Blood of Baal new tactica!

[SnorriSnorrison]

 

 

So I've been out of the game with Real Life for a little while (moving house and such), but my general impression is that while we have a couple of neat new toys in our box, from the general buffing of Doctrines and Red Thirst... This army still plays far too rigidly.

Other armies have options, they have flexibility. Blood Angels weakness is that an opponent can take one look at your list and know exactly what you're going to try and do with each part of it. In regards to the conversation about YouTubers earlier, I don't think any of them are necessarily bad at handling Blood Angels*, it's just that they are often up against extremely experienced opponents. Those opponents can easily counter an army like ours, I think.

But that's just my two penneth as a casual, mostly. I'm still slightly salty about the thing with Chaplain litanies not working out of deep strike. It just straight up denies so many cool synergies and tactical flexibility which would have been perfect for us.* there are a couple who I deem unworthy, but I won't name names ;)

Bones from Table Top Tactics just sent 13 death company up the board with forlorn fury to try and kill 2 wave serpants a squad of dark reapers and a unit of banshees with Jain Zhar. He positioned his preds to only be able to fire at a single target which was promptly hit with lightening fast reflexes for a -2 to hit modifier and then proceeded to lose his only melee portion of the army. And instead of moving to the tactical doctrine for his loads of scouts and tacticals he stayed in devastator which essentially did nothing for him since he didn't move any of his preds, he also took 4 assbacks that basically did nothing all game.

I don't even want to talk about his mismanagement of the smash captain, which he made his warlord instead of his footie captain or lieutenant which were sitting next to his parking lot. Giving up Warlord on a turn he didn't have to was pretty crucial as well as several of his other blunders. Now I will admit he had some :cuss rolls that were clutch for his opponent. But then again he also blundered his libby dread just to get off 1 unleash rage instead of actually using the dreadnought to help fire those hemlocks. It was really hard to watch him crash that handsomely painted army for sure. :facepalm:

But then again he also just wasting a lot of the synergies of his army, and ended up just about tabled in turn 5 before he conceded.

His list didn't look terrible either. :ermm:

Blood Angels ++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Blood Angels)

++ **CHAPTER**: Blood Angels

+ HQ +

Captain: Jump Pack, Storm shield, The Angel's Wing (replaces jump pack), Thunder hammer, Warlord

Lemartes: 3. Exhortation of Rage, 4. Mantra of Strength, Invocation of Destruction, Litanies of Hate

+ Troops +

Scout Squad 4x Scout: Combat knife Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Combat knife

Scout Squad 4x Scout: Combat knife Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Combat knife

Scout Squad 4x Scout: Combat knife Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Combat knife

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Blood Angels)

++ **CHAPTER**: Blood Angels

+ HQ + Captain: Master-crafted boltgun, Power sword, The Veritas Vitae

Librarian Dreadnought: 2. Unleash Rage, 6. Wings of Sanguinus, Furioso fist, Storm bolter

+ Troops +

Tactical Squad 3x Space Marine Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy flamer Space Marine Sergeant Bolt pistol and boltgun

Tactical Squad 3x Space Marine Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy flamer Space Marine Sergeant Bolt pistol and boltgun

Tactical Squad 3x Space Marine Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy flamer Space Marine Sergeant Bolt pistol and boltgun

+ Elites +

Death Company: Jump Packs

9x Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword

4x Death Company Marine: Thunder hammer

+ Dedicated Transport +

Razorback: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Razorback: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Razorback: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Blood Angels)

++ **CHAPTER**: Blood Angels

+ HQ +

Lieutenants Lieutenant: Chainsword, Master-crafted boltgun

+ Heavy Support +

Predator: Predator autocannon Two heavy bolters: 2x Heavy bolter

Predator: Predator autocannon Two heavy bolters: 2x Heavy bolter

Predator: Predator autocannon Two heavy bolters: 2x Heavy bolter

++ Total: [127 PL, 1,997pts] ++

Weeeeell funny enough that was one of the names I didn't want to name. I think the TT guys are great when they're in their comfort zone, but you can tell their comfort zone is cheesy "competitive" tourney lists with parking lots that just rely on huge weight of dice.

I mean did you see When Chef took the BA for a spin a while back? Travesty. I'm no fan of that guy's personality either though, to be fair, so I'm pretty biased there.

There are however plenty of channels where I think the BA give a good account of themselves. They're just usually up against armies that force their hand. I keep seeing situations where sure, it's a waste to throw their DC blob into three wave serpents, but realistically there's little other choice.

Chewie on SEO is always good I think, even if he doesn't always win. SS72 is competent at actually playing the army, but his list choices are always garbage character spam.

Anyway, this is veering off topic I think. Apologies.

