Plastic Heresy Spitballing - [BASELESS SPECULATION]

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

Okay so I was thinking about that rumoured plastic leviathan and how it's pretty much the same size as the redepmtor, so I chucked together an idea for what could be a fun combat patrol box equivalent to what you get in the Space Wolves one inspired by the FW MkIII starter:

something like a "legion siege cadre"

[sarabando]

yeah id buy that for the current price of a combat patrol XD

[Sparika]

I understand the idea of having themed boxes around a particular Mk of armour, but you could easily say it's always marines, marines, marines.
An alternative could be to consider how the first legion did invent start collecting Legions the Principia Bellicosa: Start Collecting <Rite of War>. Or maybe Battleforce <Rite of War> instead of start collecting. I think it would show the diversity of legions build better.



5 hussars, 1 assault bike, 1 land speeder

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

I understand the idea of having themed boxes around a particular Mk of armour, but you could easily say it's always marines, marines, marines.

An alternative could be to consider how the first legion did invent start collecting Legions the Principia Bellicosa: Start Collecting <Rite of War>. Or maybe Battleforce <Rite of War> instead of start collecting. I think it would show the diversity of legions build better.

 

 

5 hussars, 1 assault bike, 1 land speeder

 

Yeah Rite themed boxes are a fun idea, kinda what I was going for with the mock-up above which could easily work for the "Zone Mortalis Assault Force" rite - given Rites also work with allied detachment the 1 HQ, 1 Troops + auxiliary shiny unit(s) format even works without meaning sets would have to be huge

 

Edit: okay since this suggestion I've had a couple ideas for other Rite themed combat patrols (using the term just to reference box size/ price):

 

Drop Assault Vanguard:

 

* MkIV Moritat/ Jump Pack Centurion

* 10 x MkIV Assault Marines

* 5 x Jump Pack Destroyers

* 1 x Land Speeder Proteus

 

Sky Hunter Phalanx:

 

* MkIV Jetbike Centurion

* 3 x Scimitar Jetbikes

* 3 x Scimitar Jetbikes

* Javelin Attack Speeder

 

(realistically I can't imagine there being a plastic jetbike centurion but I could imagine one being a build option from a plastic jetbike squad so this could effectively be 5 x jetbikes plus the centurion) 

Edited September 8, 2021 by Iron Hands Fanatic

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

well apparently I was compelled to mock these up

[Cris R]

One thing: Leviathans are too big for ZM games since they have 80mm bases, which exceed the size of the 60mm ceiling for this format. So if you were putting together a ZM Assault Force box, a Contemptor would be the natural choice. That said, it's unfortunate GW doesn't offer a plastic Boxnought kit with a weapon load-out tailored for 30k games that they could include in one of these boxes. I had one left over from a starter set that I kitbashed and painted up for a ZM event and have come to appreciate them for smaller point games where their cost, Armored Ceramite, and Flamestorm Cannons make them really potent for ZM games.

Edited September 9, 2021 by Cris R

[LameBeard]

#bringbackboxnoughts

[MCC]

Iron Hands Fanatic your ideas for boxes are brilliant and i would buy each one of them in a heart beat multiple times, that's how I know they're unrealistic and they're not going to happen lol. The zone mortalis one feels the most likely to happen but like someone said itd have to be a contemptor not a leviathan. I could also see them doing something dodgy and making it 5 breacher marines instead of the full squad of ten. This is how they're sold on forgeworld and GW do alot of under strength units in the age of sigmar boxsets so you have to buy more. 

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

One thing: Leviathans are too big for ZM games since they have 80mm bases, which exceed the size of the 60mm ceiling for this format. So if you were putting together a ZM Assault Force box, a Contemptor would be the natural choice. That said, it's unfortunate GW doesn't offer a plastic Boxnought kit with a weapon load-out tailored for 30k games that they could include in one of these boxes. I had one left over from a starter set that I kitbashed and painted up for a ZM event and have come to appreciate them for smaller point games where their cost, Armored Ceramite, and Flamestorm Cannons make them really potent for ZM games.

 

Yeah, it's just because I'd already mocked up that collection around the idea of a siege-themed set with a leviathan, and the zone mortalis rite seemed like the closest match - although you don't actually have to use the rite with just ZM so technically it could still work but I get you.

