Current state of the Relictors?

[Lord Kallozar]

Hey everyone

Please help me, so in the current timeline and setting what is the current state of the Relictors Chapter? Do they have primaris within their ranks? Are they renegades or was that fluff all retconned? Please help. Thank you.

[Captain_Krash]

I believe they are still renegades and are fleeing/residing within the Eye of Terror. 

 

Sadly 

 

Krash

Edited December 28, 2019 by Captain_Krash

[Tyberos the Red Wake]

Relictors have Primaris. Whether they were resurrected in name only as an all-Primaris chapter by Guilliman or if they were forgiven and received reinforcements is unknown. You can see a Relictor Primaris in the second to last row, fourth from the left on the large poster of Primaris that came with Conquest.

[Felix Antipodes]

Would think that they were forgiven/made to repent if they have Primaris. If the Imperium were raising a Primaris-only Chapter to replace them, it makes more sense to use their original name (Fire Claws) rather than continue the name of an active renegade Chapter.

[Gederas]

Relictors have Primaris. Whether they were resurrected in name only as an all-Primaris chapter by Guilliman or if they were forgiven and received reinforcements is unknown. You can see a Relictor Primaris in the second to last row, fourth from the left on the large poster of Primaris that came with Conquest.

There's also Primaris marines of a few extinct chapters in there (Astral Knights, Knights of Blood). I wouldn't put much faith in that art piece because of it

[Felix Antipodes]

 

Relictors have Primaris. Whether they were resurrected in name only as an all-Primaris chapter by Guilliman or if they were forgiven and received reinforcements is unknown. You can see a Relictor Primaris in the second to last row, fourth from the left on the large poster of Primaris that came with Conquest.

 

There's also Primaris marines of a few extinct chapters in there (Astral Knights, Knights of Blood). I wouldn't put much faith in that art piece because of it

I read somewhere (sorry, can't recall where - will have to dig) that a lot of the Chapters lost in the chaos of the Rifts formation were reformed as primaris-only units as a tribute to the fallen.

Dante could have done something similar post Devastation of Baal.

[dogfender]

Since the Eye of Terror campaign was retconned by the more recent “13th black crusade” where Cadia fell.

The events that lead to them being hunted down by the grey knights never took place.

So I would assume they are where we last left them.

Maybe they will come up again in Armageddon

[Claws and Effect]

 

 

Relictors have Primaris. Whether they were resurrected in name only as an all-Primaris chapter by Guilliman or if they were forgiven and received reinforcements is unknown. You can see a Relictor Primaris in the second to last row, fourth from the left on the large poster of Primaris that came with Conquest.

 

There's also Primaris marines of a few extinct chapters in there (Astral Knights, Knights of Blood). I wouldn't put much faith in that art piece because of it

I read somewhere (sorry, can't recall where - will have to dig) that a lot of the Chapters lost in the chaos of the Rifts formation were reformed as primaris-only units as a tribute to the fallen.

Dante could have done something similar post Devastation of Baal.

Negative.

 

Dante states towards the end of Devastation of Baal that the Knights of Blood will not be rebuilt.

 

They redeemed themselves in his eyes and he feels that creating a new Chapter with their name would be an insult and cheapen their sacrifice.

[Gamiel]

 

 

 

Relictors have Primaris. Whether they were resurrected in name only as an all-Primaris chapter by Guilliman or if they were forgiven and received reinforcements is unknown. You can see a Relictor Primaris in the second to last row, fourth from the left on the large poster of Primaris that came with Conquest.

There's also Primaris marines of a few extinct chapters in there (Astral Knights, Knights of Blood). I wouldn't put much faith in that art piece because of it

I read somewhere (sorry, can't recall where - will have to dig) that a lot of the Chapters lost in the chaos of the Rifts formation were reformed as primaris-only units as a tribute to the fallen.

Dante could have done something similar post Devastation of Baal.

Negative.

 

Dante states towards the end of Devastation of Baal that the Knights of Blood will not be rebuilt.

