Commercial Wet Palettes

[Firedrake Cordova]

Hi all,

 

I've been using a DIY wet palette made from a GW tufts box for a while, and whilst it works fine, I'm finding it a bit on the small side.  Seeing as I've found it virtually impossible to find a tupperware container which is shallow like the tuft box, I was considering buying one. 

 

Does anyone here use/recommend any of the commercial offerings?  So far I've looked at/considered:

• Army Painter Wet Palette @ £16
• Red Grass Games Everlasting Wet Palette Painter @ £17/27 (starter or bundle)
• Masterson Sta-Wet Handy Palette @ £21

From a brief search, each of the above seem to be the greatest thing ever or a complete waste of money, depending on which review you read, which is a bit concerning.

 

I've discounted the AK Interactive Wet Palette (too small) and the Daler-Rowney Stay-Wet Palette & RGG Studio XL (too big)

 

Thanks :)

[Herbington]

I love my Army Painter wet palette. I'll never go back to a home-made one.

 

Space to store brushes too.

 

 

Edit to add - Perfectly fits in the top of a 3l Really Useful Box, which I use to hold some paints and/or the model I'm working on. Means I can pack everything up neatly.

Edited July 23, 2020 by Herbington

[pawl]

I also use the Army Painter palette, and it's definitely a step up from homemade!

 

A couple of points worth considering - it has space in the top for brush storage, although your brushes will be loose (not that you'll be tipping it anyway!). The various sections are held together with a band around the outside, rather than locking or clipping in to each other (for some reason I was slightly disappointed by this, don't know why). Not sure what other brands come with, but the AP palette has 2 sponge things and 50 pre-cut sheets (I threw away one of the sponges because it dried out and water didn't seem to bring it back - turns out I hadn't left it long enough. Stupid mistake!)

 

If I was buying again I would possibly consider the Redgrass palettes for the extra size as I'm quite messy, but I wouldn't have any issues at all carrying on with the AP palette. =]

[Bung]

I have the 2 from Redgrass.

The big one for painting at home when i do alot of color mixing and the smaller one for travelling.

 

Dont get the foam and paper from any of them. Just use kitchen paper towels and parchment paper and replace them every session. Its safer to avoid mold that way.

[Firedrake Cordova]

Thanks for the feedback, guys

 

it has space in the top for brush storage, although your brushes will be loose (not that you'll be tipping it anyway!). 

I have ... far too many paint brushes (every time Black Friday comes around, some magically appear in my letterbox - not sure why! ). 

 

I currently have a bit of a thing for Jackson's Series 505 and Escoda Versatil's in the larger sizes (4-6) for base coating, which have a fairly chubby handle - I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't fit between the ridges.

 

Not sure what other brands come with, but the AP palette has 2 sponge things and 50 pre-cut sheets 

The expensive bundle of the Red Grass one is the same, but the starter pack only comes with 1 foam and 15 sheets of paper.  The Masterson's one comes with 1 sponge and 5 sheets of paper, although from what I've read, I should be using a different paper with that one anyway as it's more for heavy-bodied paints.

 

(I threw away one of the sponges because it dried out and water didn't seem to bring it back - turns out I hadn't left it long enough. Stupid mistake!)

Doh!   At least they're available and not too expensive (£8/pair)

 

If I was buying again I would possibly consider the Redgrass palettes for the extra size as I'm quite messy, but I wouldn't have any issues at all carrying on with the AP palette. =]

The Red Grass one I'm looking at is only 1cm bigger in one axis, so it's basically the same size.    The big Red Grass one is too big for my painting space (and a bit pricey at nearly £40... ).

 

Dont get the foam and paper from any of them. Just use kitchen paper towels and parchment paper and replace them every session. Its safer to avoid mold that way.

That's interesting - have you ever had mould problems with them?  With my DIY one, I used some Ecotech sponges and never have, including the time I forgot I left water in it for about 2 months (doh! )

Edited July 23, 2020 by Firedrake Cordova

[Arkhanist]

Hi all,

 

I've been using a DIY wet palette made from a GW tufts box for a while, and whilst it works fine, I'm finding it a bit on the small side.  Seeing as I've found it virtually impossible to find a tupperware container which is shallow like the tuft box, I was considering buying one. 