I actually liked Chef’s approach a bit more since he utilized some of the synergies BA can do and even fielded assault marines - albeit poorly. He sent the DC to kill the nastiest thing in the army, which would’ve gone a lot better with Astorath’s Litany of Hate up instead of the shooty one. He then got stuck in the genestealers and mopped up, but at least that game was epic until the end and he made it into the assault doctrine.

 

A lot of people seem to fall for the thunderhammer-trap on DC. Yes they look cooler, but are they really that cool when you could get 35 points of other stuff when taking 5 fists instead? Stuff like more fists...:)

I used to like SS72’s BA batreps, but now I look at the lists before the battle and almost already know that he’ll lose badly. He might be competent with Tau or Eldar, but his track record with BA on that channel is rather unimpressive. So is mine, actually!

 

I’m going to have a game against the menace from beyond on Sunday, the Blood Angels will take on the Tyranids! My regular opponent with his bugs is also keen to use some of the BoB rules, and I for one sure am excited!

[Indefragable]

As far as rigidity is concerned I can understand where that might come from. I like to think that BA operates deceptively simple. You want to punch things, hard.

 

The secret sauce is what flavor of punchiness do you want? There's the gotta go fast jump pack rush, a testudo transport push, hero hammer or some mix in-between all of them. The second element that I think gets overlooked is optimally moving units to set up t2 charges. I see and have been guilty of using UWoF as a 2cp crutch to get my auras where they need to go when careful planning would have achieved the same or better goal

 

I think a lot of people (many of us included; I'm guilty at times myself) look at what units can do and try to build our entire gameplan around that, rather than looking at what units are likely to do and anything above that is gravy. Captain Smash is the worst offender in the sense that those insane soloing-a-Knight moments gets lodged in our brains and we try to replicate that at all costs. Rather than planning on Capt Smash doing some great stuff and if desperate or conditions align, then having him go all out.

 

 

I actually liked Chef’s approach a bit more since he utilized some of the synergies BA can do and even fielded assault marines - albeit poorly. He sent the DC to kill the nastiest thing in the army, which would’ve g

I’m going to have a game against the menace from beyond on Sunday, the Blood Angels will take on the Tyranids! My regular opponent with his bugs is also keen to use some of the BoB rules, and I for one sure am excited!

 

Looking forward to hearing your report back on this. I have yet to hear of anyone putting the new bug rules to use, so should be one for the ages.

[Neuralshock]

 

 

As far as rigidity is concerned I can understand where that might come from. I like to think that BA operates deceptively simple. You want to punch things, hard.

 

The secret sauce is what flavor of punchiness do you want? There's the gotta go fast jump pack rush, a testudo transport push, hero hammer or some mix in-between all of them. The second element that I think gets overlooked is optimally moving units to set up t2 charges. I see and have been guilty of using UWoF as a 2cp crutch to get my auras where they need to go when careful planning would have achieved the same or better goal

I think a lot of people (many of us included; I'm guilty at times myself) look at what units can do and try to build our entire gameplan around that, rather than looking at what units are likely to do and anything above that is gravy. Captain Smash is the worst offender in the sense that those insane soloing-a-Knight moments gets lodged in our brains and we try to replicate that at all costs. Rather than planning on Capt Smash doing some great stuff and if desperate or conditions align, then having him go all out.

Yup, happened to me twice in a rtt where slambo whiffed hard against a castellan and lord of skulls 3 times over the day. Twos... Everywhere

[keeblerartillery]

So, the Big Guns strat might make land speeders half decent.

Works on the whole unit, and you can pack a lot of dakka on 3 land speeders that can deliver itself pretty well.

I’m intrigued sir. How would you suggest loading them out? HBs and missiles?

[The Unseen]

 

So, the Big Guns strat might make land speeders half decent.

Works on the whole unit, and you can pack a lot of dakka on 3 land speeders that can deliver itself pretty well.

I’m intrigued sir. How would you suggest loading them out? HBs and missiles?

If you want some mobile dev replacements yeah.

I think speeders and maybe the typhoon went down in chapter approved as well, so they got a little nicer.

A land speeder with typhoon+hb is cheaper than a dev squad with 2 missile launchers and a heavy bolter, by a fair chunk.

It's got 6 T5 wounds vs 5 T4 ones, so more durable vs small arms, worse vs anything with more than D1, but are significantly more mobile with the strat now.

 

A unit of 3 has 20" move as long as all 3 are alive, so should be really easy to deploy them out of LOS of any big guns and then move to a good firing angle on your turn.

And with Devastator Doctrine up, that's not a bad little bit of firepower, though it'll still struggle like all missiles vs T8.