 

They redeemed themselves in his eyes and he feels that creating a new Chapter with their name would be an insult and cheapen their sacrifice.

 

Could be a question of there being Primaris marines created from the gene-seed of those Chapter with maybe implanted knowledge regarding them during their creation that then reuse the name and colours of their gene-seed givers

[dogfender]

 

 

 

 

 

Relictors have Primaris. Whether they were resurrected in name only as an all-Primaris chapter by Guilliman or if they were forgiven and received reinforcements is unknown. You can see a Relictor Primaris in the second to last row, fourth from the left on the large poster of Primaris that came with Conquest.

There's also Primaris marines of a few extinct chapters in there (Astral Knights, Knights of Blood). I wouldn't put much faith in that art piece because of it

I read somewhere (sorry, can't recall where - will have to dig) that a lot of the Chapters lost in the chaos of the Rifts formation were reformed as primaris-only units as a tribute to the fallen.

Dante could have done something similar post Devastation of Baal.

Negative.

 

Dante states towards the end of Devastation of Baal that the Knights of Blood will not be rebuilt.

 

They redeemed themselves in his eyes and he feels that creating a new Chapter with their name would be an insult and cheapen their sacrifice.

Could be a question of there being Primaris marines created from the gene-seed of those Chapter with maybe implanted knowledge regarding them during their creation that then reuse the name and colours of their gene-seed givers

I think it could one or combination of the following:

1) time line retcon from the gathering storm that wiped out the original 13th black crusade and it’s aftermath that doomed the Relictors

 

2) following #1, guilliman turns a blind eye because desperate times call for desperate measures. He’s too busy, the methods are effective and he may not know entirely everything that’s transpired (up to the retconned fluff that doesn’t exist in this time line). This explains why they have reinforcements.

 

3) GW studio forgot about the chapter that started the mini dex trend, allies, special wargear, fight scenarios and how involved they were leading to and in the eye of terror campaign (explains why they had so many separate WD articles).

 

4) GW forgetting or not, the art department just took the original posted and updated all chapters to primaris.

 

5) the Relictors logo is that of a penitent one, however the grimacing skull has changed. It is jawless, which could be symbolic of them being done with their original penance crusade. I recall the warcom team talking about it in a video when I asked. The response while “unofficial” seemed that gman called all chapters back into the fold with the events of the gathering storm. Desperate times.

 

To respond to your point, if it’s just a new duplicate founding reusing old stuff, it would probably be their old fire claws stuff. Also Cawl is probably the only one that knows if this chapter is really a hybrid gender between UM & DA.

[The Ergonomic Enginseer]

I believe Dogfender is correct there excommunication happened in an older timeline.

you should try and find someone from the Ordo Chronos for more help.

[dogfender]

I still want to know why their icon changed from the grimacing skull to the generic jawless profile skull.

 

I suspect it was an oversight originally when they do often update the images of all the chapters.

Alternatively, for the sake of making it easy they just changed it so they could use the same logo on multiple chapters..

[Brother Tyler]

I prefer the jaw-less skull.

 

The inconsistency I see is in them retaining the penitent markings and color scheme, as well as the name. They completed their penitent crusade, and the "Relictors" name was a nickname given to them once their practice of seeking out and using the weapons of the Great Enemy became known to others. They're the Fire Claws. Their true colors, as described in Angron's Monolith, are black and orange. Even if they are [secretly] continuing their practice of seeking out and using the weapons of the Great Enemy, their successful completion of their penitent crusade should signal approval to return to their Chapter Approved colors. From an in-universe perspective, preservation of their penitent markings and the "Relictors" name is significant. At worst, it's a declaration that they continue to practice those acts for which they were sent on their penitent crusade in the first place - in which case they should be attacked and destroyed by all "right thinking" loyal members of the Imperium. At best, it's a prideful act meant to provoke others. The Chapters of the Adeptus Astartes are prideful and relatively autonomous. Thousands of years of tradition should drive the Chapter to want to return to its true colors and name, not stick to colors and markings, not to mention an insulting name, imposed on them by outsiders.