 

Iron Hands Fanatic your ideas for boxes are brilliant and i would buy each one of them in a heart beat multiple times, that's how I know they're unrealistic and they're not going to happen lol. The zone mortalis one feels the most likely to happen but like someone said itd have to be a contemptor not a leviathan. I could also see them doing something dodgy and making it 5 breacher marines instead of the full squad of ten. This is how they're sold on forgeworld and GW do alot of under strength units in the age of sigmar boxsets so you have to buy more. 

 

Huh, I didn't realise AoS sets drop below unit minimums, that seems to be something widely avoided with 40k kits so I assumed it was company policy - and yeh, I think we might get *one* smaller starter set at best which'll probably be one/ two of the existing plastic power armour boxes + a terminator box and maybe a character realistically, this is 100% unreasonable wishlisting lol

[MCC]

 

Iron Hands Fanatic your ideas for boxes are brilliant and i would buy each one of them in a heart beat multiple times, that's how I know they're unrealistic and they're not going to happen lol. The zone mortalis one feels the most likely to happen but like someone said itd have to be a contemptor not a leviathan. I could also see them doing something dodgy and making it 5 breacher marines instead of the full squad of ten. This is how they're sold on forgeworld and GW do alot of under strength units in the age of sigmar boxsets so you have to buy more. 

 

Huh, I didn't realise AoS sets drop below unit minimums, that seems to be something widely avoided with 40k kits so I assumed it was company policy - and yeh, I think we might get *one* smaller starter set at best which'll probably be one/ two of the existing plastic power armour boxes + a terminator box and maybe a character realistically, this is 100% unreasonable wishlisting lol

 

 

Yeah the last few starter boxes have come with a few under strength units, i cant remember the unit names but they've had 3 guys instead of the multiples of 5 theyre supposed to have according to the battle tomes. Plus things like the Sylvaneth dryads have 18 in a box when theyre supposed to be multiples of 10. leaving you no choice but to buy more or field understrength units. 

[Gorgoff]

 

 

Iron Hands Fanatic your ideas for boxes are brilliant and i would buy each one of them in a heart beat multiple times, that's how I know they're unrealistic and they're not going to happen lol. The zone mortalis one feels the most likely to happen but like someone said itd have to be a contemptor not a leviathan. I could also see them doing something dodgy and making it 5 breacher marines instead of the full squad of ten. This is how they're sold on forgeworld and GW do alot of under strength units in the age of sigmar boxsets so you have to buy more. 

 

Huh, I didn't realise AoS sets drop below unit minimums, that seems to be something widely avoided with 40k kits so I assumed it was company policy - and yeh, I think we might get *one* smaller starter set at best which'll probably be one/ two of the existing plastic power armour boxes + a terminator box and maybe a character realistically, this is 100% unreasonable wishlisting lol

 

 

Yeah the last few starter boxes have come with a few under strength units, i cant remember the unit names but they've had 3 guys instead of the multiples of 5 theyre supposed to have according to the battle tomes. Plus things like the Sylvaneth dryads have 18 in a box when theyre supposed to be multiples of 10. leaving you no choice but to buy more or field understrength units. 

 

It's the oldest trick in GW's book to be honest.

I remeber vividly how much our eldar player complained about the aspect warrior blisters back in the day when everything was made out of metal.

They never had the right amount of miniatures in them to make a whole unit. You always had some miniatures to spare or not a full unit. 

Anyway.

I'd like FW to make any kind of discount offer where you can buy several models at once and get a real discount on them.

Just like @iron hands fanatic examples.

Would be really neat.

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

I've been thinking about what a smaller starter set for Heresy might look like compared to the leaked larger battle box, and for both Titanicus and Necromunda we've gotten £90 boxes with 2 sides and all the paraphernalia you need to play, including some form of rulebook, so I had a look at the miniatures content of the AT starter set to figure out what a heresy equivalent might look like, and came up with the following:

 

2 x reaver titan (£35 each) = 2 x MkIII tactical squad kits

warhound kit (£40) = cataphractii terminator kit

cerastus knights kit (£20) = space marine heroes set (chaplain & cataphractii praetor)

 

So you'd get 20 MkIII marines, 5 cataphractii, a cataphractii praetor and a chaplain.

