Blood of Baal new tactica!

[Indefragable]

For what it’s worth, I think it’s fair to post lists as a “hey, here’s what I ran when encountering the situation were discussing” thing. “Hey what should I add/drop to this list?” Things should def go in the subforum.

 

[Hidden] tags certainly help as well.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

The more BA youtubers I watch, the worse I feel for our army. An alternate brigade I've been looking at (I have almost all the stuff) is MSU squads. Instead of maxing out a single DC squad, I think a 3 100 point squads may be a better option than a single brick at over 300 points.

With the increase to thunder hammers, I also think the humble power fist is a better option just to have more. Still unsure of my lists as I haven't had time to test them out. Curious though may post a couple ideas in my List thread. After the holidays, will probably pick up a few squads of VVs and whirlwinds.

[Morticon]

The more BA youtubers I watch, the worse I feel for our army.

 

Why So? 

 

An alternate brigade I've been looking at (I have almost all the stuff) is MSU squads. Instead of maxing out a single DC squad, I think a 3 100 point squads may be a better option than a single brick at over 300 points.

 

Same conclusion I've come to.  Ive taken to 2x 5 mans - one bare, one with 4 fists. If there are big screens, I use the bare bones one.  If there aren't but there are meaty targets, I use the fist one for the Forlorn Fury. Otherwise, theyre striking in. 

 

With the increase to thunder hammers, I also think the humble power fist is a better option just to have more.

 

   Agree!! And have been pushing this for the last 9 months!!   

[Spagunk]

I thought the thunder hammer increase was for characters?

[Morticon]

I thought the thunder hammer increase was for characters?

 

it was/is.  Could mean just generally. 

[Panzer]

The more BA youtubers I watch, the worse I feel for our army. 

 

To be fair most Blood Angels batreps feature either horrible lists, players forgetting half of the rules or just bad players. It's the same with T'au in batreps. One of the reasons why I pretty much stopped watching them. 

[redshadow]

I’ve watch a lot of BA youtubers too.......

 

I actually don’t think there very good at running Blood Angels, or choosing a list that’s at least semi competitive

[Xenith]

I thought the thunder hammer increase was for characters?

 

Increase relative to fists that got a significant decrease?

 

MSU DC would also be a solution to the problem I have of them being blown off the board T1. That or striking them. 2 5 man units dropping in with an UWoF chaplain/icon dude jumping to their position can reliably engage a lot of units.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Xenith

[Dont-Be-Haten]

@Mort it's generally just bad play. Last night I watched ACE from twisted dice blunder his smash captain by only selecting a single target 11" away instead of selecting multiple targets. He fluffs the 11" charge on 3 D6 and lost smash in the pursuing turn. I turned that one off after that. He also didnt bring down his DC brick until turn 3 which was a huge mistake when he needed a crucial turn 2 that he just blundered.

 

I watched some live streamers I'd never heard of before played BA vs Nids as well. The guy who played BA didnt even know the cast for wings....

 

He misplayed so much I don't think I made it more than 35 minutes into that one.

 

This just piles on top of the fact there are a lot of subpar players piloting the armies I want to see.

 

I'm not saying I'm the best general, or maybe it's just me armchair coaching. But I really feel as though I could build better lists, or at least play them better.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Dont-Be-Haten

[Xenith]

@Mort it's generally just bad play. Last night I watched ACE from twisted dice blunder his smash captain by only selecting a single target 11" away instead of selecting multiple targets. He fluffs the 11" charge on 3 D6 and lost smash in the pursuing turn. I turned that one off after that. He also didnt bring down his DC brick until turn 3 which was a huge mistake when he needed a crucial turn 2 that he just blundered.

 

I watched some live streamers I'd never heard of before played BA vs Nids as well. The guy who played BA didnt even know the cast for wings....

 

He misplayed so much I don't think I made it more than 35 minutes into that one.

 

This just piles on top of the fact there are a lot of subpar players piloting the armies I want to see.

 

I'm not saying I'm the best general, or maybe it's just me armchair coaching. But I really feel as though I could build better lists, or at least play them better.

 

Kind of sounds like the situation we had at the start of 8th where the TO playtesters of all the indexes never really played BA due to them not being 'competitive', as such, the BA ar mies that they tweaked to make strong were stuff they had in normal marine armies like razor spam, etc, and nirmal BA armies were left in the lurch.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

 

 

@Mort it's generally just bad play. Last night I watched ACE from twisted dice blunder his smash captain by only selecting a single target 11" away instead of selecting multiple targets. He fluffs the 11" charge on 3 D6 and lost smash in the pursuing turn. I turned that one off after that. He also didnt bring down his DC brick until turn 3 which was a huge mistake when he needed a crucial turn 2 that he just blundered.

 

I watched some live streamers I'd never heard of before played BA vs Nids as well. The guy who played BA didnt even know the cast for wings....

 

He misplayed so much I don't think I made it more than 35 minutes into that one.

 

This just piles on top of the fact there are a lot of subpar players piloting the armies I want to see.

 

I'm not saying I'm the best general, or maybe it's just me armchair coaching. But I really feel as though I could build better lists, or at least play them better.

Kind of sounds like the situation we had at the start of 8th where the TO playtesters of all the indexes never really played BA due to them not being 'competitive', as such, the BA ar mies that they tweaked to make strong were stuff they had in normal marine armies like razor spam, etc, and nirmal BA armies were left in the lurch.

Well one of my gripes is ACE took a triple battalion. For an ITC mission. And then got annihilated in points.

 

Not to mention he wasn't even parsing decent damage a turn against Kaiju spam.

 

And he still ran out of CP before turn 3. He gave up easy points from his scout squads. When I think it would've been more beneficial to block half the damage from devourer spam by popping TP on the squad that could take all the direct fire. At bare minimum it would've been a better investment than what he spent his CP on.