 

From a real world perspective, I think this is just GW not following through on the lore and catering to players that look at the Relictors from the snapshot of 999.M41.

 

With the revision to the lore and outcome of the Thirteenth Black Crusade of Abaddon the Despoiler and the new events of the great Rift, it's quite possible that the events of the Diamedes Archive no longer happened. By implication of the current lore, the Chapter wasn't declared diabolus extremis.

[dogfender]

My understanding was that they themselves selves had changed their colors and rebranded themselves as the Relictors. Where the skull was the penitence emblem.

But the chapter has had several old index astartes articles in the past with inconsistencies, their chest emblems have changed from black to silver and eyes white to red. I would like some consistency moving forward, but seeing how involved they were in the retcon history of the 13th black crusade and not even mentioned in the recent version.. probably won’t be hearing anything about them

 

I don’t think anyone’s hurting for them to go back to black and orange.

[Brother Tyler]

From the original introduction to the Relictors Chapter, published on the Third War for Armageddon website (the following was also incorporated into the Origins section of the Index Astartes article):

On its initial founding, this Chapter was known as the Fire Claws and fought primarily in warzones surrounding the Eye of Terror, fighting alongside companies of the Cadian Regiment. When the Emperor's Tarot revealed the existence of a badly damaged space hulk emerging from the warp near the Forge World of Stygies in Segmentum Obscurus, the Fire Claws mobilised to intercept it. The hulk, codified as the Captor of Sin, contained a renegade warband led by a Tzeentchian Chaos Champion known as the Excoriator. The Space Marine strike cruisers crippled the vessel as it entered the Stygies System and Terminator Assault Squads led by Librarian Decario and the shadowy figure of Inquisitor De Marche stormed the vessel. Realising they were doomed, the renegades made their stand in a cavern sized engine room where furious battle was joined and Decario and De Marche fought the Excoriator.

 

The Champion was a mighty warrior and carried a weapon forged in the heart of the Eye of Terror, a terrible Daemon sword, with the essence of a greater daemon bound within its steel. The Inquisitor hacked at the Champion with his power axe, but the unnatural armour of the Excoriator was impervious to his blows. The Chaos champion retaliated, his daemon weapon easily cutting through De Marche's armour and grievously wounding him. With one strike, the Excoriator shattered Decario's force sword and laid open his Terminator armour. Decario staggered, but struck back with his power fist, ripping the Chaos Champion's sword arm from its socket in a welter of blood.

 

Even mortally wounded and unarmed, the champion fought with hideous ferocity, smashing the Librarian to the ground and slaughtering four Terminators. Decario muttered a prayer to the Emperor, grabbed the nearest weapon to hand and struck out at the Champion. The Excoriator's head was chopped from his shoulders and Decario realised he had picked up the daemon sword, killing the champion with his own weapon.

 

Decario was filled with a sense of utter purpose as he wielded the Chaos sword, and instinctively felt that this was a weapon that could be turned against the forces of Chaos. The wounded De Marche cautioned the Librarian to put the weapon down, that only he was trained to handle such artefacts. The Librarian handed the Inquisitor the weapon and the Space Marines returned to their ship, leaving behind an Adeptus Mechanicus survey team to search the hulk for the reamains of any archaeotech.

 

De Marche explained that he also believed that such weapons could be used to fight Chaos and should not be destroyed out of hand as was current policy. With the aid of Decario, he was able to convince the Fire Claw's Chapter Master of this and under De Marche's guidance, the Fire Claws embarked on a crusade to explore the worlds around the Eye of Terror and uncover more such relics. Over the decades that followed, many such artefacts were discovered and the Fire Claws Chapter became known as the Relictors.

