Technical Question- Bloody Snow

[Valkia the Bloody]

I have some technical questions, concerning bloody snow bases.

First time of me contemplating doing this for my new Night Lords army.

I have several different snow alternatives- the Games Workshop stuff, some glittery scenic snow paste from the local model train shop and I have the Gale Force Nine powder which I would mix with glitter and white glue. I have not tried out the GW stuff yet. I love my glitter effect in snow, not sure the GW stuff does that. But I tried the model snow paste and my own mixture and experimented with blood splatter.

For this I got some test models. Anyone here has some suggestions concerning snow/ bloody snow? Thoughts? Which one works best and looks most realistic?

 

Here are the test models with the glittery railway snow paste. Also put it on the alien dead bushes. Not sure if it looks realistic or not.

 

 

 

 

Added blood splatter to the railway snow paste. I think this already looks better:

 

 

 

 

 

And here is my own mixture, white glue, glitter and Galeforce nine snow powder. I am not sure yet which one looks better?

 

[Firedrake Cordova]

I like the first example :)

 

I've not used it, but GW's Valhallan Blizzard is supposed to be good (and from pictures I've seen online, it is).  It seems snow is a difficult topic - you might also like to have a look at AK Interactive's range of snow products (they've got some good YouTube videos up), as well as Tamiya's two pastes, as they have the coarseness and sparkle you mention (in the Tamiya pastes, that's provided by ground up marble).

 

As for the blood, I suppose the question is do you want it to look fresh (it'll sit on top, and be strongly-coloured and well-defined), or old (in which case it'll be more diffuse, etc)

[Valkia the Bloody]

I like the first example

 

I've not used it, but GW's Valhallan Blizzard is supposed to be good (and from pictures I've seen online, it is).  It seems snow is a difficult topic - you might also like to have a look at AK Interactive's range of snow products (they've got some good YouTube videos up), as well as Tamiya's two pastes, as they have the coarseness and sparkle you mention (in the Tamiya pastes, that's provided by ground up marble).

 

As for the blood, I suppose the question is do you want it to look fresh (it'll sit on top, and be strongly-coloured and well-defined), or old (in which case it'll be more diffuse, etc)

Thank you for the hints and links!

 

Snow is really hard, especially if it is supposed to look realistic.

 

Well, I like my blood fresh- still steaming.

I think when you do Chaos, you can go quite gory...

but it is also easy to overdo it.

 

I have tried (as seen above) to first paint a darker red (scab red) then brighter red (blood red) and then glazing with Blood for the Blood God.

 

However, I still need to practice my blood spatter technique, that one is messy and... imprecise.

[Fajita Fan]

Personal opinion: all of the snow effect stuff looks like it was made by someone who’s never seen snow. Real snow on the ground is so fine you don’t see the texture, it’s all smooth and self leveling. Snow effect on bases looks like white gravel at real life scale to me, also your feet sink into snow and it gets all over your legs. 
 

Red contrast paint makes a nice 40k style fresh blood effect, BFtBG technical paint is very thick and glossy. In case you’re wondering this is what real blood on a metal axe blade looks like. I cut the hell out of my finger one night and smeared it on this axe just to see how it would dry. 
 

[Valkia the Bloody]

Personal opinion: all of the snow effect stuff looks like it was made by someone who’s never seen snow. Real snow on the ground is so fine you don’t see the texture, it’s all smooth and self leveling. Snow effect on bases looks like white gravel at real life scale to me, also your feet sink into snow and it gets all over your legs. 

 

Red contrast paint makes a nice 40k style fresh blood effect, BFtBG technical paint is very thick and glossy. In case you’re wondering this is what real blood on a metal axe blade looks like. I cut the hell out of my finger one night and smeared it on this axe just to see how it would dry. 

 

Now THAT is what I call dedication!

 

However, I imagine dried and coagulated blood, and lots of it, would come across much more chunky, dark and shiny.... depending on how dry it is.

 

I agree with you on the snow.

When it is done well, by the modelling masters you see, it looks amazing. Otherwise, it is just kind of "meh".

I have zero experience with it so far, hence me trying to spice it up with blood splatter, because that might distract from the snowy imperfections.

 

I am just not sure yet I want to go down that route, although I admit I am a bit bored by giving my models just static grass, as per usual. I wanted it to be more gory, and blood just pops on snow.

 

As with a lot of the Pop culture art, I get the feeling it is not so much about realism and more about what people think realism looks like. And of course of what looks cool.

Warhammer has always been a bit on the comic book realism side of things, with weapons bigger than the wielder and ridiculous (but awesome) chain swords.

Just look at the new Death Guard- if they do not look like comic book villains reborn in plastic, I do not know what is.

This is one reason I decided against starting another Death Guard army- for me, they are just too much over the top, in a comical way.

Not that Space Batmans (Night Lords) are any better, come to think of it....

 

I think it is personal choice.

Do you want it totally realistic? If yes, why did you start with Warhammer in the first place? :p

Or do you want to recreate a dark and violent and gory comic book feel?

 

I think I will go with comic book.

But still not sure about the snow.

[Fajita Fan]

You know the cork sheet people use to make rock? If you cut that around the legs of a model up to about mid calf and use liquid greenstuff (or equivalent) to smooth the top, paint it all white, and get some white on the legs up to about the knees that’s what I’d imagine snow looked like at 28mm.

 

Contrast paint is so runny it can make some good splatters, my paint table under my wrist is proof.

[Valkia the Bloody]

That is a very interesting idea....

never heard if that one before!