 

 

Other idea I see is assault cannon and either heavy flamers or multimeltas.

little pricier, but again you can protect them with terrain and then zoom up the board as a significant shooting threat you cant lock in melee.

Hilariously 3 speeders get 9 attacks first round and have red thirst now.

 

They also might not make a terrible target for shield of Sanguinius if you think your opponent is going to dump plasma/lascannons onto them

I would recomend no matter what you run them with to bring some stuff that will draw your opponents proper anti-tank, as anything with 3 flat or d6 damage will make quick work of them, play cagey and use terrain to your advantage.

 

I think the double heavy flamer build was cute before, but it doesn't need the strat and is really limited in what it can accomplish turn 1.

[brother_b]

I’d love to watch a battle report where BA are played correctly. I’ve never seen a BA victory on YouTube and I look all the time.

 

Anybody have some well played BA games to share?

Edited December 27, 2019 by brother_b

[Dolchiate Remembrancer]

Wish I did lol. My first game was today. Against a destroyer heavy necron list.

I brought the brigade I posted earlier and hit a brick wall...but it was my first game against necrons and I've been told they can be a tough match up.

[Vermintide]

When I say rigid, I don't mean that were by any means a one dimensional or one trick pony. We have a few things up our sleeve. It's just that we have to invest in combos and commit to strategies if we want them to pay off, and the reliable ones show up in nearly every list.

 

You need everything to go right, and it's very difficult to salvage any momentum when that big DC charge gets cut down to improbably lucky overwatch, or Captain Smash whiffs horribly against all odds. We can't really afford that to happen like some armies can.

 

You guys make some pretty good points though and I think that's about part of where these youtube types go wrong. They're too used to looking at an army as a meta-statistical entity, so they lean too heavily on X build and Y stratagem. They never realise how good an army can be if you squeeze the most out of it's units; they just see UWOF and flying dreadnoughts.

 

I've actually had my most successful battles playing defensively, holding back and counter charging when the time seems right. Maybe I'm just not a very confident attacker yet; but I've never once seen a batrep online where someone even tries that approach. It's always charging blindly into giant packs of genestealers, like that's ever going to end well, even for BA.

[Neuralshock]

You guys make some pretty good points though and I think that's about part of where these youtube types go wrong. They're too used to looking at an army as a meta-statistical entity, so they lean too heavily on X build and Y stratagem. They never realise how good an army can be if you squeeze the most out of it's units; they just see UWOF and flying dreadnoughts.

 

I've actually had my most successful battles playing defensively, holding back and counter charging when the time seems right. Maybe I'm just not a very confident attacker yet; but I've never once seen a batrep online where someone even tries that approach. It's always charging blindly into giant packs of genestealers, like that's ever going to end well, even for BA.

I don't think I've ever seen a wrap n' trap on youtube beyond actual tactics videos

[Fajita Fan]

Hi everyone.

 

I've had a primed BA primaris army sitting in mothballs for over a year now with no reason to finish it until I heard this book had new rules that were worth looking into so I've busted it out to get painted pretty quick.  I read through this thread at work on my phone and couldn't see if anyone mentioned (apologies if I missed it) what's the point of Death Company Intercessors.  They're elites instead of troops and get +1 attack on the charge without a real H2H loadout. Am I missing something or does that sound like a waste of an elite choice - it seems like Death Company Reivers would be significantly more interesting?

[Dolchiate Remembrancer]

I've actually had my most successful battles playing defensively, holding back and counter charging when the time seems right. Maybe I'm just not a very confident attacker yet; but I've never once seen a batrep online where someone even tries that approach. It's always charging blindly into giant packs of genestealers, like that's ever going to end well, even for BA.

This seems to be the only real way to play our army. Which is so unfluffy!

 

Rant over.

[The Unseen]

Fajita, you've hit the nail on the head, DC Intercessors just aren't good. Play them if you think their cool in a casual setting, otherwise, leave them alone. They don't pack enough melee weapons to be viable melee troops, kinda like reivers, and the 6+++ isn't worth giving up the Standard of Sacrifices 5+++. If they were troops, they might have some merit, but intercessor squads bought as troops and then upgraded to veterans with the stratagem are just better.

 

Despite BA's obvious strengths, we're still a finesse army. We can't beat the opponent over the head with math and win, like a few of our codex brethren. Doing well with a mixed army, or especially one weighted towards doing a lot of damage or preventing damage with melee, requires a very clear plan and, as Vermintide puts it, squeeze every bit out of the units at your disposal. I find that careful maneuvering during charges to leave pile-in and consolidation options open is one of, if not THE most important thing that people who don't play a melee army primarily miss. Also, many people, especially some youtube battle reports, throw their entire armies plan behind 2 big squads of DC and Sanguinary Guard, without bringing enough support units to make it work, because they also overload on characters. I see BA is especially prone to having way to many characters without units for them to support and also screen the characters. 6+ characters in a 2k list will leave you SEVERELY outgunned and outnumbered. Even 5 is probably too many unless 2 of them are very very cheap support units like a naked lieutenant.

