9th Edition and you! What are you thinking about changing?

[Ulfast]

I love allt he minatures GW does now but I´m geting so tired of primares marines! Also with so many units, that can take on all situations it feels like I got no answer to them. I hope the codex will make some changes to the marines and bring them more in line. And those buff that we get, I hope all races get similiar option as some armies right now are pretty bad (specially GSC).

 

But I´m optimistic when I hear from people like Tabletop tactics (that is playertesters) and they say that when more codexen has been released, thennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnwill see the bigger picture and better balance will come.

[Xenith]

How are we feeling about predators as a source of anti tank in 9th? I happened upon a couple at a great price and snapped them up, both with AC/HB but can be converted to ACLC no issue.

 

Worth adding to my sons, or are there better AT sources like contemptors? 

[HighMarshalAmp]

How are we feeling about predators as a source of anti tank in 9th? I happened upon a couple at a great price and snapped them up, both with AC/HB but can be converted to ACLC no issue.

 

Worth adding to my sons, or are there better AT sources like contemptors? 

From what I gather, Predators (and, for the same price, Hellforged Predators if you're already ok with the Contemptor killing half your army when it blows up - I don't see those a lot, why is that?) are still a prime source of AT with very little difference between them and Contemptors. In the end, it comes down to personal preference and situation imo.

 

The Contemptor keeps a better BS while it degrades.

The Predator can move a bit further.

Both can pack up to 4 Lascannon shots.

The Contemptor is 15 points more expensive.

 

Do you expect to castle up? I'd say Contemptor.

Do you expect to move to get a better shot? Predator.

 

If you have Predators and don't have Contemptors, I'd say they're definitely worth adding.

 

Other than those tried and true AT beasts, Defilers seem to have a new Hayday now after, it seems to me, largely being forgotten in 8th. With their Twin LC and Battle Cannon, they can mulch tanks nicely.

They're more stationary though and their BS is and just keeps getting worse than that of either of the above options.

[Ulfast]

I regular use two predators and i like them. I have gone with two las cannons and predator auto cannon. They are lethal but can die pretty fast if my opponet really want to kill them. But they are cheap and let my other units get closer and do there work.  

[byrd9999]

So, the errata and FAQs for all codexes have been updated, as per War-Com, to reflect the change in weapon abilities so players don't have to wait for their codex to come out.

 

Thousand Sons Codex and Ritual of the Damned have both been updated.

 

The War-Com article mentions that all flamers now get increased range to 12". However, the updated weapon profiles in the Codex FAQs only mention Flamers, Combi-flamers and Heavy flamers. No mention of warp-flamers. This is most likely an oversight, and I know they have a million stat blocks to review and update, but it still feels like the T-Sons are not getting sufficient attention to catch these mistakes.

[frightnight]

So, the errata and FAQs for all codexes have been updated, as per War-Com, to reflect the change in weapon abilities so players don't have to wait for their codex to come out.

 

Thousand Sons Codex and Ritual of the Damned have both been updated.

 

The War-Com article mentions that all flamers now get increased range to 12". However, the updated weapon profiles in the Codex FAQs only mention Flamers, Combi-flamers and Heavy flamers. No mention of warp-flamers. This is most likely an oversight, and I know they have a million stat blocks to review and update, but it still feels like the T-Sons are not getting sufficient attention to catch these mistakes.

It's pretty obviously a cut/paste job from the CSM FAQ. I'm sure Ahriman and the boys are super pleased that their cousins are getting better flamers and Reaper Autocannons, but they don't have to rub their noses in it.

[BoomWolf]

Unfortunatly its no mistake.

 

If codex marines don't have it, its not getting updated until the codex.

[byrd9999]

I emailed 40k rules team with 2 questions:

 

1. Do T-Sons get 2w marines and 3w terminators right now, or do we have to wait for the codex?

2. Do Warpflamers get 12".

 

The insta-reply said I wouldn't get a personal response, but maybe we'll see this addressed in the near future.

