The future of Kill Team: a speculative discussion

[Noserenda]

Exactly, Kill team is going to get rebooted to follow the release model of its more successful (In some ways, its arguable) cousins Warcry and Underworlds with specific releases for the range in addition to just using 40k boxes. Not just because X amount of time has passed. 

[Master Sheol]

KT being the skirmish brother of the main 40k is a lot different from WHU that is a board game

Warcry was born like the "Necromunda of AoS" as it had dedicated warbands (AoS al ready has its skirmish game even if it's not that good)

 

IMHO KillTeam should always be the skormish game of the 40k with little to none dedicated factions

If we want dedicated factions we already have Necromunda

 

What I like about KT is that I can play the particular missions meant for small teams of individuals like special forces sabotage/intelligence missions

[Panzer]

Necromunda is extremely limited in scope though. Sure there's a lot going on in that Hivecity with lots of small mini factions, however ultimately it's restricted to stuff that happens in said Hivecity so you will never see some more exotic xenos or more extreme chaos teams etc.

 

Kill Team on the other hand can easily include those but doesn't really have a place for some of the teams you can find in Necromunda, like the water guild and whatnot.

 

Both systems have their place, if not from a rules perspective then as environment to release different kinds of models that both wouldn't have a place in main 40k similar to what they did with Blackstone Fortress (still baffled we got an actual Man of Iron).

[Sete]

Ya guys think we will have some reveals tomorrow for KT?

[firestorm40k]

Ya guys think we will have some reveals tomorrow for KT?

I doubt it, as the information on WarCom states it's for the next 40k expansions/releases. However, we may get a surprise, but I'm not expecting anything more than 'there'll be Kill Team rules for some of these releases'.

[Master Sheol]

With all the changes (new units, new stats for old units and weapons) we Are witnessing for SM (and we still have to see what is new for other factions) i really hope that KT will get some updates cause there is really the risk that he could become the "special" lesser brother of the regular 40k

 

There is not news for KT in several months and altough GW said they are not forgetting KT it's the same GW that said "you will be able to use 8th edition codexes in 9th"

 

What do you think about this situation?

What would you like to get of the new toys?

[Brother Tyler]

I'm actually expecting GW to hold off on a Kill Team update, getting all of the WH40K updates out first so that they can properly cascade into Kill Team.

[RandyB]

I want Kill Team campaign rules that elegantly transition into the Crusade rules, so I can start with a Kill Team campaign roster and grow it into a 40K Crusade without having to house rule the transition.

[Rogue]

In fairness, you can use 8th edition codexes in 9th.

[RandyB]

Overall, I want a relaunch of Kill Team.

 

The existing is derived from 8th, and as 8th developed further, Kill Team didn't follow along.

 

9th is significantly different from 8th. If Kill Team is not changed to reflect that, it will be less and less "skirmish scale 40K" and more and more "bespoke specialty game".

[Inquisitor Eisenhorn]

It seems like they could just release updated stats in the 2020 KT annual.  I'd be fine with that.

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Yeah, I'm not sure how much revision is needed - some of the 8th edition rules (such as everyone gets to overwatch, with no need to spend CP) seem a better fit for killteam than they did in 8th, so I'm not certain a switch to 9th edition rules is necessary or desired.

 

As for changes to bring kill team in line with the 9th ed codex changes, I think incorporating those is a good idea, but can't realistically happen until after the codexes themselves are updated for 9th.  Given those kind of timelines, it makes sense (to me, anyway) to have a yearly annual covering all the factions that received new codexes that year and that adopts those changes into killteam.

[Brother Navaer Solaq]

Yeah, I'm not sure how much revision is needed - some of the 8th edition rules (such as everyone gets to overwatch, with no need to spend CP) seem a better fit for killteam than they did in 8th, so I'm not certain a switch to 9th edition rules is necessary or desired.

 

I agree that there is no need to switch the kill team rules to 9th edition rules. GW should concentrate on releasing point changes and making sure the errors in books are corrected.

 

I see KT being something they support annually.

After the release of 9th edition, IMO KT has become a specialist game like blood bowl.

