Archeopter Tactica

[Prot]

I just thought we should have a place to talk specifically about this unit, and all its variants.

 

So I took the bat-copter out for a ride last night. The game was against the heinous Tau. Now the last time I played against this particular Tau player, he was shocked that with the Manipulus I could out range him. 

 

It took him two turns to figure out what I was doing, and that cost him the game. So this time he came out with longer range weapons on his Stormsurge, and Riptide. All the Crisis Suits came with a variety of weaponery, using strats and relic weapons from his Psychic Awakening.

 

But this isn't a battle report so I'll cut to the chase. I know that I have been laughed at, and mocked for my sincere interest in the Bat-Bomber (Archeopter Fusilade). 

 

So what I did was take one Fusilade, and one Stratoraptor. The Stratoraptor took the Chaff wargear, so I could not use the strat I've been eyeing up for shutting down aura's. However it would be a good diversion. On the surface, no one wants to get hit with S10 Lascannons (Mars Canticle.)

 

Here's the short version:

-Tau get first turn. He hides all his characters, Shadowsun, Ethereal, etc to set up for mega shooting fortress as usual.

 

- Tau ignore the Fusilade, and this sets up my first turn. (BTW beforehand I fully explained my intent with the aura shut down.) I move over a massive Kroot squad, allowing me to drop the maximum bombs 10 x D6. I kill 5 of them. 

 

- I carefully make sure we do this in the right order because I want to shut down his 6 + FnP aura from the Ethereal.  It's worth noting that there are lots of 'defensive' auras that make this Statagem worth using. So I played the strat, then dropped the bombs. It's my turn, I get to pick the order of opeeration. I shut his FnP off, killed the Kroot.

 

- The other shots poured into his previously hidden drones out of LoS, protecting a nearby Riptide. (This is a great bonus any flyer can leverage. As with my Eldar, this is a tactic you slowly develop over time BUT because I don't like "Gotcha 40K!" I always explain to my opponent to watch their characters. Now only one drone remains to protect the Riptde (yes I got lucky).

 

- For the record, the Stratoraptor did nearly nothing. 2 Lascannon shots, 1 hit, 1 wound, 1 Damage (Man I still hate that swingy D6 damage on lacannons.)

 

- His turn comes. I ask him specifically, are you going to use your second Mont'ka? (With Shadowsun he can only do this 2 times per game.) He is aware of the risk. If he doesn't get rid of the Fusilade, it will have been for nothing. He plays it safe, and does not use Mont'ka. Already, to me, this is a benefit. It's changed the way my opponent wants to play, and he's uncertain now.

 

- Admittedly, my 6+ cover saved me a few high damage shots. But he was not taking the flyer seriously enough and wanted my Skorpius' dead. Believe it or not, the top of turn 2 ends, and my Fusilade has 2 wounds left. I suggest to him, that his Riptide COULD assault me to take the last 2 off and he's about 3" away from me. He does just that, and fails to even hit me once. Wow.

 

- The beauty of the bomber is it has no degrade affect on the bomb run. So I go into hover, I move over the Ritpde, drop the obligatory 3 bombs, causing 3 mortal wounds. (He still can't use his FnP) and of course I shut his aura's down again. 

 

- You ever see a fish turn red? I mean aside from salmon? That's the colour of my opponent. His Riptide is down to 3 wounds now. I use the other shots, and kill the 2 drones left around Shadowsun. Thankfully Mars Canticle is up and running. 

 

- My Stratosraptor is just a fail machine that night though. I zoom it over and  repair it with the Manipulus' Autocaduceous. My opponent thinks that's just too cheezy... I thought I could repair it? Maybe not? It didn't matter, it only had 2 wounds off of it  thanks the chaff launcher. Unfortunately it still didn't do much with the las. I think it actually did nothing.

 

- Finally, in his T3 he goes hard after the last 2 wounds on my Fusilade. Then the plan all comes together: I use the 1 CP strat to auto explode the Fusilade. The results put many a smile on Magos' face. Shadowsun takes 3 unsaved wounds. 2 of the specialty drones nearby die. The Ethereal takes 3 mortal wounds. And finally, the riptide takes 3 mortal wounds and dies without firing that turn.