[Firedrake Cordova]

Personal opinion: all of the snow effect stuff looks like it was made by someone who’s never seen snow. 

There are definitely some, umm, "less good" snow products out there (the old Citadel snow flock comes to mind).  Kathy Millatt's round-up revealed some good and bad products, although anything with an obvious "grain" to it looks more like an icy-snow than snowy-snow (picture is Tamiya snow effect, taken from IPM USA's review).

 

Real snow on the ground is so fine you don’t see the texture, it’s all smooth and self leveling. 

Unhelpfully, there's many types of snow - from the fresh powdery stuff, to snow that's been there all winter and become compacted, icy snow as a result of thawing and refreezing (possibly repeatedly), etc, as well as being affected by the depth of it, so it depends on what you're trying to depict.  For example, this  (thin) looks different to this (heavy snow), which looks different to this (deep powdery snow).

 

I live in an area which is generally barely cold enough for it to snow, so most years it doesn't and when it does, we only get a thin dusting that lasts for a week or two at most.  Being only thin, it tends to show the contours of what's underneath it, and it tends to get slightly melted by the sun during the day, and refreezes over night, so it tends to quickly get an crystalline texture when viewed close (whether that would be visible when scaled down correctly, is a good question).  Certainly, it's a bit of a surprise when you go from that, to seeing alpine snow. :)

 

Of course, there is the other question, which is, if you modelled fresh powdery snow correctly, it might look a bit "visually boring", so we might want to exaggerate it for visual interest..?

 

I get the feeling it is not so much about realism and more about what people think realism looks like. And of course of what looks cool.

Indeed, it's definitely stylised (if only because miniatures painted to maximum realism tend to lack contrast and look a bit "boring").  Of course, that means that if you paint one part of something in a hyper-realistic manner, it tends to jar with the rest of the model (doh).

 

Not that Space Batmans (Night Lords) are any better, come to think of it....

As someone who nearly started a Night Lords army, that's ... brilliant

[Fajita Fan]

Even powdery snow, the kind I get, doesn’t have the gritty lumps that you get with most textured snow products. There’s a Space Wolf terminator lord on Coolmini who sculpted a blizzard and it looks great but it was custom made. I keep wanting to do it for my 13th Company but in the end I think demon world bases are better for that.

 

Smearing liquid greenstuff on a base, jamming the feet in there, pulling them out, sanding the top, and painting that white might actually work.

Edited July 7, 2020 by Fajita Fan

[Firedrake Cordova]

I can't believe I forgot Precision Snow and Ice  (I'm guessing you want the Insta-Snow).  Not cheap (and I'm not sure about the availability in the US - you might have to have it sent from the UK), but it seems to be regarded as the gold standard by the military modelling scene.

 

What do you think of the result this chap got mixing AK's products?

[Valkia the Bloody]

I can't believe I forgot Precision Snow and Ice  (I'm guessing you want the Insta-Snow).  Not cheap (and I'm not sure about the availability in the US - you might have to have it sent from the UK), but it seems to be regarded as the gold standard by the military modelling scene.

 

What do you think of the result this chap got mixing AK's products?

That stuff does look good.

Well, since I am based in Germany, having it delivered from the UK would not be that much of an issue...

[Firedrake Cordova]

Well, since I am based in Germany, having it delivered from the UK would not be that much of an issue...

For some reason, I'd convinced myself you were in North America ... 

[Valkia the Bloody]

 

Well, since I am based in Germany, having it delivered from the UK would not be that much of an issue...

For some reason, I'd convinced myself you were in North America ... 

 

Not too far from the truth, I am bilingual, have US relatives and carry an American first name... :p

[Lovecraft0110]

Hi, Valkia the Bloody, 

 

I have no experience with snow, I'm afraid, but I have LOTS of experience with blood splatter (30k World Eaters player here). I recommend Tamiya X-27 mixed with a few drops of Army Builder Dark Quickshade and then spattered on either with the airbrush (if you have one), or failing that with a drinking straw. I have a tutorial on this if you're interested. 

 

Hope this helps!

[Valkia the Bloody]

Hi, Valkia the Bloody, 

 

I have no experience with snow, I'm afraid, but I have LOTS of experience with blood splatter (30k World Eaters player here). I recommend Tamiya X-27 mixed with a few drops of Army Builder Dark Quickshade and then spattered on either with the airbrush (if you have one), or failing that with a drinking straw. I have a tutorial on this if you're interested. 

 

Hope this helps!

Thank you!

I sure will check it out!

[Valkia the Bloody]

So, I made a decision today to go for the completely over-the-top comic book gore look.

This is CHAOS after all.

 

I think it does not look to bad, especially at a distance and when the models are placed in a group. Looks like a frozen bloody mire battle field.

 

What do you think?

I know, it is neither perfect nor is it anywhere near realistic.

But it certainly looks effective and draws the eye in.

 

 

 

 

However, I will be working on that and especially for my larger models I will check out some different products and also have a look into your suggestions.

And or course the tutorials!

 

I think I am in a process of learning with this new project, I hope things will improve when I progress. :D

[Firedrake Cordova]

Looks good to me! :)

[Lovecraft0110]

Blood for the Blood God!!!

[Venerable Jazzman]

or failing that with a drinking straw. I have a tutorial on this if you're interested. 

That is a really nice blood effect 

[Lovecraft0110]

 

or failing that with a drinking straw. I have a tutorial on this if you're interested. 

That is a really nice blood effect 

 

 

Thanks, Venerable Jazzman!