[Master Sheol]

 

Yeah, I'm not sure how much revision is needed - some of the 8th edition rules (such as everyone gets to overwatch, with no need to spend CP) seem a better fit for killteam than they did in 8th, so I'm not certain a switch to 9th edition rules is necessary or desired.

 

I agree that there is no need to switch the kill team rules to 9th edition rules. GW should concentrate on releasing point changes and making sure the errors in books are corrected.

 

I see KT being something they support annually.

After the release of 9th edition, IMO KT has become a specialist game like blood bowl.

KT is not a specialist game cause it doesn't have a separate model line with dedicated releases

KT like apocalypse is more like a game mode of the main 40k than a separate game

 

Yes i do agree that KT could need just a New annual/expansion like élite without the need of a totally new ruleset

[RandyB]

Yes i do agree that KT could need just a New annual/expansion like élite without the need of a totally new ruleset

I respectfully disagree.

 

Product management of the Kill Team line has been abysmal. Rogue Trader is a "what were they thinking?" product. Commanders was rushed due to Rogue Trader. Arena is nearly an afterthought. Only Elites fits as you would expect, only long after it should have been released.

 

For the sake of the product line, Kill Team needs a reboot.

[Master Sheol]

 

Yes i do agree that KT could need just a New annual/expansion like élite without the need of a totally new ruleset

I respectfully disagree.

 

Product management of the Kill Team line has been abysmal. Rogue Trader is a "what were they thinking?" product. Commanders was rushed due to Rogue Trader. Arena is nearly an afterthought. Only Elites fits as you would expect, only long after it should have been released.

 

For the sake of the product line, Kill Team needs a reboot.

Rogue Trader is basically a board game adapted to be a KT expansion and has its limits but adds some new things to the game

Commander is a totally optional expansion and IMHO a not necessary one cause KT doesn't need such high level characters

Arena is meant for the tournament gaming so it's of little use in a normal home/club gaming

 

The only mandatory expansion is the best one so i wouldnt complain for optional material you can choose to skip without losing anything in your gaming experience

 

The only thing that could get some rework in KT is the campaign system cause i think that the Crusade system of main 40k is better and i would like if GW will implement a similari system in KT too but they could do it with an expansion/annual without having to make a new ruleset

[RandyB]

 

 

Yes i do agree that KT could need just a New annual/expansion like élite without the need of a totally new ruleset

I respectfully disagree.

 

Product management of the Kill Team line has been abysmal. Rogue Trader is a "what were they thinking?" product. Commanders was rushed due to Rogue Trader. Arena is nearly an afterthought. Only Elites fits as you would expect, only long after it should have been released.

 

For the sake of the product line, Kill Team needs a reboot.

Rogue Trader is basically a board game adapted to be a KT expansion and has its limits but adds some new things to the game

Commander is a totally optional expansion and IMHO a not necessary one cause KT doesn't need such high level characters

Arena is meant for the tournament gaming so it's of little use in a normal home/club gaming

 

The only mandatory expansion is the best one so i wouldnt complain for optional material you can choose to skip without losing anything in your gaming experience

 

We'll have to agree to disagree. Especially because...

 

The only thing that could get some rework in KT is the campaign system cause i think that the Crusade system of main 40k is better and i would like if GW will implement a similari system in KT too but they could do it with an expansion/annual without having to make a new ruleset

Here we agree. :)

 

I'd like to see a Crusade-compatible rework of the Kill Team campaign system. I want to be able to gracefully transition from a Kill Team campaign into a Crusade - grow my kill team to the point that it "outgrows" Kill Team and qualifies as a Crusade force.

[Master Sheol]

 

 

 

Yes i do agree that KT could need just a New annual/expansion like élite without the need of a totally new ruleset

I respectfully disagree.

 

Product management of the Kill Team line has been abysmal. Rogue Trader is a "what were they thinking?" product. Commanders was rushed due to Rogue Trader. Arena is nearly an afterthought. Only Elites fits as you would expect, only long after it should have been released.

 

For the sake of the product line, Kill Team needs a reboot.

Rogue Trader is basically a board game adapted to be a KT expansion and has its limits but adds some new things to the game

Commander is a totally optional expansion and IMHO a not necessary one cause KT doesn't need such high level characters

Arena is meant for the tournament gaming so it's of little use in a normal home/club gaming

 

The only mandatory expansion is the best one so i wouldnt complain for optional material you can choose to skip without losing anything in your gaming experience

 

We'll have to agree to disagree. Especially because...