 

That and many people "stagger" their army, meaning turn 1 only some of the units are in positions to threaten the opponent or score points, and others aren't contributing. That gives your opponent free reign to target those threatening units straight away, and with how lethal current 40k is, kill them. Then your basically facing a significant uphill battle from turn 2, not a good place to be.

BA have only 2 real options to prevent this. Go Absolute Ham turn 1, take no units that don't have an immediate effect on the opponent turn 1. Scouts, Vanguard Units, Forlorn Furied DC backed up by an UWOF chaplain or captain smash, fast moving units packing firepower to clear screens and secure the board against infantry, and some 48" range heavy weapons to put the hurt on the enemy right away. Every unit *must* be a turn 1 threat, or else your playing with half your arm behind your back.
I personally follow that logic, but its very high-risk high-reward, and it isn't a very friendly style of play, as its a straight alpha strike list that if it works well basically gives your opponent no outs right at the start, the game is over at the deployment stage.

The other option is to play more like our more adherent brethren, with a unit of DC or SG in reserve for a crucial turn 2 or 3 play once the battle has opened up a bit and you've cleared out most of the opponents screening ability and can get to the juicy center target, whatever it is. It's this style of play I think the Blood of Baal has opened up a bit more, as it gave us a lot of defensive tools, like Transhuman Physiology for infantry, Duty Eternal for Dreads, the -1 to-hit strat for SG in combat, the 5+++ for a phase for DC, etc. Combining those tools with our armies best defensive tool bar none, the Standard of Sacrifice, with some already durable infantry like Intercessors, and you can have an army that engages in a more "slug-fest" style game were you wear the target down with shooting, outlast them by staying in cover with stacked defensive abilities, and not letting your opponent focus fire on your heavy hitters with careful use of terrain. Then when turn 3 comes around, anything left alive will suddenly hit like a truck in melee, and you push for the endgame.

 

What doesn't work is taking the same base core army as a codex marine army and then substituting the heavy hitters from those lists with BA specific ones, that just doesn't work. Your going after 2 different win conditions simultaneously and therefore you'll fail at both. The mentioned list bones from tabletop tactics is a good example of that, despite the fact that I love those guys and their battle reports just because you can tell they actual enjoy what they do. He's got a big unit of DC, a smash captain, a libby dread, and then a bunch of castling armor.

Spoiler tag is the full list for clarity

{++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) ++

**CHAPTER**: Blood Angels

+ HQ +

Captain: Jump Pack, Storm shield, The Angel's Wing (replaces jump pack), Thunder hammer, Warlord

Lemartes: 3. Exhortation of Rage, 4. Mantra of Strength, Invocation of Destruction, Litanies of Hate

+ Troops +

Scout Squad

4x Scout: Combat knife

Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Combat knife

Scout Squad

4x Scout: Combat knife

Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Combat knife

Scout Squad

4x Scout: Combat knife

Scout Sergeant: Bolt pistol, Combat knife

++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) ++

**CHAPTER**: Blood Angels

+ HQ +

Captain: Master-crafted boltgun, Power sword, The Veritas Vitae

Librarian Dreadnought: 2. Unleash Rage, 6. Wings of Sanguinus, Furioso fist, Storm bolter

+ Troops +

Tactical Squad

3x Space Marine

Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy flamer

Space Marine Sergeant

Bolt pistol and boltgun

Tactical Squad

3x Space Marine

Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy flamer

Space Marine Sergeant

Bolt pistol and boltgun

Tactical Squad

3x Space Marine

Space Marine (Heavy weapon): Heavy flamer

Space Marine Sergeant

Bolt pistol and boltgun

+ Elites +

Death Company: Jump Packs

9x Death Company Marine: Boltgun, Chainsword

4x Death Company Marine: Thunder hammer

+ Dedicated Transport +

Razorback: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Razorback: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

Razorback: Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Blood Angels) ++

**CHAPTER**: Blood Angels

+ HQ +

Lieutenants

Lieutenant: Chainsword, Master-crafted boltgun

+ Heavy Support +

Predator: Predator autocannon

Two heavy bolters: 2x Heavy bolter

Predator: Predator autocannon

Two heavy bolters: 2x Heavy bolter

Predator: Predator autocannon

Two heavy bolters: 2x Heavy bolter

}

 

So turn 1 he has a pretty awesome charge with the DC blob, but he doesn't have any other units aggressive enough to take advantage of the opening that they give him, so their efforts are in effect wasted because the rest of his army is a defensive hold ground style list. With a few tweaks, that core is very solid, but you'd want to swap the DC for maybe Sanguinary Guard in reserve and swap lemartes for Astorath.