 

Of course this is the ultimate scenario. He was kind of blown away by the damage it did and said he'd never take it lightly again. I'm thinking of turning my Stratoraptor into a second bomber. I know other people that saw my game were suddenly very interested in how the Fusilade and its strats work.

 

Don't forget, against a non- castle shooty army that wants to assault you, you can still use the Siesmic Bomb to slow them down. 

 

So for those of you that laughed, I'm telling you this is a fun, mutifaceted unit. I still don't know if it's 'competitve', but I don't think any of the new stuff is to be honest. 

 

Let's hear about your experiences with the Archeopter units, and what you think of it. Good or bad.

Edited June 13, 2020 by Prot

[PiñaColada]

I have a box of the new flier sitting in the queue of new admech stuff that I intend to build into a stratoraptor (perhaps magnetise the other options if it's easy enough) so it's fun seeing how they're doing in game. Obviously it comes with the giant caveat that 9th is upon us but I actually think the stratoraptor is looking pretty good. I will say that I hate the fact that the planes are another admech vehicle without an invuln save but after having played against a lot of eldar and their wave serpents, boy oh boy am I happy to have an ability that reduces the damage by 1 on my side.

 

I'm personally drawn to the gunship variant since it has a really decent mix of guns (some of them even being cognis for cheeky overwatch improvement) and planes can really help finish of characters/ vehicles that hide out of LoS. It's certainly not as hard hitting as some other admech vehicles but that speed and maneuverability should open up some interesting venues I think, and there are so many D2/Dd3 weapons that just hate shooting at it.

In regards to repairing planes, I've personally never done it as it always seemed a bit cheesy to me but with these new planes you can drop them to hover mode and and at that point I don't see an argument against it.

[Magos Takatus]

I have no fliers yet and no experience fielding them but I was considering the bomber and you have pretty much cemented that. I'm going to have to deal with a Tyranid swarm army when lockdown is over and anything that can slow that down is going to help me a lot.

[PiñaColada]

I will say that bombers are usually made worse by the fact that they're tough to position in a way where they get to drop the bomb on a juicy target and not be forced to fly off the board the next turn. Knowing that's no longer a thing in 9th coupled with the fact that the new fliers are really maneuverable with a double pivot and possible hover mode, that's no longer an issue. They also get easier mileage out of the command uplink strat (although at the expense of a chaff launcher, which is a hefty price IMO). Their own bombing strat is super clutch against a lot of armies though.

Overall it's probably the best flier but I'd argue it's slightly more matchup dependent whereas the stratopraptor will always have a lot of good targets.

[Charlo]

Great insight as always Prot - the bomber is a serious tool in the Ad Mech box and definately helps with the factions problem of applying pressure!

[Prot]

By the way, in case I wasn't obvious enough, some of my post was meant tongue in cheek. 

 

I think both of the offensive flyers are good. I just don't like the transport variant. 

[brother_b]

The rules say you can heal your planes. They are Admech models and your Manipulus has rules allowing you to heal Admech models.

 

We’re talking a game forty thousand years in the future with space elves, super human warriors, and demons. Of course you can heal it...... it’s one of the strengths of the Admech.

 

Your tech priest was probably using automated servo skulls or something. I mean we don’t actually see lasers and bolt shells flying across the battlefield and still pretend we’re shooting!

 

:)

 

Excellent write up I’m excited for the bomber it’s the one variant I really wanted to try.

[Prot]

Very true. It really is nice having the dual pivot rule in our flyers. It allows you to set up bombing runs, or line up lascannon shots, and take a route that ends up near an HQ for a repair. It's not easy, but definitely possible with that movement ability.

 

I honestly don't know if the Bomber will turn out to be the competitive option against a savvy opponent, but it's a pretty fun unit. I will definitely keep 1 in the list, if not 2. (still waiting for them to show up at the house.)

 

I'd really love to see Lascannons turn into a min 3 Damage weapon for 9th though. That StratosRaptor has serious potential in my type of lists, because I rarely have high strength, high damage at all in my armies. So this would be fantastic at filling that gap. But the two times the stars lined up and I got to roll twice for damage, I ended up with a pathetic '1' each time making the weapon worse than a Bellarous energy cannon for output. 

