Which dreadnought do you recommend for an UM army?

[k0ldsh0ck]

Hi everyone,

 

I would like to get a dreadnought for my UM army, and am wondering if one particular dreadnought is better than another for UM in general, or whether it is entirely personal preference. From my reasearch it seems I should be looking at either a Leviathan, Contemptor or Deredeo dread. If it would be helpful to know my army list, I can of course add it here.

 

Thank you for your advice!

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Relic Contemptor with double twin las and missile rack.

[emperorpants]

As black blow fly said, the relic contemptor with twin Las is likely the best choice. You also can't go wrong with a twin storm cannon Levi dread, so I'd like to recommend it as well. Ultras can make a Levi dread deceptively durable. Take Tiggy and have him put might of heroes on it and also use his -1 to hit ability on it. That coupled with duty eternal makes for a tough dreadnought to kill, especially with it's great base stats. It's not iron hands level durable, but it's going to be tough for your opponents to shift. It's weaknesses are it's points cost and range.

[The Unseen]

^That's a good one. Redemptors also seem solid if you want a more mid-field threat, because Ultras can have it move and fire without suffering the penalty (The redemptors biggest weakness), and also let it disengage if it gets bogged down in combat and still let loose with its plethora of guns. And its fist is no joke.

 

Leviathans are good for everyone, Ultras are no exemption.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I feel like in general dreads have made a huge comeback and can be a staple unit.

[Subtleknife]

I dont play ultra competitive but I've been thinking of going with a deredeo with pavise as I play primaris only and have been finding my repulsors getting shot off the board. I think the 5++ would really help the repulsors.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

It could it if it’s taking a lot of shots. On the other hand how about an Executioner and a Repulsors ?

[Subtleknife]

Yeah that is what I run an executioner and repulsor. I thought the deredeo might compliment them nicely

[NKirkham24]

On the dual lascannon contemptor, are you all using forge world or have you converted some? I have the plastic contemptor and was thinking of sawing the arms off it to fit dual lascannons. Do you all use the forge world models or have you got lascannons to replace sourced from elsewhere?

[CCE1981]

Contemptor Mortis Dreadnoughts.  

 

I tried the Dreadnought, Venerable Dreadnought, and Ironclad Dreadnought.  They all died to the first Twin Lascannon that looked in their direction.  When you lose three dreadnoughts a game for five games to the first thing that shoots at them you just give up.  The Contemptors, Redemptors, and Leviathan all take some effort to remove.

[ValourousHeart]

While it doesn't have the Dreadnought keyword, the Invictor Warsuit checks all of the Dreadnought boxes and introduces some cool abilities that other Dreadnoughts don't have.

 

I used to take 2 Ven Dreads w/ autocannons with my list, but have since switched to 2 Invictors.  They work so much better, and the Invictor's speed means that they better support the high speed focus of the rest of my list.  The increased number of guns more than makes up for the reduced BS.  The additional wounds compared to the Ven Dread means that I would have to make that FNP save 5 times to balance the 2 units.  And finally when combined with the general points reduction that marines have received, the fact that the Invictor is cheaper than the Ven Dread allowed me to get an extra unit into my 2k list.

[Medjugorje]

in terms of fluff or gamewise?

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Relic Contemptors and the Levi all have an invul.

[Karhedron]

On the dual lascannon contemptor, are you all using forge world or have you converted some? I have the plastic contemptor and was thinking of sawing the arms off it to fit dual lascannons. Do you all use the forge world models or have you got lascannons to replace sourced from elsewhere?

 

I have seen someone do a simple but effective conversion of the plastic Contemptor using the twin lascannons from the Landraider and a Terminator Cyclone Missile launcher. Land Raider lascannons can be picked up very easily because may people have spare if they build their Land raider as a Redeemer or Crusader.

 

Not quite as shiny as the FW version perhaps but perfectly legal and looks fine.

[Captain Idaho]

In my experience, keeping "ordinary" Dreadnoughts alive is a matter of target saturation. You need some armoured targets the opponent HAS to remove in a quick amount of time.

 

When it comes to a gunline, it's easy to choose the smaller standard Dreadnoughts. They are often sporting Lascannons and Missile Launchers and their removal ahead of a Mortis Contemptor will reduce firepower coming down table and be easier to achieve.

 

So what armoured units are more urgent in the target priority list? Contemptors that are designed to get close to an opponent! A single fist and movement of 9" will often scare opponents. Likewise, if you have assault forces in transports coming forward, these elements become more important to target than your Dreadnoughts.