 

Does anyone here use/recommend any of the commercial offerings?  So far I've looked at/considered:

• Army Painter Wet Palette @ £16
• Red Grass Games Everlasting Wet Palette Painter @ £17/27 (starter or bundle)
• Masterson Sta-Wet Handy Palette @ £21

From a brief search, each of the above seem to be the greatest thing ever or a complete waste of money, depending on which review you read, which is a bit concerning.

 

I've discounted the AK Interactive Wet Palette (too small) and the Daler-Rowney Stay-Wet Palette & RGG Studio XL (too big)

 

Thanks

Good call on the Daler-Rowney, the lid was rubbish for keeping it wet. I switched to the Frisk keep-wet; bit better lid, same A4ish size.

The Sta-wet is very similar to these, but smaller - though still noticeably bigger than the RGG/AP ones going by this pic.

 

 

Trying to get parchment paper for DIY in the UK is a pain, most baking paper is coated or waxed so doesn't work that well in my past experience.

 

I picked up the RGG everlasting painter palette (the orange one) a couple of years ago in the kickstarter IIRC, as I wanted a smaller one for my painting tray. The size is great, the little slip-over band helps to hold it shut very tightly; even without it, the rubber seal keeps the water in it for absolutely ages, weeks and weeks. It doesn't clip, but gravity will hold it shut unless you're slinging it about in a bag due to the rubber seal. it's advised to use distilled water and a drop of washing up liquid underneath to keep mould down - it's mould resistent, not totally proof, though the worst I've had was it got a bit smelly. The foam does stain a bit when if you accidentally thin paint so it runs off the edges, but you can get most of it out, and it's not like it makes much difference. The foam does store much more water than paper towels.

 

The lid works just fine with a 2nd piece of foam and paper for extended space if you happen to need it, e.g. painting with a friend. It's not a feature I've used much.

 

The wavy add on is useful for thinning down multiple drops of washes etc if you don't already have a plastic palette with wells, but they're like £2. It does come with little magnets so the wavy sticks to the side of the palette if you like. It's not particularly useful, but I guess it stops it getting lost when stored. I put brushes back in their holder or on my newspaper*, so the wavy cutouts for laying down a brush aren't much use to me.

 

* Yes, I still put down newspaper when painting, for 30 years, Thanks Mum.

 

It's definitely dryer than the daler-rowney or frisk paper I used before when used as directed (i.e. don't wet the paper under the tap, put it dry on the wet foam); it does keep paint wet overnight (it may separate, depending upon paint brand). With the artist palettes I used to be able to rinse off used paper in the sink and get several uses out of a sheet, but the RGG paper is definitely one-and-done as the thin remnants of GW paint does dry out after several days. That said, I still have tons of sheets left after 2 years, so eh.

 

It does mean I can use it for metallics or small amounts of wash without over-thinning them just from the wet palette. The plastic is ABS, so you need to be careful cleaning it with harsher products - I accidentally spilled some acetone-based airbrush cleaner on it and it etched the plastic surface a bit. You should only use IPA or washing up liquid to clean the palette or foam. Only use water or soapy water on the foam, you can use water, soap and water or IPA on the case as needed to clean.

 

I've not used the AP one, it's only been out what, 6 months? The army painter one looks very much like a clone of the RGG one from reading reviews - so much so I wondered if it was produced under licence, but with the brush clips in the lid. The sponges and paper seem VERY similar, I think the AP one is about 1cm smaller.

 

I think it probably comes down to whether the rubber lid seal (keeps water in it longer when closed, in theory) is more or less use to you than than army painter brush clips in the extra midtray. And of course, price, given the AP one comes with more sheets and an extra foam for the same price as the RGG starter.

 

Extra 50 sheets of paper for the RGG painter is £7, foam is £4, while for the AP it's £9 for 50 sheets and 2 foam. Not that I've come close to using 50 sheets yet in 2 years, but something to consider.

