Psychic Awakening - Deathwatch Hopes

[Inquisitor Trinity]

I'm still desperately hoping for the vanguard units. The deep strike denial is amazing for the infiltrators and captain and i need eliminators with las fusils for some extra anti-tank.

 

Plus i've already converted some up so i want that to be justified :D

[Prot]

 

So true. But they claim there are no more edition changes.

 

originally I was hoping for unit additions from the Primaris line but now after seeing other PA releases I think that ship has sailed.

 

I’m really feeling like we have a few strats and a couple of chapter style tactics. One thing that always struck me that I kept forgetting to mention was the Grey Shield ability in the Vigilus Defiant.

 

I always thought that detachment and ability was right up our alley. Could you imagine being able to rotate through a couple of chapter tactics once per game?

Blood of Baal included all the data sheets for the Phobos units.

 

Ritual of the Damned was the same way.

 

I would expect the same to be true for the Space Wolves. As such, I imagine it is completely possible, and even likely, to see unit additions given what PA has done with other Marine factions.

 

 

 

Funny I was just about to come back to this post. A good friend of mine who plays the ol' Blood Angels was correcting me on my assumption that there were no new unit additions in PA. He told me about all the stuff he got, and man I am really excited about getting even the simple stuff (if it happens). I mean I love eliminators, Inceptors/Infiltrators, even the Impulsor. I'd just instantly be adding those to my collection. Here's hoping!

[Qui-Gon]

My sincere hope is that we get the various Vanguard Primaris related units.

 

The pessimist inside me is saying we won't.

[Lemondish]

If they're sticking to the paradigm that only model kits with detachable shoulder pads are going to be available, then I imagine there's truly nothing stopping Infiltrators and Incursors from being part of the army. I imagine the Impulsor has no reason not to be added, though I hate that it won't be able to carry my favourite 6 man squads.

 

But honestly, from a standpoint of how cool and fitting they are, those Eliminators would be so awesome.

Edited February 15, 2020 by Lemondish

[Irbis]

Welp, SM nerf just blocked doctrines from stacking AP bonus with anything else. Hopefully this was done with DW in mind and DW gets not-doctrines (like GK) instead but given the seeming incompetence of Cruddace's rule writting, I won't be holding my breath. In fact, him doing thoughtless DW nerf by accident (like he and Kelly did 3 times in 7th edition...) would be pretty much par for the course, funnily enough

[Snazzy]

Needs specialist detachments and extra WLT strats, like everyone else. 

[Brother Cruoris]

We need power of the machine spirit on the Corvus. =)

[Lifeafter]

Is there any word yet about what/when dw is getting?

[Mr4Minutes]

Nope. And it’s not looking like we’re in saga of the beast (but I’m still hoping). Next up is the chaos knights/daemons v ad mech(we think).

 

They’ve “leaked” talons of the Emperor will be in one of them as well. Which means we are that much closer to the DeathWatch release!

[GrinNfool]

Welp, SM nerf just blocked doctrines from stacking AP bonus with anything else. Hopefully this was done with DW in mind and DW gets not-doctrines (like GK) instead but given the seeming incompetence of Cruddace's rule writting, I won't be holding my breath. In fact, him doing thoughtless DW nerf by accident (like he and Kelly did 3 times in 7th edition...) would be pretty much par for the course, funnily enough

Eh they left the wording "unless otherwise indicated" to leave themselves room to give exceptions so there is that.  As to whether or not they think to FAQ an exception to DW sia, thats far more suspect.  Honestly though it only really affects boltguns, SBs, and autobolts anyways, since those are the ap0 SIA weapons.  SIA has built in only allowing for 1 additional AP from the weapon anyways, as kraken caps at ap2 and vengeance at ap3.  While DW certainly can put out quite a few of those guns, its not the end of the world.  Means stalker bolt guns, and 2/3 intercessor weapons already cap out.  Don't think this is the biggest issue though, as unless you are shooting something with a 2+ save you are almost always better off shooting hellfire.

[Qui-Gon]

On the matter of Combat Doctrines "being nerfed to not allow AP stacking", that's a gross misunderstanding of how the rule functioned. It ALWAYS denied stacking unless stated otherwise. Anyone who assumes that this was the nerf did not understand how Combat Doctrines worked to start. Exceptions existed already (See Ultramarines Supplement and the one strat to allow 6s to wound to have a further -1 AP in tactical doctrine that stacks).