 

The only thing that could get some rework in KT is the campaign system cause i think that the Crusade system of main 40k is better and i would like if GW will implement a similari system in KT too but they could do it with an expansion/annual without having to make a new ruleset

Here we agree.

 

I'd like to see a Crusade-compatible rework of the Kill Team campaign system. I want to be able to gracefully transition from a Kill Team campaign into a Crusade - grow my kill team to the point that it "outgrows" Kill Team and qualifies as a Crusade force.

 

Yes... and it can be done with a expansion (KT:Crusade maybe?) or a annaual without the need of a totally new rulebook

[Arendious]

Frankly, I'd like to see the opposite of a KT-to-Crusade pipeline. Given the nature of Kill Teams as "special missions" teams, I'd like a set of rules to flexibly 'nominate' regular 40K troopers and units to join a Kill Team, and bring some of that experience back. (Sort of like how Crusade balances differing advancement levels and perks.)

[RandyB]

Frankly, I'd like to see the opposite of a KT-to-Crusade pipeline. Given the nature of Kill Teams as "special missions" teams, I'd like a set of rules to flexibly 'nominate' regular 40K troopers and units to join a Kill Team, and bring some of that experience back. (Sort of like how Crusade balances differing advancement levels and perks.)

I like this idea, too. How about both?

[Master Sheol]

So after the codex reveals we had new units that should join KT

Assault intercessor and bladeguard veterani sergeants now have interesting weapon options

Eradicators have new weapon options too

Heavy intercessors are a thing and they look amazing

 

Necrons will receive the new Ophidian destroyers that are cool and deadly

 

There are also three new potential commanders in the form of new space Marine captain and the two new cryptek variants

Edited September 14, 2020 by Master Sheol

[Mandragola]

The new marine codex will mean that Kill team's stats for existing marines will be all over the place. A significant number of units need an extra wound added to their profile. What we've got currently for marines is based on their original 8th edition codex, not even the current one. The 9th edition book will make them seriously out of date.

 

I agree with the people saying Kill team needs a reboot. Terrain is really key to KT and the rules for it in 40k have been changed a lot. The result is to make the two games feel really different. You're using the same models but they've got different stats and the game itself isn't all that similar. It's all just a bit odd.

[Inquisitor Eisenhorn]

The new marine codex will mean that Kill team's stats for existing marines will be all over the place. A significant number of units need an extra wound added to their profile. What we've got currently for marines is based on their original 8th edition codex, not even the current one. The 9th edition book will make them seriously out of date.

 

I agree with the people saying Kill team needs a reboot. Terrain is really key to KT and the rules for it in 40k have been changed a lot. The result is to make the two games feel really different. You're using the same models but they've got different stats and the game itself isn't all that similar. It's all just a bit odd.

I don't think there is any inherent problem with Kill Team's rules being substantially different from 40k. It's a skirmish game, where every model has a lot more potential detail to it. You could actually make a case that it SHOULD be substantially different and that it's not is more of a compromise to leverage rules familiarity for 40k players than an actual boon to Kill Team as its own game.

 

I personally DON'T want them to completely reboot the rules, but it would be cool to have the generally tougher meaner marine profiles to filter over because they feel more thematically accurate to the lore.

 

What I would like to see is just a lot more units given KT profiles, period. Aggressors, Heavy Intercessors, dreadnoughts, why not? I don't really buy into the idea that you are just playing 40k if you allow big heavies or light vehicles because having squad coherence rules and squad based tactics are always going to feel very different than a skirmish where every model acts independently. And having big scary threats like say, an ambull is already a thing, so why not just go all in and let most things in, and also stop with the slow drip of rules for KT, just have them all there and let people play what they want. Honestly the most frustrating thing about KT is the artificial limitations they place on what is given profiles. Just put out new KT indexes, chaos, imperium, xenos and let us play with our whole collections, GW.

[Mandragola]

Yeah to be fair they don't really need to reboot the rules. I think maybe the ideal thing for me would be to add kill team rules to codexes, or at least synch them to codex releases.

[Sete]

How much longer we need to wait? :(