[Special Officer Doofy]

I emailed 40k rules team with 2 questions:

 

1. Do T-Sons get 2w marines and 3w terminators right now, or do we have to wait for the codex?

2. Do Warpflamers get 12".

 

The insta-reply said I wouldn't get a personal response, but maybe we'll see this addressed in the near future.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/08/13/new-boxes-new-rules-new-codexes/

 

"And as for future codexes for other genetically engineered transhuman warriors (both of the shiny grey and spikey variety), the same will apply to them. Just think how durable that will make units like Rubric Marines or Plague Marines."

 

They already said it will take a codex to change the wounds. Warp flamers are only in T-sons and chaos space marines codex, so they didn't get updated in the space marine codex and then FAQ'd for the other factions. When the T-sons codex comes out both will be addressed. But not until then, and who knows when then will even be.

Edited October 6, 2020 by Putrid Choir

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Do you know if point costs stay the same with the new weapon profiles?  The codex CSM FAQ doesn't contain any point changes, which would suggest that they do.

[Special Officer Doofy]

Do you know if point costs stay the same with the new weapon profiles? The codex CSM FAQ doesn't contain any point changes, which would suggest that they do.

I think the point costs of the weapons changed before the profiles did. Multi-melta went up from 22 to 25 on vehicles before it was announced it was getting the d6+2 in half range instead and the second shot. Hopefully they knew of the profile changes before CA2020.

 

Edit: I don't play loyalist marines so I haven't followed all their leaks. Has their points page been leaked yet?

Edited October 8, 2020 by Putrid Choir

[Irate Khornate]

 

Do you know if point costs stay the same with the new weapon profiles? The codex CSM FAQ doesn't contain any point changes, which would suggest that they do.

I think the point costs of the weapons changed before the profiles did. Multi-melta went up from 22 to 25 on vehicles before it was announced it was getting the d6+2 in half range instead and the second shot. Hopefully they knew of the profile changes before CA2020.

 

Edit: I don't play loyalist marines so I haven't followed all their leaks. Has their points page been leaked yet?

One mad lad posted pretty much the whole codex on Reddit, but it was gone within 12 hours unfortunately. You might be able to find it somewhere though

[Xenith]

So I have another Forge/Maulerfiend that needs building - I made the last one as a mauler, as I feel Thousand Sons need CC support/distracton, but I'm keen to make this one up as a forge fiend, or possibly magnetising the guns to switch between - are F-Fiends ok this edition? What guns are you running them with?

 

My other TS 'support' units are:

 

Hellbrute with scourge and Plasma cannon (Now flat S8 D2, yay!)

Maulerfiend with lashes

Predator with autocannon + HB/Las (on the converting block, need to mag the sponsons).

 

Do you know if point costs stay the same with the new weapon profiles?  The codex CSM FAQ doesn't contain any point changes, which would suggest that they do.

 

All weapons already received point changes in Chapter Approved 2020 Munitorium Field Manual - these reflect the weapon profile changes, which is why they didnt make sense at the time of release. 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Thanks for the answer.

 

Look forward to seeing the your new forge fiend when it is done - if you plan to magnetize it, shoot me message as that's what I did with mine and I might be able to pass along some tips on how to (or not to) do it.

Edited October 9, 2020 by Dr_Ruminahui

[Archaeinox]

Now that damage 2 heavy bolters are a thing, ill be running 2x contemptors with twin heavy bolters and fist. In events, i'll use Inferno Bolts on them.

[Xenith]

Hellbrute plasma cannons seem to be a fixed S8D2, so a decent option for marine killing - my plascan-scourge one might have anew lease of life. 

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

Now that damage 2 heavy bolters are a thing, ill be running 2x contemptors with twin heavy bolters and fist. In events, i'll use Inferno Bolts on them.

I'm thinking of switching out my duel butcher cannon contemptor for a duel heavy bolter one as with the minus 2 ap and damage two it damage  bit of everything.

[Archaeinox]

I played a 3vs3 game. 2500pts each. We finished turn 5 in around 5 hours. Not bad.

 

Me (Thousand Sons) 

Night Lords CSM

New Necrons

 

vs. 

 

Blood Ravens 

Salamanders

Ultramarines w/ Gman

 

 

My two contemptors with Inferno Heavy Bolters and fists put in work. The -2 was instrumental in dislodging intercessors from cover, and the 2 damage made sure they stayed dead.