[Irbis]

Eh they left the wording "unless otherwise indicated" to leave themselves room to give exceptions so there is that.  As to whether or not they think to FAQ an exception to DW sia, thats far more suspect.  Honestly though it only really affects boltguns, SBs, and autobolts anyways, since those are the ap0 SIA weapons.  SIA has built in only allowing for 1 additional AP from the weapon anyways, as kraken caps at ap2 and vengeance at ap3.  While DW certainly can put out quite a few of those guns, its not the end of the world.  Means stalker bolt guns, and 2/3 intercessor weapons already cap out.  Don't think this is the biggest issue though, as unless you are shooting something with a 2+ save you are almost always better off shooting hellfire.

The problem is the precedent with new rapid fire rules. Remember how DW were excluded from it because of complains from people that it "was just too good", then SM dropped and can rapid fire all day till tomorrow despite being capable of replicating SIA to a large degree with doctrines (or, funnily enough, in case of closest DW equivalent, Sternguard, their special bolters which now can double dip in bonuses)? And DW ruling wasn't reverted despite them being now at the bottom of SM pack?

[Prot]

I think it's the poison. Poison is just so incredibly powerful in 40K. It renders the toughness value, and the cost associated with it as nearly non existent in some cases. As someone who's seen Greater Daemons, Primarchs, etc wounded on 2's... I think it's a valid concern.

[6262]

Would DW players be willing to follow sternguard's example of Hellfire with +1 to wound if it meant better access to rules ported in from the mainline codex?

 

I personally love Hellfire but wish I didn't feel so beholden to it. I'd like to see more choices in how we function beyond list construction.

[GrinNfool]

Would DW players be willing to follow sternguard's example of Hellfire with +1 to wound if it meant better access to rules ported in from the mainline codex?

 

I personally love Hellfire but wish I didn't feel so beholden to it. I'd like to see more choices in how we function beyond list construction.

Not likely, DW aren't going to get scouts, or normal tacs, nor should they, unlikely to give centurions or any of the other good normal codex units.  On top of which why would DW have to take a nerf, when they are objectively worse than normal marines at present.  Unless GW is giving out some pretty massive buffs, I don't see any need to weaken hellfire, or any other SIA shot.  The only way I could see that is if they just made SIA work across all bolt weapons, including aggressors, inceptors, vehicles, etc.  Otherwise any change would involve a pretty heavy redo of how DW rules function, and nothing we have seen in any PA indicate that to be likely.  At this point its already written anyways, and I don't see GW stepping outside the box when it comes to the DW PA.

[Lemondish]

 

Would DW players be willing to follow sternguard's example of Hellfire with +1 to wound if it meant better access to rules ported in from the mainline codex?

 

I personally love Hellfire but wish I didn't feel so beholden to it. I'd like to see more choices in how we function beyond list construction.

Not likely, DW aren't going to get scouts, or normal tacs, nor should they, unlikely to give centurions or any of the other good normal codex units.  On top of which why would DW have to take a nerf, when they are objectively worse than normal marines at present.  Unless GW is giving out some pretty massive buffs, I don't see any need to weaken hellfire, or any other SIA shot.  The only way I could see that is if they just made SIA work across all bolt weapons, including aggressors, inceptors, vehicles, etc.  Otherwise any change would involve a pretty heavy redo of how DW rules function, and nothing we have seen in any PA indicate that to be likely.  At this point its already written anyways, and I don't see GW stepping outside the box when it comes to the DW PA.

 

 

Well, they did kind of completely revamp GK just a book ago, so anything could happen, really. 

[Inquisitor Trinity]

HOLD

 

EVERYTHING

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/02/psychic-awakening-the-call-of-the-packgw-homepage-post-4/

 

DEATHWATCH SAGA OF THE BEAST

 

MAYBE

 

PLEASE

[Trollbeard]

Oooo exciting! Could mean nothing though. As Deathguard were mentioned on PA5, and everyone thought that they would be fighting the tau, but not so!

 

So it could just be story who knows! Would be cool to get some love though, makes sense as DW are “the” Xenos arm on the inquisition.