But as is he has most of a solid gunline and a single aggressive unit that just gets shot to death. This was compounded by a couple of his errors, sure, but that wasn't the actual problem really.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

So, the Big Guns strat might make land speeders half decent.

Works on the whole unit, and you can pack a lot of dakka on 3 land speeders that can deliver itself pretty well.

I have 3 of them. I've always loved land speeders. When the change to vehicles and negative modifiers took effect it really hit my typhoons hard. I wouldn't hate a squad of three as a hyper mobile devastator squad.  

 

I will definitely have to play test around with them again... 

[Vermintide]

 

I've actually had my most successful battles playing defensively, holding back and counter charging when the time seems right. Maybe I'm just not a very confident attacker yet; but I've never once seen a batrep online where someone even tries that approach. It's always charging blindly into giant packs of genestealers, like that's ever going to end well, even for BA.

This seems to be the only real way to play our army. Which is so unfluffy!

 

Rant over.

I agree that it shouldn't be the only way for us to do well, but I wouldn't say it's un-fluffy. Blood Angels ARE still Marines after all, bloodthirsty ones yes, but the entire point is that they control their bloodlust and use it only when it is advantageous. Those who cannot get special paintwork for their armour ;)

 

Interesting that it's not just me, though. Perhaps too many people just get hung up on the idea of an army being "melee focused" and just banzai charging, but I've never seen it that way. Especially now with the devastator and tactical doctrines, it's an army where you get the strengths and weaknesses of both.

 

I think perhaps the rules writers themselves made that mistake; that small selection of hard-hitting strategies we have are all melee focused, when really only a handful of units in our roster are melee specialists. Which is why it feels so rigid.

Edited December 27, 2019 by Vermintide

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I personally think we can still have a very strong alpha strike out of drop pods.

 

The shock and awe also makes for a very fluffy build which is something BA have always been better at.

 

20~30 DC podding in, backed by some whirlwinds and maybe even assault cannon + heavy bolter land speeders to help clear screens double backed by LasTACs or something might be wicked fun to play.

[Fajita Fan]

 

 

The other option is to play more like our more adherent brethren, with a unit of DC or SG in reserve for a crucial turn 2 or 3 play once the battle has opened up a bit and you've cleared out most of the opponents screening ability and can get to the juicy center target, whatever it is. It's this style of play I think the Blood of Baal has opened up a bit more, as it gave us a lot of defensive tools, like Transhuman Physiology for infantry, Duty Eternal for Dreads, the -1 to-hit strat for SG in combat, the 5+++ for a phase for DC, etc. Combining those tools with our armies best defensive tool bar none, the Standard of Sacrifice, with some already durable infantry like Intercessors, and you can have an army that engages in a more "slug-fest" style game were you wear the target down with shooting, outlast them by staying in cover with stacked defensive abilities, and not letting your opponent focus fire on your heavy hitters with careful use of terrain. Then when turn 3 comes around, anything left alive will suddenly hit like a truck in melee, and you push for the endgame.

I happen to have like 30 SG cut up ready to assemble that I abandoned after they removed Dante making them troops.  A couple of years ago I bought two of the starter set sprues off eBay to start a primaris army and if I had intended to go BA I could've probably gotten away with just one.  At the time getting 20 troops, 2 HQs, 10 hellblasters, and 6 of those jump guys seemed a pretty good deal for about $80, now that I cut apart a bunch of them to add BA bits I've got a pretty decent core for an army so those are some really good thoughts.  

[keeblerartillery]

Shower thought about speeders - Recitation of focus applies to a unit - so a unit of 3 land speeders can benefit from big guns never tire and focus and be hitting on a 2+ after moving 20 inches. That’s a super mobile fire platform that can soften hard targets or clear chaff for fairly cheap. And if you play aggressively, an opponent will have to deal with incursors/invictors/DC first. Or if you castle, things like repulsor executioners or deredeos/contemptors/leviathans will be a higher priority.

[Neuralshock]

Piggybacking off of that, I'd say the Catechasm of fire would be better as wounding most stuff on 2+ with -2AP first turn will clear tons of chaff! caveat being that it's against the closest target, but with 20 inch movement and 56 inch threat range I'd say that's pretty good.

[keeblerartillery]

Piggybacking off of that, I'd say the Catechasm of fire would be better as wounding most stuff on 2+ with -2AP first turn will clear tons of chaff! caveat being that it's against the closest target, but with 20 inch movement and 56 inch threat range I'd say that's pretty good.