 

That's something that has to change for 9th and I think if they did it for 'Blast' weapons and large units, than specialized heavies should get it too. (either that or make them dirt cheap for their swingy behaviour).

 

Anyway the gunboat didn't do a ton, but I'm keeping it in the list for a while.

[Montoya]

I was able to magnetize mine so that I had all the options available to me. 

 

The rear weapon is very easy to magnetize between the bomb, the las cannon and the stubbers.   Even easier if you 100% know you won't need the stubber option (I doubt i will need it, but for the cost of a couple of magnets, easy to do.

 

For the side stubbers, i put a magnet in the door and one fit very easily into the socket for the guns.

 

The only thing i didn't try to magnetize was the front guns between the phosphor blasters and the stubbers.   The look reasonably enough like each other anyways, and would have been a bear to magnetize.   So just put in the phosphor blasters and called it a day.

 

This then gives you the option of either the raptor or the bomber depending on your needs that day.

[Prot]

Great idea.

 

Honestly I stink at assembly and although I have the magnets (I believe) to do this, I wouldn't be surprised if I botch it up. lol

 

I will try though because in my two test games (as of now) I see great advantages to 2 bombers, or 2 Stratoraptors or 1 of each. 

[DanPesci]

I've never run flyers but I think ill look at getting one (probably 2 as I hate running with no redundancy) of the bombers eventually.

 

Nice to know you can magentise between the bomber/fighter though - I think the fighter will come into its own more in 9th (primarly due to no longer having -1 to hit when its moving), but I already have a fair amount of high AP anti tank from my onagers, and a lot of stubbers elsewhere too.

 

The transport im just not sold on at all. 6 models is pretty much pointless.

 

But yeah, the bombers seem very fun/useful - ideally id run 2, one with chaff, one with the command uplink.

 

P.s. excellent use of the autoexplode strat Prot  Thats certainly something to take into account with these when on low wounds.

[Prot]

Thanks.

 

Yea it was great. He was so desperate to get rid of it, and the thing about shutting down auras is of course it's pretty natural to want to gather around them, making the predetermined explosion just that much more catastrophic.

 

I very, very, very rarely kill a Riptide or two in a game. I just peel off marker lights, get rid of drones, and pretty much ignore and/or hide from Riptides all game. This was a nice change... even if it was a bit cheeky.

[brother_b]

Thanks.

 

Yea it was great. He was so desperate to get rid of it, and the thing about shutting down auras is of course it's pretty natural to want to gather around them, making the predetermined explosion just that much more catastrophic.

 

I very, very, very rarely kill a Riptide or two in a game. I just peel off marker lights, get rid of drones, and pretty much ignore and/or hide from Riptides all game. This was a nice change... even if it was a bit cheeky.

It sounds well played my friend, not cheeky at all. This is a game where competitive, I mean tournament, players pride themselves with things like try pointing, or whatever way to gain a tactical edge etc.

 

Using your simple game mechanics and the abilities of your faction to make a dazzling display of tactical genius is well played. Like you’ve had to adapt to your opponents drone wall he now has to adapt to you! I’m excited about what opportunities this opens up for our faction.

 

I’m a ways off from playing any games, with shut down still here where I live. Still, I look forward to hearing more about your matches.

[Montoya]

Great idea.

 

Honestly I stink at assembly and although I have the magnets (I believe) to do this, I wouldn't be surprised if I botch it up. lol

 

I will try though because in my two test games (as of now) I see great advantages to 2 bombers, or 2 Stratoraptors or 1 of each. 

 

Later tonight after work I can post pictures if helpful.   Since you're not looking for the transport option, there is one less magnet to apply.  So a little easier.  

[Prot]

Absolutely.  That would be great. I’ve got two Copter boxes in front of me waiting for assembly!

[Montoya]

This is the tail of the flyer.   I drilled the existing hole out just a little to fit the magnet, but it largely fit as is (depending on the size of your magnet)

 

This is in the part that holds the rear gun.   I put the magnet on the inside (make sure you line up right with the one you glue into the tail).   The magnet should be strong enough to hold through the plastic, though I did shave mine down on the other side a bit to make the magnetic bond stronger.

