, it was still just six attacks. Then another six at the Warriors after a pile-in, which did in five of those for only token wound in return.

 

Next turn they were withdrawn from, and lost the wounded bot to weight of fire; withdrawal meant I went for Binharic Override to switch protocol back to Aegis given the heavy fire. Mephrit Dynasty at close range too, meant a lot of Ap-2 shots, where the 4+Inv w/mortal wounds on 6s was worthwhile.

 

Got charged by scarabs & Overlord - scarabs did mortal wounds via a strategems, but not enough to kill the third bot, so used a few CP to counterstrike and try to land some blows on the Overlord (who'd been brought down to three wounds by Transuranic Arquebusters on the 2*5 Rangers).

 

Again, Chant & RYZA happily mean 4+ re-rolling 1s and 2+s re-rolling 1s to wound, which from only three attacks form the nearest bit was actually enough to do two wounds on the Overlord.

 

One saved (4+Inv). He used a CP to re-roll the other, but it still went through.

 

After that assault (first three selections in the first Fight phase of turn three), we called the game as it was getting late - it was a 7-3 victory to me on some objectives.

 

That last spree of CPs did net me the kill the warlord.

 

Just behind my bots, however, was the six Tombblades looking to charge my Datasmith and Warlord Manipulus. (RYZA, Cybernetic a warlord trait, and Anzion's pseudogenitor - so he'd have been doing +2d6 additional attacks, and if the Manipulus or Datasmith hit with their normal attacks, they could have done-in a Tombblade with each wound...)

 

It was a close game.

 

Main thing that helped was, in my esteem:

1- actually remembering some of the damn rules

 

2- yellow+black paint job on my Dunerider (actually aGoliath Truck count-as) & Arc Breachers make people really feel the need to persecute them. They're not serious threats, but they attract an inordinate amount of firepower, and don't just blow away in a stiff breeze. (Unlike the Skitarii..., but I was glad they didn't shoot them, as they actually do things!)

 

3- Not being too focused on punching things with the bots. Getting Remorseless Fist, RYZA and Punch Datawafer in all in the same turn made them "optimal" (Well, despite the wasted incendines), but being happy to revert hem immediately back to Aegis rather than Punch once their movement phase was done seemed v. Prudent.

 

A few slightly worse rolls for me, or better for my opponent, would have left me in the sore loser category with useless fistbots once again - but I think using them as "threatening tanks" rather than super-damage-dealers is the better way to think of them.

 

Lots of potential, but limited by low attacks, low WS and the awkward "flexibility" of "fights twice" rather than "doubles attacks" or "+2 to hit" or somesuch.

 

Didn't need to use my Cybernetica tools, but if the Necrons'd played more cautiously, or more aggressively, I would have been glad to have had the option of better healing or better charging.

[Gaz1858]

I try Fistbots every now and again as I desperately want them to be good BUT for the price you pay per model they just arent. 105points is a pretty steep price for 3 attacks with WS4+ and a flamer, and to be honest thats all it is. Yes you can go double attack for 6, but then the flamer is useless. They have no inv which really does hurt them in combat.

 

I am sure you can pull a fast one with Stygies or Lucius and the +3" charge (remember the datasmith tax!) but outside of that theyre not great.

 

Look at costs against 3 Fist bots

3 Fist Bots with Flamers - 315 (+41 for the Datasmith if you want +3" = 356)

12 Fulgurites in a Termite Drill - 326

20 Fulgurites - 320

10 Hoplites in a Dunerider - 163

5 Dragoons - 340

 

I mean any of the other assault options that admech have are better than the bots. 

[brother_b]

I try Fistbots every now and again as I desperately want them to be good BUT for the price you pay per model they just arent. 105points is a pretty steep price for 3 attacks with WS4+ and a flamer, and to be honest thats all it is. Yes you can go double attack for 6, but then the flamer is useless. They have no inv which really does hurt them in combat.

 

I am sure you can pull a fast one with Stygies or Lucius and the +3" charge (remember the datasmith tax!) but outside of that theyre not great.

 

Look at costs against 3 Fist bots

3 Fist Bots with Flamers - 315 (+41 for the Datasmith if you want +3" = 356)

12 Fulgurites in a Termite Drill - 326

20 Fulgurites - 320

10 Hoplites in a Dunerider - 163

5 Dragoons - 340

 

I mean any of the other assault options that admech have are better than the bots.

 

Basically how I’m feeling. I think those centurions have four attacks. I do love the robot models, and may keep the pair, but warglaives seem a better option for anti tank, horde (Moirax), and anti custodes (helverin).

 

Does... not... compute.

[Prot]

I agree with the above. I’ve tried them in pairs just to be a sandbag, but at 4WS they don’t hit enough and go down quick. I’ve had a similarly pointed GSC Abberrant squad absolutely smoke a 3 man squad the other night.

 

This is why I repeatedly go back to Knights. In today’s meta Knights should be part of AdMech. Too many hard counters out there for AdMech right now. You need a firm frontline that is absolutely beastly in CC and can take a punch.

[Gaz1858]

To be honest I think the whole Dex needs redone.

 

Rerolls to affect more than the shooting phase

Some form of close combat buff character or rule

Lower points almost across the board

Warlord Traits and Relics that are actually worth a damn

Remove the Skitarii/Cult Mechanicus keywords and just use Adeptus Mechanicus

We dont have FLY at all!