 

Most people play 40K as a means to get weapons into their lists and this mindset leans on a mathammer, one way, principle. Combined arms approaches, with a view to actually use movement and the assault phase, will open up the viability of a host of different units on the table.

 

***

 

As for centrepiece models, a Leviathan can't go far wrong. I like double Grav Flux Bombards for sheer killing potential. Damage 5 on vehicles will upset people too ;)

Edited May 4, 2020 by Captain Idaho

[Ishagu]

Relic Contemptor with double twin Las and Missiles, or a Contemptor Mortis with the same equipment.

[HighMarshalAmp]

You can move during the Tactical doctrine without counting as having moved.

So why not a double C-beam cannon?

I mean, the C-beam is nasty but few people take it 'cause of its obvious limitations... you can circumvent that.

 

Edit:

 

via Imgflip Meme Generator

Edited May 4, 2020 by HighMarshalAmp

[Karhedron]

I dont play ultra competitive but I've been thinking of going with a deredeo with pavise as I play primaris only and have been finding my repulsors getting shot off the board. I think the 5++ would really help the repulsors.

I think the Deredeo actually brings quite a lot for the UMs. As well as its 5++ bubble, it can move and shoot without penalty on turns 2 and 3 and can pop Wisdom of the Ancients to give units in its bubble a reroll of 1s to Hit.

 

I would go for the Autocannon battery as 8 S8 2D shots is pretty tasty.

[CCE1981]

 

I dont play ultra competitive but I've been thinking of going with a deredeo with pavise as I play primaris only and have been finding my repulsors getting shot off the board. I think the 5++ would really help the repulsors.

I think the Deredeo actually brings quite a lot for the UMs. As well as its 5++ bubble, it can move and shoot without penalty on turns 2 and 3 and can pop Wisdom of the Ancients to give units in its bubble a reroll of 1s to Hit.

 

I would go for the Autocannon battery as 8 S8 2D shots is pretty tasty.

Just note that if a Deredeo moves it does not give that 5++ bubble. The Ultramarine Super Doctrine only let’s you count as stationary for the purpose of shooting only.

 

NM it’s the Helical array that requires stationary.

Edited May 4, 2020 by CCE1981

[Karhedron]

Yes, fortunately the Atomantic Pavise functions regardless of movement.

[Subtleknife]

 

I dont play ultra competitive but I've been thinking of going with a deredeo with pavise as I play primaris only and have been finding my repulsors getting shot off the board. I think the 5++ would really help the repulsors.

I think the Deredeo actually brings quite a lot for the UMs. As well as its 5++ bubble, it can move and shoot without penalty on turns 2 and 3 and can pop Wisdom of the Ancients to give units in its bubble a reroll of 1s to Hit.

 

I would go for the Autocannon battery as 8 S8 2D shots is pretty tasty.

Agreed. I think the autocannon is the only load out worth running as well. The lascannon is disappointing for the points imo

[Cruor Vault]

Relic Contemptor with double twin Las and Missiles, or a Contemptor Mortis with the same equipment.

 

Personally I find adding the missiles ups it's cost and threat enough that they have a hard time making their points back.

 

However a Contemptor Mortis with Plasma + Missiles is surprisingly cheap and extremely effective.

[Ishagu]

I love the missiles, personally, and they recently received a point drop.

 

It's a potential extra 12 wounds to a vehicle. Best case of course...

 

*fixed typo*

Edited May 6, 2020 by Ishagu

[Cruor Vault]

I love the missiles, personally, and they recency got a point drop.

 

It's a potential extra 12 wounds to a vehicle. Best case of course...

 

Yeah the price drop was nice, but they're a little overcosted still. 

 

A Cyclone is about 60% as dangerous as a Twin Lascannon, but is valued a 80% of the Lascannon's points.  Sure the alternate fire mode is a nice little bonus, but at 2D3 Bolter shots it's not a very useful bonus.

 

It also pushes the Dread into the "Signifiant Threat" territory both in terms of visually and it being 200+pts.

 

It's why I DO like them on the Mortis versions.  A Mortis with the Twin Plasma and the Cyclones costs 16pts less than a quad Lascannon Mortis but doesn't have the 'Significant Threat' factor to it.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

The Mortis has less wounds, slower movement, lower ballistic skill (?) and no invul. It’s great value for the points for sure and that’s a good reason to use it, just depends on what you want.