 

 

Next the gun.  I shaved out a bit in the center of the base on the gun so that I could glue a small magnet in there.   This also has to line up with the first two.  So all three magnets pull together and that gives you the rear gun.

 

 

For the bomb rack, the top of the rack you'll see that there is basically a slot.   I carefully cut off the circle on the top leaving the two sides.  This gave me something for the superglue to bond to other than just the base of the bomb rack itself.    This will now fit into the tail (above).

 

And finally the doors.   I have to do a bit of clean up on the liquid greenstuff to get the door smooth again, but you can see where i drilled in to fit in the magnet.   I also have the base of the side stubbers in the photo here.

 

 

 

[Prot]

Ah okay, so you actually did the heavy stubbers with magnets on the side doors. Wow. Nice job.

 

Did you contemplate doing the wings? Or storage isn't an issue?

[Montoya]

Hmm.   Storage hasn't been an issue, but I haven't thought about the wings.    I still can actually, as I didn't glue them on when I primed it to make painting easier.  

 

That said, I wouldn't think that the magnets would be strong enough to support the weight of the wings because the center of gravity will be so far out from the point the magnet would be attached to.   Have you tried that before?

 

on the side doors, if i had it to do again, i don't think you'd actully need to even drill the magnet into the door itself.  If you glue it on the inside before assembly, the magnet will likely be strong enugh to hold the guns through the plastic.

Edited June 17, 2020 by Montoya

[Gaz1858]

I generally like anything that can do Mortal Wounds and Admech can actually have this in a seriously large amount.

 

The Fusilave is an interesting unit and I believe you used it perfectly. Mortals on a unit you fly over and then either do it again or pay a cp to explode if they do realise the danger to do more mortals is awesome.

[Prot]

I just had another game with the dual Archeopter build I talk about in the original post.

 

I was against a shootier Nid list. He had turn 1, and because of the Manipulus I had the overall range bonus and hung back. 

 

Anyway, my T1 I move my bomber over his 6 man squad of Hive Guard (which might be one of the most punishing units he has.) They are hiding behind a ruin, getting a -1 to hit aura from a floaty forgeworld bug (Forgot the name.)

 

Anyway  I get off a luck 4 mortal wounds on the squad. Then since the copter can see them, all the remaining firepower goes into them. I get lucky and now 2 are dead from that, and for 1 CP I shut off the -1 to hit aura.

 

Wow that was powerful. My indirect fire would be the only thing I could go after that squad with, but without even a -1 to protect them, my 3 Skorpius just killed all but 1 of the Hive Guard.

 

That up a big dent his firepower. He had one push in T2 from reserves but it wasn't enough. He had to put too much into the Fusilave in T2 because he wanted his aura back. That freed up my Stratoraptor to throw dual lascannons (S10) at his army for a few lucky pen rolls. That was just a brutal game.

 

I felt horrible. We finished my T2 and called it. He had only his long range firepower squad left, and I even got the Tervigon, and the Relic toting Hive Tyrant. 

 

I may have to put the army away until 9th where it's going to be very, very different for this type of army. But 3 games since PA2 and the new bomber on top of it is just crazy. I'd say somehow my mediocre list became very competitive all the sudden. The core rules from PA are huge, and the copter is just the icing on the cake for me.  No one wants to shoot a silly bomber in T1 !

[Black Knight]

Lets just hope that it doesn't devolve into having to buy 9 of the things :S 

 

Has anyone even thought about the transport yet? I cannot even think of what 6 models I would put in it. We haven't got anything that works in such small numbers.

 

Just got my book and my dogs in the post, slowly reading the book.

[SydonianDragoon404]

No way the transport is ever usefull, would rather have a boat or drill any day. 6 is just not enough, razorback syndrome. Thing is that razorbacks can take twin assault cannons or twin lascannons. 

[Prot]

Agreed. I'm still shocked at the lack of transport size. The copter mass is probably more believable to fit 10 Skitarrii in than an Impulsor is to fit 10 Primaris into. 

[armarnis]

thats why the impulsor takes only 6 but i think you meant the repulsor?

 

anyway, great insight! will deffo magnetize my little bird when i start working on it at the weekend

[Prot]

Yea sorry. But anyway... I think we can all agree for Troops and Infantry that disappear so easily, 6 dudes won't cut it. :)