 

It is also important that I note that whereas before the FAQ our Scarabs wanted to stay 24" from everything and just shoot, now we want to put them into combat. By turn 4 I had four separate combats with them where they came out on top. Popping Veterans of the Long War with str 5 power swords is HUGE.

 

I guess I can say it was a crushing victory. but a good learning fight. the 3 marine players need more practice with the changes.

 

I put Death Hex on Guilliman from Magnus. Next turn, he charged Magnus and swung first. The 3++ was up, and he survived. When Magnus killed Guilliman, not only could he not use the strat Only in Death Does Duty End because he had already fought (New SM Codex change), but he couldnt Command Re-roll the roll to stand back up and resurrect himself which is now on a 4++. 

 

We're in a really good spot, but marines have teeth still. Don't make any mistakes during the game or they could easy take the win with some impetus and intitiative capitalizing on your mistake as Thousand Sons.

Edited October 18, 2020 by Archaeinox

[Torbenos]

The one burning question is Archaeinox. Had you put the points aside so Magnus could turn Guilliman into a Chaos Spawn with his staff?

[Archaeinox]

nope! here's the list, 2500pts on the nose:

 

Magnus

Ahriman

Exalted on Disc

10 Scarabs w/ Hellfyre x2

Contemptor w/ Heavy Bolter

Contemptor w/ Heavy Bolter

18 Rubrics

10 Rubrics

10 Rubrics

Lascannon Pred

Lascannon Pred

 

 

Turns out I needed every single rubric, too. Theyre awesome.

[Prot]

Thanks Arch, that's a great positive take on the army.

 

I honestly don't see much changes from my list going forward. I've always used 10 Scarabs and they feel a bit better now.

 

I'm a sucker for Dreads/Helbrutes/Contemptors so I will still use them, however I really want to use daemon engines more, just for flavour (even though probably less efficient.)

 

 

I still want to do up 2 shooty Forgefiends, but I still think the Defiler has play.

[byrd9999]

Arch, if you don't mind some more typing, which spells and traits did you take?

 

And how effective were they in your game?

[Archaeinox]

Magnus

-Death Hex (crucial power, +2 manifest platform, but only real target was Guilliman)

-Doombolt (+2 manifest platform, a waste on anyone else imo but didnt use this. Smite was better)

-Infernal Gaze (other spells were taken, and always used. In any case, reliable to cast)

-Infernal Gateway

 

Ahriman

-Weaver of Fates (can pretty much put it where he wants it, and an important power so +1 manifest helps)

-Glamour (10 scarabs of a 10man or more unit of rubrics needs this to plant its feet on objectives)

-Prescience (scarabs, always)

 

Exalted on Disc (Magister: Duplicitous Tactician was super important for a redeploy. The enemy put a couple Knights in front of the 18man RuBrick blob just outside 9" away on a flank, so after we won the roll off, I pulled them back and placed them on the opposite flank in front of a bunch of intercessors and the like)

-Warptime (he either flung Magnus somewhere, or helped the scarabs get another 4" move. Super important if they are NOT teleporting around mid or late game.

-Temporal Manipulation (for Magnus, but it got denied. later he healed a terminator or something. In any case, hes pretty much just gonna Warp Time and Smite but I still want him to have Temporal.

 

All is Dust units:

-Tzeentch's Firestorm: Better than a mini smite...... 1 aspiring sorcerer swaps to Gaze of Fate and sits safely in the back. He pretty much casts it all game.

 

I like that spell set a lot. I find myself using less HQs, and less Cult of Magic. In tournaments, all the Rubrics and Scarabs have Weaver of Fates because it gives me 100% board coverage for putting a better invul up somewhere, since we spread out so much for missions now.

Edited October 21, 2020 by Archaeinox

[byrd9999]

Thanks, Arch, your write-ups are awesome and very helpful :) 

[Zodd1888]

Space Wolves Frost Weapon is +1S and +1D.

 

I was thinking we are going to end up with our Inferno Bolters somewhere in 8th Ed Heavy Bolter territory and it'd be neat if we get the ranged equivalent.

 

Wishful thinking right here!