While it might be more useful - I feel like it is too situational. You don’t know that you’ll be firing at the closest target - or you’ll have to do some movement shenanigans to get them to make it useful.

[Neuralshock]

 

Piggybacking off of that, I'd say the Catechasm of fire would be better as wounding most stuff on 2+ with -2AP first turn will clear tons of chaff! caveat being that it's against the closest target, but with 20 inch movement and 56 inch threat range I'd say that's pretty good.

While it might be more useful - I feel like it is too situational. You don’t know that you’ll be firing at the closest target - or you’ll have to do some movement shenanigans to get them to make it useful.

Considering the buff is given at the beginning of the turn and not an aura, you get 20 inches to move, and typically if you're kitted to clear screens they'll usually be up front. But wounding T8 on 4+ isn't too shabby. Or typhoons wounding t7 on 2+ at -3!

[SnorriSnorrison]

 

 

 

 

I actually liked Chef’s approach a bit more since he utilized some of the synergies BA can do and even fielded assault marines - albeit poorly. He sent the DC to kill the nastiest thing in the army, which would’ve g

I’m going to have a game against the menace from beyond on Sunday, the Blood Angels will take on the Tyranids! My regular opponent with his bugs is also keen to use some of the BoB rules, and I for one sure am excited!

Looking forward to hearing your report back on this. I have yet to hear of anyone putting the new bug rules to use, so should be one for the ages.

My opponent has thematically switched from his ultra-fast Kraken list to a Leviathan one. 4 hive tyrants including the Swarmlord, 3 Carnifexes and OOE. 2x 24 Hormagaunts, Rippers and warriors to fill out a battalion.

The fexes all have spore cysts, so the most reliable way to get to them is in CC.

 

It’s going to be really tough, this one. He’s also bringing 3 Venomthropes to shield his bigger and smaller units, so I gotta take those on first, before opening up with bolt rifles and assault cannons.

 

Here’s my first rough sketch of a list, still gotta find some points to get the predator in.

 

13 CP

additional relic

 

2 battalions

1 Vanguard

 

Astorath, Focus, canticle of hate and Mantra of strength

Captain, JP, relic blade, plasma pistol

 

Librarian, JP, unleash rage + shield

Librarian Dreadnought

 

2x 5 intercessors

2x5 tacticals, CS + SB, one heavy and one regular flamer

2x5 cc scouts

 

2x AssCan RB w/ SB

Predator, auto cannon and lascannons, SB

 

Sanguinary Priest, JP, Icon of the Angel

 

5x DC w/ handflamers and fists

8 Sang Guard, one PF, swords, masks

Sanguinary ancient, Warlord, SoS, Gift of Forsight

5 Hammernators

 

2022 points atm.

I know I could potentially leave the masks of the SG because they have the “Deathmask” keyword and therefore would benefit from the stratagem without the masks, but I don’t wanna be that guy.

 

The DC are my hit squad, take out one big target hopefully and then die. As intended.

 

The terminators are my second hit squad, they should be able to deal with a tyrant or even the Swarmlord with support from stratagems (3 CP to hit on 3’s and re-roll everything, cast UR before, that sort of stuff).

 

The SG will either start on the board for counter attacks with unbridled ardour or DS with the terminators. The SP will go with the latter to ensure they make their charge.

There’s options at least. Gotta find some points to cut back, first...

 

[Panzer]

 

 

 

 

I actually liked Chef’s approach a bit more since he utilized some of the synergies BA can do and even fielded assault marines - albeit poorly. He sent the DC to kill the nastiest thing in the army, which would’ve g

I’m going to have a game against the menace from beyond on Sunday, the Blood Angels will take on the Tyranids! My regular opponent with his bugs is also keen to use some of the BoB rules, and I for one sure am excited!

Looking forward to hearing your report back on this. I have yet to hear of anyone putting the new bug rules to use, so should be one for the ages.

My opponent has thematically switched from his ultra-fast Kraken list to a Leviathan one. 4 hive tyrants including the Swarmlord, 3 Carnifexes and OOE. 2x 24 Hormagaunts, Rippers and warriors to fill out a battalion.

The fexes all have spore cysts, so the most reliable way to get to them is in CC.

 

It’s going to be really tough, this one. He’s also bringing 3 Venomthropes to shield his bigger and smaller units, so I gotta take those on first, before opening up with bolt rifles and assault cannons.

 

Here’s my first rough sketch of a list, still gotta find some points to get the predator in.

