TorvaldTheMild Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 Anyone else think GW should sell the main rule books as ebooks and then every change they make they can update the rules but the rule book is still in one source. For a person that does not play often, its so hard to remember all the rules and even to remember what source they are in, whether its in the FAQ or the Chapter approved etc. Just using your codex and rule book already uses up a lot of time during a game. Especially when you collect many armies, I collect nearly all factions and tonnes of sub factions so even with my Primary army I can't remember all the rules and do need to look at the codex a lot but with all the different sources its a nightmare. Even if they want to make money from chapter approved, when it comes out I'd be happy to pay them to download the rules set again which has all the information in the main rules. I'd rather have an updated rule book than another chapter approved book, they'd still make money and they can update the codex's, they can still sell the hard copies and people will buy them but they have ebook technology and they really aren't using it to its fullest. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gederas Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 I'd point you to Warmachine/Hordes as why doing that is a bad idea. They did that with V3, and flat-out started hemorrhaging players because of it. I mean, your complaint can be summed up as "I've spread myself too thin by collecting almost every single faction in the game and I blame GW for me having to remember all the rules!". That's on you, not on GW. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5424067 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TorvaldTheMild Posted November 11, 2019 Author Share Posted November 11, 2019 No, the problem is still there its just worsened by me collecting more. We have hard copy rules that we pay tonnes for, its a bit rich for GW to expect us to memorise anything and most of the stuff is on the internet. Lots of people 'spread themselves thin' and collect many armies, a lot of us have been collecting since 1st and 2nd edition and therefore have tonnes of armies. They shouldn't be penalised for giving the most the GW and a business has to take into account all of its market, not just for people that have single armies. If you don't think the rules are bloated (which is fine) but also completely un-user friendly so to speak then you are being disingenuous. It would take a genius to fix it and consolidate it, nor would it be unreasonable. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5424070 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Tyler Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 Yes, I think that GW should apply FAQ/errata updates to the digital versions of the rules to support players that purchase the digital versions. For players that use the hard copy books, the current system is sufficient. I think that both methods need to be used in order to support the diversity in the player base. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5424235 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Yncarne Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 For the most point my digital rule book and codexes get updated with point changes and reworded rules based on FAQs and errata However, some stuff does appear to not be added, mostly stuff found in the Chapter Approved that could be added to the main rulebook but isn’t. I also wish there was a digital subscription option to allow multiple purchases such as rule book plus 3 codexes or all chaos codexes which would last the edition’s lifecycle. However, I’m not sure GW would do it in a player friendly manner so it’s probably for the best. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5424246 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcomet Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 I'd point you to Warmachine/Hordes as why doing that is a bad idea. They did that with V3, and flat-out started hemorrhaging players because of it. I mean, your complaint can be summed up as "I've spread myself too thin by collecting almost every single faction in the game and I blame GW for me having to remember all the rules!". That's on you, not on GW. well that, and the fact that W3 was woefully designed and atrociously unbalanced. They basically killed their own games by poor games design. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5424248 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaVolt87 Posted November 11, 2019 Share Posted November 11, 2019 Yes, I think that GW should apply FAQ/errata updates to the digital versions of the rules to support players that purchase the digital versions. For players that use the hard copy books, the current system is sufficient. I think that both methods need to be used in order to support the diversity in the player base. If they did that, I would grudgingly accept their ebook rules and codex prices. I really want that going forward, especially for HH. This should already have been a thing from day dot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5424261 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermintide Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 I'm sure GW will gladly sell you another book that contains an index of references to each rule and which book it's in, for a very reasonable £20.That's great value if you think about all the time you'd save, and you'd only have to buy a new one once a year! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5424959 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TorvaldTheMild Posted November 12, 2019 Author Share Posted November 12, 2019 I'm sure GW will gladly sell you another book that contains an index of references to each rule and which book it's in, for a very reasonable £20. That's great value if you think about all the time you'd save, and you'd only have to buy a new one once a year! That's not exactly what I'm talking about. I mean a rulebook that has everything updated in the 'rulebook' accept for the codex stuff but they can just update the codex's which they don't seem to be doing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425023 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 GW already sells ebook versions of their rulebooks and they automatically incorporate FAQs and Chapter Approved point changes. What else is needed? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425032 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aarik Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 I think there are two separate issues: (1) FAQs and erratas not being included in digital versions (which is compounded by the fact that these updates can drastically change how effective rules are; see, e.g. the Iron Hands nerf), and (2) the fact that rules for factions are spread across several different books. Issue 1 is not ideal, but more palatable to me because I would rather deal with having to find these updates/fixes than not have them at all. Issue 2, however, is becoming more problematic in my opinion. It is especially clear with Psychic Awakening book 2. We JUST had a new space marine codex released; there's no good reason these new character upgrade strategems should not have been included. Similarly, the Black Templars rules should have been included in the Imperial Fists supplement, like the Crimson Fists were. On the Chaos side, we had a relatively useless new Codex put out several months ago. All of these "new" traitor legion rules should have been included back then, or the new Codex delayed until now so they could have been included. [Leaving aside the issue that the new Codex did little to fix the problems that CSM has as a faction.] Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425036 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arson Fire Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 I'd point you to Warmachine/Hordes as why doing that is a bad idea. They did that with V3, and flat-out started hemorrhaging players because of it. I mean, your complaint can be summed up as "I've spread myself too thin by collecting almost every single faction in the game and I blame GW for me having to remember all the rules!". That's on you, not on GW. well that, and the fact that W3 was woefully designed and atrociously unbalanced. They basically killed their own games by poor games design. Along with how they disbanded their volunteer local community manager system (press gangers) at the same time. Also shutting down their official forums. Destroying your own community and support systems is not a good way to get or retain players. There are a lot of reasons that game lost popularity. Their WarRoom app being obnoxious may be one of them, but it's far from the reason. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425041 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Casman Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 We're also not here to discuss Warmachine/Hordes and any mistakes Privateer Press may have made in the course of doing business. =][= Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425047 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vermintide Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 I'm sure GW will gladly sell you another book that contains an index of references to each rule and which book it's in, for a very reasonable £20. That's great value if you think about all the time you'd save, and you'd only have to buy a new one once a year! That's not exactly what I'm talking about. I mean a rulebook that has everything updated in the 'rulebook' accept for the codex stuff but they can just update the codex's which they don't seem to be doing. That was meant to be a joke bro. It's just the kind of backward non-solution GW would come up with, and certain folks here would trip over themselves to defend. They really do need to do an 8th V2 which rolls all the FAQ, CA and WD stuff into one. I can understand the campaign stuff being left out, but yeah. Book keeping for this game is kind of a mess now. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425119 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exilyth Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 In an ideal world, GW would release regularly updated rules-only printerfriendly versions with only minimal typesetting/design work done as free downloads and sell proper printed and ebook versions with lore, miniature photos and proper design/typesetting/proofreading only after the FAQs and erratas have been written and included. Some people would still not buy the rules - just like now. Some people would still buy the rules - just like now. Some people would start buying the rules, knowing their armies rules are in one place and won't be invalidated within a few weeks. Some people would no longer buy the rules, but let's be honest: they'd probably use the money saved for aquiring more models. As a side effect, people would be able to just lookup the rules of any faction, so no more gotcha moments of "that unit/stratagem/weapon can do WHAT?" in the middle of a game. Similarly, people could get to know what each army can do, making it easier to pick the right army for their playstyle and reducing wrong army choices. Also, people would be able to see the strength and weaknesses of units, so they'd be able to know which counters to buy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425229 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TorvaldTheMild Posted November 12, 2019 Author Share Posted November 12, 2019 I could see them doing the free rules thing and then still produce rule books but make them far more of a collectable, far more lore based and art based. That means they can continue selling them and lets be honest, codex's now are not that great. They have the same regurgitated lore that's been in every single codex, the same regurgitated art work etc. They could really do something great like FW used to do, like Seige of Vraks. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425238 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Yncarne Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 FAQs and errata are included in my digital codexes. What is being excluded? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425374 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenith Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 FAQs and errata are included in my digital codexes. What is being excluded? Actual fact checking? I just wish GW would accept printed codexes with digital proof of purchase. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425525 Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Yncarne Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 FAQs and errata are included in my digital codexes. What is being excluded? Actual fact checking? I just wish GW would accept printed codexes with digital proof of purchase. What do you mean actual fact checking? I’m honestly not understanding. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425550 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Perils Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 What I'd like is if they released all their datasheets as able to be clipped into a ring binder, possibly going so far as to sell the codex as just such a ring binder. Once a new campaign book comes out, with new or updated datasheets, you just clip out the old version and clip in the new version. And then when Chapter approved rolls around at the end of the year, you get the full updated points sheet for the whole codex that you replace. Job done.Obviously, ideally the rules could be free downloads, but having plastified pretty datasheets would be far more practical in my opinion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425725 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaVolt87 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Having each 40k codex just being 100% new art + lore each edition with free rules as a living PDF would be ideal. GW considers themselves a miniatures company primarily, yet we still pay for rules? I am pretty sick of recycled art and lore honestly. Moving to a high quality physical book, 100% new art + lore each new edition dex would make older books more valuable + collectible. Now imagine the main rulebook just being new art and lore for each edition setting, nothing recycled, rules separate. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425925 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wulf Vengis Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 That wouldn't be a rulebook but an artbook. However i understand what you are implying and have to agree. On both Codex and core rules subjects. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/359828-rules-consolidation/#findComment-5425953 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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