 

At the time it came out, the RGG painter was definitely in a niche of its own compared to standard artist wet palettes due to the size, good seal and solid construction. I think the Army Painter one keeps the core functions and is cheaper, so if I was buying today, I'd probably go for the AP one.

 

(edit to fix bad info on the IPA)

Edited July 23, 2020 by Arkhanist

[Firedrake Cordova]

Thanks for the detailed write-up, Arkhanist! :D

 

Trying to get parchment paper for DIY in the UK is a pain, most baking paper is coated or waxed so doesn't work that well in my past experience.

Didn't know that.  I guess I was either lucky in finding some that worked, or have low expectations :blush: :lol:

 

The wavy add on is useful for thinning down multiple drops of washes etc if you don't already have a plastic palette with wells, but they're like £2.

I have a couple of artist's porcelain tinting saucers for that (which also double as brush holders due to the indents)

 

* Yes, I still put down newspaper when painting, for 30 years, Thanks Mum.

Heh.  I always paint over an A3 self-healing mat for roughly the same reason. :)

 

The plastic is ABS, so you need to be careful cleaning it with harsher products - I accidentally spilled some acetone-based airbrush cleaner on it and it etched the plastic surface a bit. You should only use IPA or washing up liquid to clean the palette or foam.

Good to know. :)  I normally just stick stuff in hot water and wait for it to lift off ... :blush:

[pawl]

If you own that many brushes then the only benefit would be for storing a handful for painting out of the house I suppose. If I remember later I'll take a photo for you so that you can see the gaps between the ridges though.

 

Re: the sponges, I don't imagine I'll need to replace it any time soon. It's dried out fully, and it turned out that it just needed a minute to soak to bring it fully back. Binning the first one after ten seconds was the wrong thing to do!

[Firedrake Cordova]

If you own that many brushes then the only benefit would be for storing a handful for painting out of the house I suppose. If I remember later I'll take a photo for you so that you can see the gaps between the ridges though.

Yeah, to be honest, I might have a problem - instead of settling on one thing, I keep on seeing things and going, "ooh, that looks nice, I might try one".  I really must ask Jacksons and Ken Bromley to stop sending me catalogues to look through ...  :lol: 

 

The Escoda's I've got are 8mm+ at the widest point (and feel so nice in the hand due to the size, heft, and lacquer finish).

 

Mould is a strange issue though, I think. In all the time I've used a palette (years with a homemade one, and a few months with a 'proper' one) I've never come across it. 

I've come across it once, when I was using kitchen paper to hold the water - there were spots of black mould everywhere after a week.

 

From what I've read The Army Painter have a solid reputation for putting out products that are of perfectly reasonable quality at perfectly reasonable prices. Maybe not world class but plenty good enough for 95% of the community. 

It's not the first time I've read something like that.

Edited July 23, 2020 by Firedrake Cordova

[pawl]

(i would multi quote but I can't be bothered on my phone, sorry!)

 

I often want to do the same, but lack of funding fortunately gets in the way

[RWJP]

I've been using the Redgrass Games Painter Palette for a few months now and think it's excellent.

I got the Starter Bundle including multiple foam pads and 50 sheets of paper.

[Arkhanist]

 

It's definitely dryer than the daler-rowney or frisk paper I used before when used as directed (i.e. don't wet the paper under the tap, put it dry on the wet foam); it does keep paint wet overnight (it may separate, depending upon paint brand). With the artist palettes I used to be able to rinse off used paper in the sink and get several uses out of a sheet, but the RGG paper is definitely one-and-done as the thin remnants of GW paint does dry out after several days. That said, I still have tons of sheets left after 2 years, so eh.

 

It does mean I can use it for metallics or small amounts of wash without over-thinning them just from the wet palette.

 

After doing some digging to see why paint seems to dry quicker than it should, because it's been bugging me lately, it turns out this might actually be my fault. Because I'm a slow painter, an indvidual palette sheet will last weeks before I actually fill it up with different colours. (Plus I use quite a bit of airbrushing and neat Contrast over pre-shading, which don't involve the wet palette).