[Stargate_wars]

HOLD

 

EVERYTHING

 

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/02/psychic-awakening-the-call-of-the-packgw-homepage-post-4/

 

DEATHWATCH SAGA OF THE BEAST

 

MAYBE

 

PLEASE

If the lore blog was 1-3 out of the 4 blogs for each psychic awakening book then Deathwatch would be in but since it happened in the fourth blog your going to have to wait at least 2 books before we get rules. Edited March 2, 2020 by Stargate_wars

[Mobius0288]

I would so like it to be but the way it ended further emphasizes the roles of the Space Wolves and not so much the Deathwatch. It was a really interesting piece though. And for the Watch Captain to do what he did, it could hint at their awareness of things going on around the galaxy. Really liked the aspect of Deathwatch trying to have a higher way of thinking over a regular chapter... not that their better than the other chapters, but that there important threats out there that the rest of the imperium may not be aware of or be able to handle. IDK, it was acool piece.

 

Being sorta vague in case someone hasn't read it yet...

[GrinNfool]

If anything it seemed to say DW wouldn't be in saga.  I would love to be wrong though.

[Mr4Minutes]

I also read it as no DeathWatch in saga. Also, I’m kicking all the space wolves out of my watch fortress. Terrible team players lol.

 

I also liked the subtle hierarchy hints from veteran to sergeant to Watch Captain. I’d definitely like to read a story with DeathWatch as an army more fleshed out.

[Lemondish]

Yeah, unfortunately going to echo the sentiment that DW are probably not in Saga of the Beast. 

 

Whether that's because I do not wish to be disappointed or because I actually believe this is a bit of a red herring, I won't say...

[6262]

I'm probably a dufus but I'm reading it as the Watch Captain says DW are in it to win it. Now does that mean we're actually in the book.... Well that might be another story.

[Lemondish]

I'm probably a dufus but I'm reading it as the Watch Captain says DW are in it to win it. Now does that mean we're actually in the book.... Well that might be another story.

 

Well, there certainly is a character they introduced in this story that does provides an avenue for tying in the DW with the SW, so it's not out of the question...though it seems entirely unlikely. However, if this particular Watch Fortress intended to step up, I think that would have been the result of the story. Instead they let one of their own leave. No further reinforcements. There was the point about the 'big picture', after all - Ghaz may not be the big picture threat Tor believes him to be. 

 

In any case, it sounds like the wolves will have to handle a big loss. A great company, perhaps? Or one of their legendary leaders is killed? The wolf that was gored seems a clear message of a loss. 

Then there's the alpha - perhaps Ragnar? He's the leader of the poster child Space Wolf GC, so it makes sense to be the one taking centre stage. Thick black mane all but makes this certain. And we know from the other story that "His strike will be rash, but it will draw blood." - makes sense that we have the setting with no real role for DW to play.

 

We learned nothing else except that the DW believe their duty is being performed in their current tasks, whatever they might be. When Tor says "For what, cousin? To cull yet more xenos filth that have barely managed to crawl off their native planet?" I think of the Tau, as the only race that comes to mind with a small galactic footprint, all things considered. They've already been handled in their own book, though. Either that or it's some minor xenos species we'll never hear about again, which is just as likely as anything else.

 

In any case, DW being the chamber militant of the Ordo Xenos means they are highly unlikely to be included in a book without a Xenos threat. So, if they aren't in Saga of the Beast, they will need to be included in the Necrons book. The Necrons are certainly not a xenos race barely managing to crawl off their native planet, so that leads me to conclude that this story is meant more for its Space Wolf connection rather than setting a DW appearance. Since the Watch Captain, and indeed even the Imperial Fist Sgt, sees their current role as more important to the greater picture than coming to the aid of the wolves against the beast, then it must mean they have no intention of getting involved. I would think this position is held as a standard position through the watch, what with Caddon stating "That is why Veterans join these ranks, for they should have the wisdom to see the bigger picture."

 

Stranger things have happened, and I'm also reminded of the surprise inclusion of the Tempestus rules in The Greater Good, but it sounds more like the Deathwatch will be in a later book, not in this one. 

 

Plus, the amount of rules updates kind of needed for both Space Wolves and Orks reminds me of Blood of Baal in design.

 

Which would leave a future book with potentially Harlequins, Necrons, and Deathwatch left (perhaps with the Inquisition rules from the WD Index thrown in for good measure). That would then mean a Death Guard, Custodes/Talons, and Sisters of Battle book to round out the entire series. 

 

Be patient, brothers. 

Edited March 3, 2020 by Lemondish