 

13 CP

additional relic

 

2 battalions

1 Vanguard

 

Astorath, Focus, canticle of hate and Mantra of strength

Captain, JP, relic blade, plasma pistol

 

Librarian, JP, unleash rage + shield

Librarian Dreadnought

 

2x 5 intercessors

2x5 tacticals, CS + SB, one heavy and one regular flamer

2x5 cc scouts

 

2x AssCan RB w/ SB

Predator, auto cannon and lascannons, SB

 

Sanguinary Priest, JP, Icon of the Angel

 

5x DC w/ handflamers and fists

8 Sang Guard, one PF, swords, masks

Sanguinary ancient, Warlord, SoS, Gift of Forsight

5 Hammernators

 

2022 points atm.

I know I could potentially leave the masks of the SG because they have the “Deathmask” keyword and therefore would benefit from the stratagem without the masks, but I don’t wanna be that guy.

 

The DC are my hit squad, take out one big target hopefully and then die. As intended.

 

The terminators are my second hit squad, they should be able to deal with a tyrant or even the Swarmlord with support from stratagems (3 CP to hit on 3’s and re-roll everything, cast UR before, that sort of stuff).

 

The SG will either start on the board for counter attacks with unbridled ardour or DS with the terminators. The SP will go with the latter to ensure they make their charge.

There’s options at least. Gotta find some points to cut back, first...

 

 

 

Well at least it's not super shooty Kronos I guess. 

[Neuralshock]

So I played my "golden wind" list and long story short, transhuman physiology put my friend on tilt.

 

BA vs DG and I've almost always lost to my friend who usually runs a stack of blightlords which until now has always broken against the wall of filth.

 

The key points of the list were a 8x squad of powerfist sang guard and a 6x squad of swords backed by Astorath, sang priest, ancient with banner, and the sanguinor. All of this to push the # of swings and quality of hits to the max.

 

My friend goes first and is unfortunate in that he doesn't get a kill first turn. And I score hold more and kill more after the sang guard and everything else punk his mephitic blight haulers and I kill the pox walkers that charged my scouts and incursors.

 

In his second turn he kills my incursor squad and scout squad and charges pox walkers into the scouts holding the center objective. I pop unbridled ardor on my second incursor squad to put some wounds through. He also puts gift of contagion onto my powerfist sang guard and gives them -1 attack.

 

My turn 2 is my experiment to see if I can use the buffed powerfists to punch through any obstacle. I heal a body from the squad and use chalice overflowing to put them back to full squad. I use mass of doom and have exhortation of rage on them. He denies unleash rage and I charge the BLT's and put the warlord ancient next to them. Using vengeance for sanguinius and death on the wind, I manage to take down 8 of the terminators, leaving the two plague flails. He interrupts and when I say transhuman physiology he goes full tilt, not at me per se, but vents about the state of marines in general. After about 15 minutes he cools down and still wipes the whole squad with two dudes and transhuman up (he had reroll all failed hits and wounds)

 

I still had a commanding lead in points and I had defanged him by turn 3 and we called it. So experiment successful. Wasn't expecting the salt though.

[Khorneeq]

 

 

 

 

 

I actually liked Chef’s approach a bit more since he utilized some of the synergies BA can do and even fielded assault marines - albeit poorly. He sent the DC to kill the nastiest thing in the army, which would’ve g

I’m going to have a game against the menace from beyond on Sunday, the Blood Angels will take on the Tyranids! My regular opponent with his bugs is also keen to use some of the BoB rules, and I for one sure am excited!

Looking forward to hearing your report back on this. I have yet to hear of anyone putting the new bug rules to use, so should be one for the ages.

My opponent has thematically switched from his ultra-fast Kraken list to a Leviathan one. 4 hive tyrants including the Swarmlord, 3 Carnifexes and OOE. 2x 24 Hormagaunts, Rippers and warriors to fill out a battalion.

The fexes all have spore cysts, so the most reliable way to get to them is in CC.

 

It’s going to be really tough, this one. He’s also bringing 3 Venomthropes to shield his bigger and smaller units, so I gotta take those on first, before opening up with bolt rifles and assault cannons.

 

Here’s my first rough sketch of a list, still gotta find some points to get the predator in.

 

13 CP

additional relic

 

2 battalions

1 Vanguard

 

Astorath, Focus, canticle of hate and Mantra of strength

Captain, JP, relic blade, plasma pistol

 

Librarian, JP, unleash rage + shield

Librarian Dreadnought

 

2x 5 intercessors

2x5 tacticals, CS + SB, one heavy and one regular flamer

2x5 cc scouts

 

2x AssCan RB w/ SB

Predator, auto cannon and lascannons, SB

 

Sanguinary Priest, JP, Icon of the Angel

 

5x DC w/ handflamers and fists

8 Sang Guard, one PF, swords, masks

Sanguinary ancient, Warlord, SoS, Gift of Forsight

5 Hammernators

 

2022 points atm.