 

So after having it open for a couple of colours, I close it up for the night, and return to it when I next need it for another couple, and repeat. Thus I can go weeks without rinsing or re-filling it, often not until I replace the paper. There's still some water in the foam because of the rubber seal and a bit of condensation on the lid, so I figured it was just the paper being different. However, after testing, the top of the paper feels dry to the touch, unlike when I set it up fresh. when it's well, moist.

 

With my old artist wet palettes with paper for the water reservoir, they'd dry out in a day or two due to the crappy lids, so I was risning and refilling pretty much every session, and I'd usually clean and re-use the paper at the same time.

 

Sooo - I think the RGG palette is drying out slowly while I have it open for repeated sessions, but I'm not refilling the water because I was thinking there's still enough in there. Apparently it can last like 8 hours open, but I'm probably having it open for two or three times that in total. Oops. The foam apparently needs to be pretty wet to work correctly - if the tray around the foam is dry and the foam is only damp, then you need to add more water (but not so much you have a 'pool' that reaches the level of the paper) with a pipette or the like. I have a water bottle with angled nozzle right there on my desk for my airbrush, but never bother filling up my palette with it. D'oh.

 

I'll give it a try over the next few days making sure it's kept sufficiently filled at the end of a session, and let you know if it fixes it. Had the thing for two years, only just realised I'm probably doing it wrong - because the thing does hold water so much longer than a crap palette, but I'm pushing it way too far. No wonder it always feels much nicer when I've just set it up with a fresh sheet - because it's also got a totally full sponge...

 

Oh, and IPA is only for use getting old, dry paint off the case - you should only use soap and water on the foam . My bad, I misremembered.

Edited July 23, 2020 by Arkhanist

[Fajita Fan]

I’ve had a Masterson wet palette sitting in a box for years and never thought it was going to help me. Last week I just started using a small wet palette made from a shallow plastic box, paper towel, and parchment paper. It’s been really nice and paint stays wet but it does start to break down from the water.

 

The Masterson one is much bigger so it’ll be nice for using more colors at once. I need to try shades and contrasts, so far I’ve just been doing terrain with cheap craft paints.

[Tyberos the Red Wake]

I have the Masterson Sta-Wet and the smaller orange RedgrassGames palette. If you are going to spend money on a wet palette instead of making your own, spend more for the better one and get RedgrassGames. The Masterson works fine, but if you're on such an extreme budget that the RedgrassGames product is prohibitively expensive (it really shouldn't be, if you're in THIS hobby), then save the money and go homemade. The Masterson also has worse, thinner sponge that can grow mold and the included paper, while thick and high quality, requires boiling and preparation. RedgrassGames has the superior sponge, build quality, and easier to use sheets.

[Bung]

@Firedake Cordoba

I didnt think i had problems with mould till i met a Lab Tech at a painting workshop.

He showed us some pictures after he had taken sponges etc. to his lab out of personel interest and getting stuff to do for some interns.

Most time there is mould even if you dont see it.

 

As a wetpalette is only intended to be used for one session i set it Up new with kitchen towels etc. and clean the palette with vinegar every few weeks.

 

Better safe than sorry and the supplys are cheaper than the original stuff.

 

And i dont like the RGG paper. I prefer the cheap parchment paper from a discounter.

[Firedrake Cordova]

Thanks for the feedback, all - it's been really helpful, and is greatly appreciated! (TL;DR seems to be either the Army Painter or Red Grass one would be fine)

 

(i would multi quote but I can't be bothered on my phone, sorry!)

Absolutely no need to apologise! 

 

I often want to do the same, but lack of funding fortunately gets in the way

Whilst I love my sable brushes (Series 7 & Series 8404), I dislike certain aspects of their manufacture, so I've been trying to switch to synthetic as far as possible for a while.  As synthetics are generally cheaper, it makes it easier to try out a few of them, especially when combined with Black Friday or similar (e.g. I paid £1.60 for a size 8 Jackson's Series 505 [and yes, they're good]). 

 

I've just looked the Versatils up, and they're seriously chunky!

They're really comfy

 

 The one time I've had to speak to them (I had a brush turn up damaged because it was missing the protective sleeve) they got back to me very quickly and were very nice about the whole thing.

