The Heralds of Retribution

[pawl]

Didn't realise this post had sent! Apologies for double posting! Edited April 1, 2020 by pawl

[pawl]

If nothing I else I think I just like the hidden extra meaning. I'm not sure I could ever make a good reference to it in a character history or similar, but it's cool nonetheless.

 

 

You make a good point. Of the three I would take the last, simply because the former both imply some kind of closeness with heresy, which I would rather avoid.

 

As a fourth option, how plausible would it be for the returning force to have requested permission to resupply and leave once more to follow up on other leads they had discovered - the SGM, knowing that he didn't have Brothers to spare in another theatre, instead offered the returning Master the option of more neophytes and control to induct and train for himself.

 

It's a bit tenuous, but I'm not sure how a strike force could much improve in the eyes of the DA. They're already pretty good at what they do!

 

Perhaps knowledge of the chapter secrets would be a good reason for splitting off though jbaeza94 - I have always found it strange that it isn't more widely known. The DA have been known to mind-wipe those that learn too much, but surely there would be lots of unanswered questions within the chapter, to the point where it would become a problem?

 

 

Edit;

 

Okay, so, more thoughts!

 

During the encounter with the fallen sorcerer, he tries to convert the Dark Angels to his cause. Thanks to his powers his voice echoes around the valley over the sound of the gunfire as he makes his case, revealing the secrets of Luther's betrayal and denouncing the hunt for the fallen as misguided.

 

After his subsequent capture the Chaplain refutes the claims the Lion turned his back on Luther and the forces at Aldurrukh, but Brothers within the strike force had heard too much to simply deny the Legion's history, or wipe their collective memories. The Chaplain is forced to recant a little of their history, but leaves out what details he can.

 

Returning to the Rock, the SGM is furious that the truth has been acknowledged, but cannot accept the potential loss of nearly a full company of Astartes. The order to depart as an Unforgiven chapter is given, on the grounds that the secrets of the Legion do not spread to the other chapters.

 

 

Again, early thoughts that I'm typing up while I should be doing other things!

Edited April 1, 2020 by pawl

[jbaeza94]

I'm personally not a fan of a secret founding chapter, it seems too special. The disciples of caliban are considered exceptionally rare case,since they were requested to be commissioned. Not saying you cant roll with it, but I'd consider a different angle. A founding takes about a century and a half from beginning to end if I remember correctly, this prepares all logistics, gene seed, armor, and requisition of veterans to lead the new chapter. A squad or 2 couldn't just take off and start a new chapter without all the logical support involved, and I doubt any chapter would give up a company size element. I know you want them to be a split from an established chapter, so I propose something.

 

Initially I thought 2nd founding, since all legions were broken up, but the fallen werent known about at that time. So this leads to my next idea. When the fallen were discovered a few hundred years later, I'm sure there would have been a meeting of the grand masters to discuss what the heck was going on. I don't know the exact timing of this, you'll have to look it up, but I'd find the closest founding to that and say they were brought into the fold with the roll you have in mind. Alternatively, they could be a 2nd/3rd founding chapter who at said theoretical meeting were given the honor to prosecute the hunt as its primary purpose. Over time, the original culture of the chapter was lost and evolved into what it is today, with lots of traditions having origins whose meanings have been bastardized or are just parodies of the originals.

 

 

Dont take this the wrong way please. When creating a new chapter, most writers will make their chapter too unique or special initially. This is fine. No one wants dark angels in purple, ultramarines in red, salamanders in orange. We want a unique flavor. But we often go too far. We end up creating purple dark angels that are better because they are, red ultramarines that or more adherent to the codex because they just are, etc etc. I know I did with my iron lions. They were too unique, and I've toned it down alot in the 4 years or so since initial concept and theyve grown into something that's unique but not Mary Sueish.

 

Something I've learned in writing classes is plot shouldn't bend to the character, or chapter in your case, but rather the character should change or be forced to into action because of the plot. I feel a chapter being formed from another is plot bending to the chapter since it's not normal. But not unprecedented, look at the iron hands and the sons of medusa (I think), that is the only in lore example I can remember of a chapter breaking off to create a new one. Look at the circumstances of why it happened. Maybe this could be inspiration for you if you really want to do the chapter split

Edited April 1, 2020 by jbaeza94

[pawl]

"Dont take this the wrong way please."

 

No no, not at all!