A bigger range of models/units - Give us 30K models. Theyre there. We want to buy them

[Colonel Cross]

Gaz bringing the Omnissiah's truth in here. 

 

AdMech are very peculiar. Tons of mid strength, mid AP shooting. Some invulns. Some invulns which only work against shooting. A focus on shooting so that's fine. And then a melee focus on canticles and HQs that are more melee focused (or at least short ranged) than shooting.  It just feels patchworked and disjointed. And that is really sad, as I absolutely love the lore and the aesthetics. Don't even get me started on the beauty of Thanatars, Domitars, Castellax, and Thallax ... imagine having access to Thallax and their mobility. Or the capability they could give the Thanatar so we wouldn't HAVE to resort to knights for their durability. 

[Aothaine]

 

Not familiar with that specific arachnid. Any idea why he/she/it rates them highly?

 

I have used them as more of a distraction, especially with my Stygies move. When they get to punch it’s butter, but many times they’re shot down pre-punching. Double attack mode is nice, but I’m almost wondering if I should go full fist bot, like 4-6 instead of the pair I currently run.

 

He feels they are under-rated and they always soak fire from his other units. So he uses them as a sort of distraction carnifex. Because if they do make it into combat with something there are strats you can employ to make them shred what ever they come in contact with.

 

Check some of their batreps. They make mistakes occasionally but so does everyone. They are entertaining to watch and have a pretty good set of strategic minds.

[DanPesci]

I try Fistbots every now and again as I desperately want them to be good BUT for the price you pay per model they just arent. 105points is a pretty steep price for 3 attacks with WS4+ and a flamer, and to be honest thats all it is. Yes you can go double attack for 6, but then the flamer is useless. They have no inv which really does hurt them in combat.

 

I am sure you can pull a fast one with Stygies or Lucius and the +3" charge (remember the datasmith tax!) but outside of that theyre not great.

 

Look at costs against 3 Fist bots

3 Fist Bots with Flamers - 315 (+41 for the Datasmith if you want +3" = 356)

12 Fulgurites in a Termite Drill - 326

20 Fulgurites - 320

10 Hoplites in a Dunerider - 163

5 Dragoons - 340

 

I mean any of the other assault options that admech have are better than the bots. 

 

 

The other unit I'd add into this is breachers. Although naturally not the most obviosuly strong CC unit, they can pack a punch when setup in a list correctly.

 

squads of 6 with the hydraulic claws put out 18 attacks at less than 2/3rds the cost of 3 punchy bots.

they all have a semi decent shooting attack (great anti MEQ, TEQ, light vehicle killers)

their attacks hit on 5s (with hydraulic claws), but with a character with prime hermeticon nearby, rerolling all misses helps to mitigate the WS5. Those that do hit are S10 D3 damage.

T5 and 3 wounds (with a 3+) is decent, with shoudsalm even better, and running them in the servitor maniple means you can get an inv save

that inv save and attacks can be increased with acquisition at any cost.

 

So yeah, you need some list and CP investment to get full potential out of them, but ive had them murder things in CC and be a unit people really dont want to charge high value units into. (Also need to note i run stygies, so the pregame shunt up the table and the -1 to hit certainly helps)

[MechMan799]

I try Fistbots every now and again as I desperately want them to be good BUT for the price you pay per model they just arent. 105points is a pretty steep price for 3 attacks with WS4+ and a flamer, and to be honest thats all it is. Yes you can go double attack for 6, but then the flamer is useless. They have no inv which really does hurt them in combat.

 

I am sure you can pull a fast one with Stygies or Lucius and the +3" charge (remember the datasmith tax!) but outside of that theyre not great.

 

Look at costs against 3 Fist bots

3 Fist Bots with Flamers - 315 (+41 for the Datasmith if you want +3" = 356)

12 Fulgurites in a Termite Drill - 326

20 Fulgurites - 320

10 Hoplites in a Dunerider - 163

5 Dragoons - 340

 

I mean any of the other assault options that admech have are better than the bots. 

 

But also factor in soft stats.  The Bots have M- 8", not bad, charge +3" with cohort strat stacking with Mr. Mani. They also have the resilience to take hits on the way there.

- The E-Priests, you may want to reduce to a count of 11 and throw in a Mani with them cause if they don't make their charge they are gone, bye bye. 

- 20 E-priests, same deal, teleport them in and pray to the Omnissiah with a high voltage dildo up your you-know-where for the charge roll to go off.

- 10 Hoplites aren't bad, but you're not targeting the same targets as you're only Str 6, -1 AP, 1 dmg unless a vehicle then D3.  They are better for light vehicles/MEQ

- 5 Dragoons are a more compelling case as they are fairly mobile (advance then charge strat would be awwwwesome), -2 to hit as Stygies for marching up the board and their Str 8 tasers, -1 AP, 2 dmg with the exploding on 6's (4's with strat).  Unfortunately for the dragoons are their low inv of 6+, and save of only 4+, with the 6 wounds same as the Bots.

 

So they all achieve different effects while not always going after the same targets.

 

What I like to do is if I plan on going for a melee focused list, include enough threats that your opponent has to choose which threat to deal with first.

My last list had 3 Warglaives supporting each other on one flank with my Fisty Bots and Dragoons on the opposite flank. The Bots and Dragoons supported each other with their presence, where if one were to engage in combat, the other could then jump in to support or deal with a close by target.

 

Relying on only one melee unit gives your opponent easy choices of who to target and also when to target said unit. Threat overload.  Make 'em make tough decisions.