Triple Heldrakes - Viable in the marine meta?

[SyNidus]

Would it be viable to run triple heldrakes against space marines? Particularly in my night lords army where i’m planning to use them to clear primaris infiltrators and other screening units to make way for raptors next turn.

 

Other than, what about using them to threaten the enemy backline right from the start?

[MegaVolt87]

How durable are they these days? I have been looking at the firepower sweep potential of FW flyers myself instead.

[WarriorFish]

They've got the standard daemon engine profile in T7, 12W with 3+/5++ so along with Infernal Regeneration to add a wound back each turn it's decent medium armour. However it's not anything particularly special either, so an opponent with ranged AT guns can take one out if he wants to focus some attention - which is likely when he sees what it could do to his plans! That's where taking some more would help though, and a distraction carnifex has uses too

 

The D2 weaponry would certainly help a lot against 2W models, especially the Baleflamer to negate the movement penalty to hitting but that might just be painting a bigger target on it here? I'm still interested in adding a Heldrake to my forces (perhaps that should be after a second Maulerfiend?), so I'll be interested to hear more from people who've used them

[Closet Skeleton]

Heldrakes are reasonably but not amazingly durable, they just don't do any real damage. Even with damage 2 they're lucky to kill more than a single primaris marine on a charge.

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

Heldrakes are reasonably but not amazingly durable, they just don't do any real damage. Even with damage 2 they're lucky to kill more than a single primaris marine on a charge.

Yep. Heldrakes are harassment units and character killers. They also do a decent job at soaking overwatch for other units in a pinch. I believe Don Hooson had some success with 3 of them in his Purge list for a while befor switching to Hell Blades for better compatibility with the Renegade Trait.

[Cheex]

One thing I've been considering for clearing out infiltrators is a small, cheap bike squad. Three bikers, two with flamers and a combi-flamer on the champion.

 

If you don't make an Advance move, you're looking at 3D6 auto hits backed by 12 bolter shots (and another 2 at BS4+) for 89pts. If needed, you can Advance 20" up the table and still get all those flamer hits.

[Iron_Within]

Night lords helldrake's would be okay as it can trap units in combat.

However theyve not got great damage output.

However if they receive a points drop they might become more viable

[Dr_Ruminahui]

If you don't intend to be regularly advancing the bikes into flamer range, I would go with a stormbolter on the champ rather than a combiflamer - less expensive, and on a biker it always pumps out 4 shots.  IMHO, if you intend to use the unit as an objective grabber/general harasser, the extra range is worth having to roll to hit, and the cheaper cost is just an incidental and added bonus.

Edited November 25, 2019 by Dr_Ruminahui

[Captain Incompetence]

Night lords helldrake's would be okay as it can trap units in combat.

However theyve not got great damage output.

However if they receive a points drop they might become more viable

 

Night Lords Heldrakes can't trap units in combat either. The stratagem you're referring to specifically bars units with the <vehicle> keyword from using it. However, they do benefit Night Lords greatly by helping them get Vox Scream off on whatever unit you want due to their amazing mobility and speed.

[techsoldaten]

The basic role of Heldrakes in a NuMarine meta is disruption.

 

You use their movement to keep your opponent from moving forward early game, maybe try to split their forces. They compete with Raptors and Bikes for this role, with the benefit of being able to move over impassable terrain.

 

But here's the thing about Heldrakes the other's don't have, it's that base. Your opponent can move over it but not put models on it. Position the Heldrake where it controls movement and your opponent is at a disadvantage. Turn the base to cover the widest possible area and you can do some interesting things.

 

In a recent game versus NuMarines, I was able to position 2 Heldrakes to choke off an Ultramarines advance. A couple squads of Intercessors got split off from his HQs going around the Heldrakes, meaning they didn't get rerolls in subsequent turns. A Redeemer was not able to move forward until the Heldrakes were destroyed.

[SyNidus]

Thanks for the discussions and feedback. I think techsoldaten's idea about flyer bases is an interesting one. I am curious to see how much a heldrake price drop would affect viability.

[Mekhitar]

The heldrake is a flier, but it is not Aircraft. Your opponent cannot move through it.