I know I could potentially leave the masks of the SG because they have the “Deathmask” keyword and therefore would benefit from the stratagem without the masks, but I don’t wanna be that guy.

 

The DC are my hit squad, take out one big target hopefully and then die. As intended.

 

The terminators are my second hit squad, they should be able to deal with a tyrant or even the Swarmlord with support from stratagems (3 CP to hit on 3’s and re-roll everything, cast UR before, that sort of stuff).

 

The SG will either start on the board for counter attacks with unbridled ardour or DS with the terminators. The SP will go with the latter to ensure they make their charge.

There’s options at least. Gotta find some points to cut back, first...

 

 

 

Well at least it's not super shooty Kronos I guess. 

 

I like this list very much it pointed me in (I hope) desired direction (and I hope to win next battle).

Everybody else is saying that You shouldn't put SG and DC in one list as they compete with each other.

But against strong Tyranid Monsters it looks quite promising.

One thing that strikes me is chosen Warlord Trait. It has no real benefit on a standard bearer

[SnorriSnorrison]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I actually liked Chef’s approach a bit more since he utilized some of the synergies BA can do and even fielded assault marines - albeit poorly. He sent the DC to kill the nastiest thing in the army, which would’ve g

I’m going to have a game against the menace from beyond on Sunday, the Blood Angels will take on the Tyranids! My regular opponent with his bugs is also keen to use some of the BoB rules, and I for one sure am excited!

Looking forward to hearing your report back on this. I have yet to hear of anyone putting the new bug rules to use, so should be one for the ages.

My opponent has thematically switched from his ultra-fast Kraken list to a Leviathan one. 4 hive tyrants including the Swarmlord, 3 Carnifexes and OOE. 2x 24 Hormagaunts, Rippers and warriors to fill out a battalion.

The fexes all have spore cysts, so the most reliable way to get to them is in CC.

It’s going to be really tough, this one. He’s also bringing 3 Venomthropes to shield his bigger and smaller units, so I gotta take those on first, before opening up with bolt rifles and assault cannons.

Here’s my first rough sketch of a list, still gotta find some points to get the predator in.

13 CP

additional relic

2 battalions

1 Vanguard

Astorath, Focus, canticle of hate and Mantra of strength

Captain, JP, relic blade, plasma pistol

Librarian, JP, unleash rage + shield

Librarian Dreadnought

2x 5 intercessors

2x5 tacticals, CS + SB, one heavy and one regular flamer

2x5 cc scouts

2x AssCan RB w/ SB

Predator, auto cannon and lascannons, SB

Sanguinary Priest, JP, Icon of the Angel

5x DC w/ handflamers and fists

8 Sang Guard, one PF, swords, masks

Sanguinary ancient, Warlord, SoS, Gift of Forsight

5 Hammernators

2022 points atm.

I know I could potentially leave the masks of the SG because they have the “Deathmask” keyword and therefore would benefit from the stratagem without the masks, but I don’t wanna be that guy.

The DC are my hit squad, take out one big target hopefully and then die. As intended.

The terminators are my second hit squad, they should be able to deal with a tyrant or even the Swarmlord with support from stratagems (3 CP to hit on 3’s and re-roll everything, cast UR before, that sort of stuff).

The SG will either start on the board for counter attacks with unbridled ardour or DS with the terminators. The SP will go with the latter to ensure they make their charge.

There’s options at least. Gotta find some points to cut back, first...

 

Well at least it's not super shooty Kronos I guess. :sweat:

I like this list very much it pointed me in (I hope) desired direction (and I hope to win next battle).

Everybody else is saying that You shouldn't put SG and DC in one list as they compete with each other.

But against strong Tyranid Monsters it looks quite promising.

One thing that strikes me is chosen Warlord Trait. It has no real benefit on a standard bearer

Yeah, DC and SG usually compete for both points and CP. By keeping the DC small, they’re really one-use-only missiles. I hope to destroy either OOE which will be warlord or one of the Hive tyrants with them. The SG will help clear out both monsters and heavy infantry that still linger in the deployment zone or take an objective.

 

I guess I could go with Soulwarden or Artisan of war on the Ancient, true. He’s got the re-rolling of 1’s for his 5++, so that’s something.

 

I hope you win your game! I’m usually cornered and tabled against this opponent, so we’ll see how this goes tomorrow!

 

PS:

I’ve pondered about just getting a Primaris Lieutenant instead of the Captain. Without Angel’s Wing and the second WL trait, the Captain can be ignored since he loses a lot of utility. By saving me 3 CP and 40 points, the Lieutenant could be an acceptable replacement. Not a substitute though, I’d rather have them both!