 

There's absolutely no point in putting AoW on a libby dread if you aren't going to put him up front to get into the lines of the opponent. The whole match I was asking myself why he didnt take the Sarcophagus. Especially after whiffing on 3 psychic powers from the dread. All of which could have, should, have been turn/game changing.

 

The other guys all just blitzkrieg their glass cannons up and burn through CP too fast or go to assault doctrine on turn 3 when tactical is better when you don't have enough melee centric units in position.

[Neuralshock]

I think a lot of it comes down to efficient strat usage too. Just because you can use OWoF doesn't mean you should aim to use that every game. You can use red rampage, but do you need to use it? Having lean usage of CP makes sure that every strat fits perfectly into the overall strategy. Having a 3d6 charge against bubblewrap scouts might not seem to be crucial like sang guard flying into a big tank, but if you spike high enough you can then touch and wrap the three TFC's in the ruin behind them. 2 CP well spent in my book. You generally don't see that level of play regarding most YT'ers who want to put on a show for their viewers.

[SnorriSnorrison]

Finally got both BoB, CA19 and Mephiston. It’s nice to finally have the book and sift through the pages that brought so much BA goodness into our hands!

 

I’ll seek to play some games soon, perhaps even one before Christmas if time allows, and I’m curious to see how our book performs now!

I kinda have to restrain myself from buying new stuff like Incursors at this moment in time :D

[Beta Helix]

Since I'm the new guy and haven't seen it covered, I'll ask: how do people feel about Death Company Intercessors? I'm curious how best to arm and deliver them, and if they're worth it compared to other elites Primaris or otherwise?

[Dont-Be-Haten]

Since I'm the new guy and haven't seen it covered, I'll ask: how do people feel about Death Company Intercessors? I'm curious how best to arm and deliver them, and if they're worth it compared to other elites Primaris or otherwise?

If you're going to take them your best bet is either MSU, since their leadership sucks, and put them in an impulsor. Or as a full squad with autobolt rifles and a thunder hammer + chainsword marine. You're going to have to burn a lot of command points, but forlorn fury them, then pop TP and 5+++ strat, and have either Astorath or Lemartes near by.

 

Otherwise cheap jump pack DC or footies in a pod are better options.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Dont-Be-Haten

[The Unseen]

Primaris DC are just bad, they can't bring enough melee weapons to be a melee unit, they get the same number of attacks as just making the unit veteran, and a 6+++ isn't reliable enough to matter for 10 wounds, since you give up the Intercessors best friend, the standard of Sacrifice, to get the worse fnp.

 

And their leadership isn't high enough to risk bringing a larger unit, unless you also bring Astorath, and at that point, just bring jump regular DC for a much better use of points.

[Morticon]

Since I'm the new guy and haven't seen it covered, I'll ask: how do people feel about Death Company Intercessors? I'm curious how best to arm and deliver them, and if they're worth it compared to other elites Primaris or otherwise?

 

Sadly, The Unseen has it covered!   This was a wonderful fluffy shout out to us, but I dont feel it will see the light of day in most comp lists.

 

 

[Beta Helix]

Thank you. Unfortunate, but you never know until you ask.

[Neuralshock]

Thank you. Unfortunate, but you never know until you ask.

pssh who the heck cares! if you think they'd look cool go for it!

[FormelyKnownAsSmashyPants]

What do people think about running a minimum sized death coy squad with hammers to back up captain smash. He'd give em rerolls or 1 and when your opponents big and nasty hits back he'll have to choose between hitting back at the squad or the captain, and with the numerous strats that help with survivability we have access to now someone's bound to survive. You could argue that two smash captains would be better and it could be, I don't know, maybe someone could run the numbers. You could even run the squad at six or seven and give three chains words to have a few ablative bodies.

[Xenith]

What do people think about running a minimum sized death coy squad with hammers to back up captain smash. 

 

You get something like 2 fists for the price of 1 hammer, which is 8A vs 4A for a max damage of 24 vs 12 on the charge. The fist also lets you take a BP or CS too. 

[SnorriSnorrison]

The hammers look cooler, but fists all the way. Even though running a 15 men death brick is tempting, I’d rather have a unit that’s a little less expensive and still deadly enough to do lots of damage. So say 10 guys, 5 CS/BG/BP and the rest with fists and flamers.

 

The 2x5 squads are also very interesting, might give those a go. Flexibility in your battle plan is the key, and that setup would help you in this regard.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

Can we all agree that triple battalions are not the way to go? I've now watched 2 bat reps with triple battalions and the armies are trash.

[Karhedron]

Can we all agree that triple battalions are not the way to go? I've now watched 2 bat reps with triple battalions and the armies are trash.

I normally only play 1500-1750 points so I don't think I would be able to afford a triple battalion. Having said that, I am interested to know what is wrong with them. Is it just too many Troops and not enough muscle to back them up?

[Indefragable]

I wouldn’t rule anything out just on principle.

 

A. It’s the skill of the general. If he’s most comfortable with 9x naked Tactical squads and knows how to wield them like a katana, all the more power to him/her.

 

B. Infiltrator/Incursor spam has a lot of power in theory, so I could see that working. I have had good success with Scout spam, but that’s because I’ve had a lot of practice and I have appropriate expectations.

 

Without seeing any of these videos, and not knowing anymore that what has been relayed here, my guess would be that its players who are not familiar with BA/our intricacies and are power building based off what the internet or ITC taking heads are saying should work. My guess is they are Troop spamming for CP since their entire strategy is down down up up left right left right power combos of UWoF + DVoS + Red Rampage and that’s where their imagination ends.