So, what's the point of assault Intercessors?

[Cap'm Heckus]

Okay, I was mostly “pro-AI“ until this new wounds update. Now I’m in the “yeah, what is the point” boat. I haven’t even assembled mine yet and their instantly invalidated. One extra attack and 1 AP on their pistol doesn’t hold up well to my regular assault marines getting Jump Packs and real weapon options.

 

I guess they go into a box to gather dust until the next gimmick makes them suddenly awesome...

[Minsc]

Okay, I was mostly “pro-AI“ until this new wounds update. Now I’m in the “yeah, what is the point” boat. I haven’t even assembled mine yet and their instantly invalidated. One extra attack and 1 AP on their pistol doesn’t hold up well to my regular assault marines getting Jump Packs and real weapon options.

 

I guess they go into a box to gather dust until the next gimmick makes them suddenly awesome...

1) Assault Marines aren't troops.

2) Assault Marines don't have A2.

3) Assault Marines with Jumppacks will def. cost more than Assault Intercessors on foot.

4) (This might change) Assault Marines don't have access to all the Primaris-only Stratagems. 

 

Vanguard on foot on the other hand; same number of attacks and have easy access to a variety of weapon options and cheap(ish) Rhino's, but they're still not troops nor do they have access to the Primaris-related Stratagems.

 

Seriously, being troops is a massive advantage in 9th. 

Intercessors would still be a good pick for the very same reason even if Sternguard with Special Issue Boltguns would be the same amount of points or merely +1 ppm as Intercessors.

 

[Hymnblade]

4) (This might change) Assault Marines don't have access to all the Primaris-only Stratagems.

 

The only Primaris-only stratagem that Assault Intercessors have access to is Gene-Wrought Might. That's a decent strat on a unit with a bunch of S4 attacks, but it's not a huge deal.

 

VVets with jump packs, chainswords, and shields will probably continue to be just straight-up better than Assault Squads, though. They don't have obsec, but they have enough attacks to threaten most obsec units unless the objective is pretty heavily defended, and enough movement that your opponent can't easily defend everything in their threat range, while also being reasonably durable (2+/4++) and still probably not too expensive.

[Mandragola]

The 2w change for normal marines is huge, and definitely doesn’t help these guys. AIs are troops and that’s great. But they’re slow, difficult to transport and may lack special weapon options. Vanguard veterans with 2 wounds are looking like a really excellent choice at the moment.

 

Obsec is great of course, but killing everything nearby is probably better.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

They do just fine in an Impulsor. I’m sure soon enough the sergeant will have access to powerfist/thunderhammer. I’ll be using mine.

[Dracos]

And ... I thought I saw a point increase for Tacticals that put them in the Primaris ballpark. Can't imagine Assault Marines are going to get off any better.

[Marshal Reinhard]

We don't know if the multipart kit will bring any armament options either. While I suspect it'll be on the light side, there may still be options.

[Karhedron]

And ... I thought I saw a point increase for Tacticals that put them in the Primaris ballpark. Can't imagine Assault Marines are going to get off any better.

Going by Tacticals, GW seem the value the extra wound at 3 points which would imply 18 point Assault Marines. They are clearly more points-effective but it is difficult to value just being a Troop unit.

[War Angel]

 

And ... I thought I saw a point increase for Tacticals that put them in the Primaris ballpark. Can't imagine Assault Marines are going to get off any better.

Going by Tacticals, GW seem the value the extra wound at 3 points which would imply 18 point Assault Marines. They are clearly more points-effective but it is difficult to value just being a Troop unit.

Sorry, did you miss the part where they had an extra attack? And access to better stratagems? It’s not just that they are troops, it’s the combination.

 

And the new codex isn’t out yet, there could be even more.

[Minsc]

Yeah I don't see Assault Marines replacing Assault Intercessors without a major overhaul, like turning them into troops and giving them a free transport.

The main problem with Assault Marines in 8th was that Vanguard did what they did, but much better (+1 A, +1 Ld, better weaponoptions) for slightly higher pricetag, and neither where troops. 

Now Assault Intercessors will pretty much fill the same role as Vanguard on foot, and for roughly the same price, but unlike Assault Marines, at least Assault Intercessors can fall back on being Troops (and having some funky Stratagems), and if you're thinking about taking Assault Marines with Jumppack, why not just take Vanguard with Jumppack instead?

Basically, TLDR: I didn't see the point in Assault Marines in 8th and I don't see the point in 9th - unless you're out of both Troop- and Elite-slots and really want to add a unit of chainsword-wielding marines to your list. 
 

[Mandragola]

For me, jump packs are the point. They're a whole lot cheaper than an impulsor and they let you deep strike. For an army like BA that's pretty cool. Any assault troop is hugely reliant on whether it can actually make it to assault, so doubling the unit's speed and making it fly helps a whole lot.

 

That said, I think vanguard vets will continue to outclass assault marines. And elite choices are also easier to come by, as you get 6 in a battalion instead of 3.

[Karhedron]

Agreed. And if you need cheap FA units to fill a Brigade, I think MM Attack bikes look a whole lot better in this role.

[jaxom]

Assault Marines were a good match for earlier designs of Space Marine codexes. Units were better than average, but none out-specialized other codex specialists. The trick was to leverage the rock-paper-scissors appropriately ("Chop da shooty un's an' shoot da choppy un's" as the Ork players might say). The game expanded and Space Marines received new units which were legitimately good at a role even compared to other codexes (or at least as good). Vanguard Veterans were straight up better versions of Assault Marines while the latter did not have the benefit of being a Troop choice (compared to Sternguard Veterans and Tactical Marines). Unless one is aiming for a niche army with as many jump packs as possible then Assault Marines have no place in most modern Space Marine armies. Bikers (including Outriders) and land speeders are a more viable fast option and (again) Vanguard Veterans are harder hitting. The question is the follow up. Assault Intercessors in Impulsors are a viable second wave unit; obvious enough so the opponent knows they have to deal with, but not so threatening compared to the first wave that they feel they absolutely must.