 

However, it was only a matter of time before the practice of the Relictors using Chaos weapons in battle became known to others. A cell of Inquisitors, backed up by no less than four Chapters of Space Marines and an Emperor class battleship descended upon the Relictor's fortress monastery and demanded they hand over De Marche and all recovered Chaos artefacts or be destroyed. Faced with destruction the Chapter had no choice but to obey. As penance for dealing with heretical weaponry the Chapter was despatched on a century-long penance crusade. De Marche was taken by the Inquisitors and executed as a heretic. As part of their crusade, the Chapter has deployed all ten companies to Armageddon, with a greater concentration of forces in the Equatorial Jungle, particularly in the region surrounding Angron's Monolith.

I had always interpreted "the Fire Claws Chapter became known as the Relictors" to mean that others called the Chapter by that name, but the wording is such that your interpretation is valid.

 

I suspect that most peoples' feelings about the Relictors is driven by how GW has presented them. The official lore has alluded to them once being the "Fire Claws" and having orange and black armour, but the material has always presented them as the Relictors. At the time they were introduced, they were still on their century-long penitent crusade. Now that we are in the Era Indomitus, over a century has passed and the Chapter has presumably atoned.

 

Like the name change, the change in livery and who imposed it is open to interpretation (I'd always inferred that it was forced on them, but the source material doesn't tell us, so it may have been a choice made by the Chapter). Similarly open to debate is whether or not the Chapter would ever revert to its original name and livery.

 

In Angron's Monolith we are presented with Decario's viewpoint:

In his mind's eye, Decario had drifted tens of thousands of light years - and a century and a half - away, in any case. He was clad in the same suit of Terminator armour, but it was painted in the proud colours of the Fire Claws Chapter: orange and black...

That's certainly open to some level of interpretation.

 

Personally, I think that the issue is more a matter of GW not wanting to invalidate anyone's army. Having the Chapter revert to its original name and colors could potentially disappoint those players that had taken the time to paint up Relictors. It could, however, be a conscious decision on the part of GW to preserve the Chapter as the "Relictors" without any further mention to their prior name and livery.

 

The more curious issue to me concerns whether or not the Chapter continues to seek out and use the tools of the Great Enemy. More importantly, how has the integration of the Primaris Space Marines impacted that [proscribed] practice?

 

Ultimately, I think that this is an area where hobbyists' freedom to make the game their own affords them the opportunity to portray the Chapter however they desire. Many will collect the "Relictors" under the common lore of the radical Chapter. I'll stick to two different versions - one the pre-Relictors Fire Claws (after they had begun collecting Chaos artifacts, but before the practice became known to others) and the other a post penitent crusade and fully atoned Fire Claws (with Primaris and without the practice of using Chaos artifacts).

[dogfender]

I concur.

I think that the due to the recent background retcons, I assume the Relictors are still doing what they are known for. Without the inquisition hunting them down there’s no reason to give up what they have spent tons of time doing. Especially since it has been engrained into their beliefs that using the weapons of the enemy against themselves works, is the right answer, and the emperor approves.

 

At this point if it were known or hinted at, guilliman may not know the full extent and in launching the new crusade turned a blind eye because they needed all the help by any means (he was revived and made a pact with the eldar).

[dogfender]

I would like to add that I’d like to have a better understanding as to what their style or theme is. The have never been shown in any other light that standard troops. They recruited from a barbaric and shamanistic home world, secretive inner conclave that gives dark angels vibes and being codex adherent makes me thing standard UM Romanesque garb.

It leaves things open to interpretation but would personally like some design cues haha.

[dogfender]

Looks like the chapters home world has been shown in the new book.

I’ve been compiling some bits to make Artekus Bardane, but haven’t settled on a look. Part of me wants to make him large like Calgar or Tor. But outside of his flail, not sure what else to give him.

 

Bladeguard vets will make for some excellent conclave members wielding chaos relics.

 

I am thinking chapter tactics warded (to represent the chapters use of chaos relics, icons and trinkets throughout) and knowledge is power (due to them having higher numbers of librarians).

Fluffy choices and by far not the best, others that could be fun indomitable, tactical withdrawal, master artisans