To be honest I have given this very little proper thought, so it's very much appreciated, and what you've said makes perfect sense.

 

I've been out of the hobby for maybe five years or so, and the five before that I wasn't particularly active. Back when I was fully involved I wasn't bothered about background, and I was more interested in making a mess of things with a paintbrush! I'm hoping that this time round I can get right back to basics, relearn what I've forgotten and actually get it right!

 

It would appear that unsanctioned chapter creation isn't quite as common as I was lead to believe, so it makes more sense to change things based on that.

I'm heading off to bed shortly, but my initial thoughts (obviously this is before I've done any reading, especially regarding dates) are about an earlier founded chapter perhaps being reinvented for the Hunt, which would go part way to explaining the three colour scheme. Something along the lines of the midnight blue being a nod to the Legion colours, the bone/off white being the chapter's early colours, and the purple being the new colour. The scale of the change could perhaps be explained in part by some catastrophic event, like severe losses sustained during a chapter-strength engagement. The recolouring and renaming to something hunt-related would then come during the period of rebuilding.

 

I obviously need to have a think about it, but that will give me something to do tomorrow while I'm doing the jobs I'm supposed to be focussed on!

Edited April 2, 2020 by pawl

[Berzul]

Well, that idea could work I think.

 

Maybe the chapter was a second or third founding, and then got refounded sometime later and given a new designation, heraldry and color.

[pawl]

I've got a vague idea in my head, going to see where I can take it. Annoyingly there doesn't seem to be any precise (or even imprecise) dates for when the Fallen started turning up, or the Hunt was started. It seems to have been quite quick though, with some sources saying it was during M31.

 

As a result the long and short of my idea is that they were a Second Founding Chapter (gotta love the lack of records from then!) that fought heavily during the Great Scouring. Fully three quarters of the chapter were engaged within the Cadian Sector, pushing themselves at a punishing pace to try and atone for (and hide) the failings of their Progenitor. Those not engaged were mostly the wounded and those in need of repair and refit.

 

With so few battle-ready brothers on-board their flagship the [AsYetUnnamed] were entirely unprepared for defensive operations when caught off-guard by a small traitor legion splinter fleet. The chapter ships took heavy losses and were forced to break away, leaving their ground forces at the mercy of the newly-reinforced traitor legions. A distress call was made to the Dark Angels already in-system, but the first couldn't engage until near-total losses had been sustained.

 

Battered and broken, the newly-appointed Chapter Master (the previous encumbent of the title having been slain in combat) approached the Supreme Grand Master (earliest name I can find is Purson, but I don't know if he held the title at that time) to account for the chapter's disgrace.

The chapter was ordered to withdraw and reform, as they still had a role to play within the newly organised Hunt for the Fallen. In doing so they could be forgiven for the sins of their Legion, and their failings as a chapter. This prompted the recolouring to purple armour (I'm working on figuring out how the blue and bone come in) and the adoption of their new title as Heralds of Retribution.

 

During the period of rebuilding the chapter focuses heavily on all forms of training and tactics, searching out all manner of texts on the art of warfare. The Heralds refuse to accept the idea of being caught off-guard again, valuing tactical expertise highly. Additionally this has lead to incredible stubbornness - if the Heralds can't out-maneuver their opponent and are faced with an unwinnable situation they will win by simply refusing to die.

 

 

That's kinda where I'm starting from. Any major holes?

 

Edit: I've already found one myself! The codex astartes was finished at the end of the great scouring, so I'll have to adjust things slightly. I'm sure I can find a reason for them to get caught out though!

 

Also some good news - this came today!

At the minute the UK is on lockdown, which for me means no work (at least, not the kind that requires a uniform), and thus more time than usual to devote to hobbies. Unfortunately all of my hobby supplies (including a large pile of Dark Angel shaped plastic) aren't with me, and I can't get to them until restrictions are lifted.

Not one to be beaten, I have simply bought a small fortunes worth of stuff online! The last things to arrive will be tools and brushes (army painter, so coming from NL), but in the next few days I should hopefully be able to start putting paint on plastic!

Edited April 7, 2020 by pawl

[pawl]

Quick question! How looked down upon is it to write in the chapter using the DA insignia? It would make transfer use much easier, and also mean that I wouldn't have to remove DA icons from DA models. Edited April 6, 2020 by pawl

[Berzul]

The exact same icons?

Might be weird. Maybe just change the colors a bit?