 

With a bit of messing around, this can be split into 2 armies - if you use the chaplain mini as a delegatus consul instead you can have 2 pride of the legion lists: one is the delegatus, a 5-strong vet squad and a 10-strong vet squad, the other is the praetor, the 5 cataphractii and the remaining 5 vets. Alternatively the 2 characters in the set could be original, but this was just me theorising on how they might use the existing plastics, and overall the whole set of minis is a reasonable starter force.

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

*sigh* yes, I mocked it up

[LameBeard]

This is great, but like Titanicus, surely they won’t release the £90ish starter until after the big box? And by then the new units are available. Or are you trying to design a starter to that could complement the new big box? In which case, might need to swap to Tartaros?

[NiftyVT]

well apparently I was compelled to mock these up 

 

 

Being a Blood Angels player if these were a thing I would buy one Drop Assault and 2 Sky Hunter sets right now.

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

This is great, but like Titanicus, surely they won’t release the £90ish starter until after the big box? And by then the new units are available. Or are you trying to design a starter to that could complement the new big box? In which case, might need to swap to Tartaros?

 

Given how pricy the big box is inevitably gonna be, I'm sure they have plans to do a smaller starter set that's an easier entry into the game, dunno whether it'd release near to the leaked box or a while after, really depends on whether it'll be a limited run or not (also this'd follow the pattern of them putting older minis into bundle sets but leaving the new shiny stuff as lower value individual sets)

[LameBeard]

See what they just did with Kill Team? Starter set same models, except only a fraction of the terrain, and different rule book.

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

See what they just did with Kill Team? Starter set same models, except only a fraction of the terrain, and different rule book.

 

true, but the MkIII in this is just a placeholder, the MkIV/ leaked MkVI are easily swapped in but I'm sure they'd be happy to shift the existing sets, and they seem to take a varying approach - the relatively recent soulblight start collecting was basically built to shift older models so there's really no way to tell

 

also I'm sure they're aware that plenty of folks feel like MkVI might not be suited to their legion so they'd be happy for a bundle with the existing marks

Edited September 16, 2021 by Iron Hands Fanatic

[Cris R]

The one thing that's missing in this discussion are the holiday Army Boxes that cram a lot of plastic into a solid starter set. While it's unlikely we'll see one this year if the new starter kit comes out, I could see GW releasing one or two versions in 2022 that revolve around specific themes like the ones we saw for AoS and 40k factions in 2020. And I think that actually makes the most sense for plastic 30k starters: GW can maintain a large and small one player starter sets - probably an HQ, one to two units of power armored troops, a unit of terminators, and maybe a walker in the larger set - that serve as a blank slate that players can adapt to their legion, play styles, and rites of choice and leave the more specialized all-in-one boxes for one-off products like the holiday Army Boxes that offer players a variation on this theme. Obviously GW hasn't done this for 30k before but it would be a nice touch to continue supporting the system with a unique army box ever year that we can look forward to.

Edited September 17, 2021 by Cris R

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

The one thing that's missing in this discussion are the holiday Army Boxes that cram a lot of plastic into a solid starter set. While it's unlikely we'll see one this year if the new starter kit comes out, I could see GW releasing one or two versions in 2022 that revolve around specific themes like the ones we saw for AoS and 40k factions in 2020. And I think that actually makes the most sense for plastic 30k starters: GW can maintain a large and small one player starter sets - probably an HQ, one to two units of power armored troops, a unit of terminators, and maybe a walker in the larger set - that serve as a blank slate that players can adapt to their legion, play styles, and rites of choice and leave the more specialized all-in-one boxes for one-off products like the holiday Army Boxes that offer players a variation on this theme. Obviously GW hasn't done this for 30k before but it would be a nice touch to continue supporting the system with a unique army box ever year that we can look forward to.

 

Yeah this is a good point - we've also had similar releases for Titanicus (knight household box, original battleforce box) during the same holiday window in the past so this is also on the radar for specialist games, but I also agree that we're unlikely to see anything like this 'til holiday 2022, and it'll be really interesting to see what plastic Heresy kits have been released by that point re: what could be included in any hypothetical battleforce style box, especially given stuff like walkers and tanks are also within the range of possibility.