 

For example, my chapter uses a winged sword as well, but the wings are red.... just to break it from the standard DA iconography.

[pawl]

I'm thinking mostly that my painting skills are going to be rather rusty, and I wasn't at freehand level when I stopped, so being able to use standard transfers would be a big help. I could go down the custom route but I don't imagine that would be cheap.

[jbaeza94]

Crimson fists and imperial fists is probably the most notorious example. The exact same symbol. I'd do as berzul said and maybe change the color, if the icon, but feel free to use it.

[pawl]

I'll have to see what I can do. For now I don't have any transfer sheets to hand anyway, so it doesn't matter too much. Once I do I can start trying to figure out how to make it work - painting over the top of them isn't an ideal scenario, but I'm sure I'll come up with something.

[jbaeza94]

If anything modify the decal, maybe just have it be the sword and right wing. That way you can keep it white, and molded insignias wont be too crazy to fix

[pawl]

Early paint test using P3 Beaten Purple as the base colour.

https://i.imgur.com/uZPtBw2.jpg

Thoughts?

 

Waiting on some Phoenician Purple to arrive for a second colour test so I'll be able to compare the two. =]

[Galloway]

Not what I'd immediately think of as an Unforgiven color scheme, but they work very well together and look great there.

[jbaeza94]

That looks sweet. That chest is amazing. I wish I could do whites like that

[pawl]

@Galloway

It's not entirely fitting with what you usually see, I'll admit, but I just like purple! I'm not entirely convinced on the shade yet, but I'm hoping to have more paint arriving tomorrow for further tests.

 

@jbaeza

That's not actually white yet! I seem to remember that the old Citadel Codex Grey (do they still make that?) used to cover really well over darker colours as a base, so I tried something similar over the black undercoat with what I think was either Vallejo Wolf or Ghost Grey. The coverage was as good as I was hoping for, and I should be able to use it to build up to white.

 

At the minute everything I've done is experimentation. It's also a little messy, because I was painting at night, and while I had a spotlight there wasn't much ambient light, so seeing what I was doing was problematic! Still, with another session or two I'm hoping to have something workable. Fortunately after much searching I've managed to find almost everything I want, too - all of my supplies are currently elsewhere and unreachable, so I've had to replace my entire setup, including paints.

[pawl]

Phoenician Purple turned up today, and unfortunately it's not a shade I'll be using. Definitely sticking with the P3 Beaten - seeing it with fresh eyes tonight has helped, I think.

 

So! Tried a little highlighting. Turns out I'm really not very good! Still, a bit of practice and I might get there. Also working on the rest of the first test marine and its slowly coming together I think. Might even be able to call it finished tomorrow, if I can get the helmet (specifically the lenses, which I'm really struggling with) right, and finish making both the plasma and the aquila not look awful.

 

For the second test I want to try out Druchii Violet for shading, assuming it's dark enough, but that won't arrive for a day or two.

 

https://i.imgur.com/UWbJw3q.jpg

(apologies for the links - I don't think this forum automatically resizes images, and I'm lazy!)

[bigtrouble]

Super clean look.

[pawl]

Apologies in advance for photo quality - ambient lighting where I paint isn't the best, especially at night, so having to use lamplight for these!

 

 

Haven't managed to sit down again until tonight, but I'm a little closer to a finished test model.

https://i.imgur.com/MAnQJzF.jpg

 

Backpack in particular is still rough, and I'm not yet sure how to try the Aquila next, but I'm liking it.

 

Also had a first-ever attempt at battle damage on another model, but I'm not sure how much I like it. Might just be because my line work isn't anywhere near as smooth as I'd like.

https://i.imgur.com/zIAMoLk.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/ge73SJB.jpg

 

 

Edit:

It's not perfect, but it'll do, I think. Kinda gave up on the helmet lenses and Aquila though, and called it quits before there was that much paint you couldn't make out the detail.

https://i.imgur.com/rT9y2UM.jpg

Edited April 25, 2020 by pawl

[ranulf the revenant]

Like I said, I like them. Upon seeing them again, I wondered if you channeled 90s Batman through your models?

Actually kind of fitting for Dark Angels successors, Haha...

[pawl]

Like I said, I like them. Upon seeing them again, I wondered if you channeled 90s Batman through your models?

Actually kind of fitting for Dark Angels successors, Haha...

I can't say that it was in my head, but I'm going to take it as being a good thing!