That's good to hear - so often customer service seems to suffer these days.

 

Had the thing for two years, only just realised I'm probably doing it wrong

Oh, I know that feeling

 

(it really shouldn't be, if you're in THIS hobby)

Heh.  I just have a hard time internally justifying the more expensive ones like the Studio XL.  Anything to do with hobbies seems to be expensive, unfortunately, especially with arts and crafts - I mean, the full-size (30x40cm) Masterson palette is £52 over here.

 

@Firedake Cordoba
I didnt think i had problems with mould till i met a Lab Tech at a painting workshop.

Yeah, if you don't want to be scared, don't do that  (I know what you're saying though - the difference between it being there, and being there in sufficient quantities to see/smell it)

 

And i dont like the RGG paper. I prefer the cheap parchment paper from a discounter.

It's not the first time that I've seen someone say that (not just about the RGG one).

Edited July 24, 2020 by Firedrake Cordova

[Bung]

For the advertisment of the best paper for wetpalettes i found it not that good.

 

Personly im using this:

https://www.rossmann.de/de/haushalt-rubin-butterbrotpapier/p/4305615566634

 

Its 0,70€ for 16m i just cut it to size and works like a charm with paper towels.

[Arkhanist]

Thanks for the feedback, all - it's been really helpful, and is greatly appreciated! (TL;DR seems to be either the Army Painter or Red Grass one would be fine)

...

Whilst I love my sable brushes (Series 7 & Series 8404), I dislike certain aspects of their manufacture, so I've been trying to switch to synthetic as far as possible for a while.

 

Yeah, I think either the RGG or AP ones would be fine. One thing I hasn't realised with the AP one is you have to add the brush tray to put the two halves together, or the lid doesn't fit. Given I wouldn't actually need the tray that would be slightly annoying for me, but given the extra paper/foam you get with the AP, I'd probably live with it!

 

I can entirely understand having moral qualms about the source of natural hair for sable brushes, it's not great. Synthetics have improved quite a lot over the years; for our purposes, I think paint retention and 'snap' is getting pretty good, and OK points. I prefer synthetics for metallics as the mica can supposedly damage sable brushes over time, but I go through them regularly due to rapid tip curl seeming to be inevitable. (my kids are happy enough with my 'ruined' brushes!)

 

I'll give the versatils a go next time, they look nice.

 

 

And i dont like the RGG paper. I prefer the cheap parchment paper from a discounter.

It's not the first time that I've seen someone say that (not just about the RGG one).

 

I have seen some people don't like the RGG paper. It is different to baking parchment paper, and I suspect the Army Painter one works similarly from videos. Both AP and RGG paper are supposed to go on dry, and let water rise up from the sponge - RGG specifically tell you you should never get both sides wet - from their instructions:

• The hydration may be different from what you are accustomed to and it may takes a few painting sessions before getting used to it.
•  You still need to set your dilution level!
• Do not wet both sides of the hydration paper
• For optimal performance, please avoid any source of direct heat or a windy room

Parchment paper, you usually fully wet it before putting it down, and it's not expected to last more than an overnight session, while the RGG one is explicitly sold as being able to last longer.

 

I also suspect the RGG (and AP) palettes are balanced for a northern european climate, given that's where both were designed. (France and Denmark, respectively) so in areas with substantially different humidty or temperature, the palette operates differently than intended. I've seen reports for the RGG ones of both flooding paint with excess water in hours, and drying out entirely in hours, so it probably depends upon location and personal taste as to whether the palette combo provides the level of moistness necessary to offset evaporation, but not too much or too little! Plus the foam needs to be kept topped up for extended use over many sessions.

 

I can report with my RGG one that after two sessions with fresh paper and full sponge and left overnight in between, the paint was in a perfectly fine state for the 2nd session, fully liquid (if it a bit separated) but not noticeably more than so than how I left it. At the end of the 2nd session, I could see the tray was dry round the sponge, so I've topped it up with a cc or two of water round the edge from my water bottle - this should hopefully *keep* it operating that way, instead of accidentally letting it slowly dry out as I've been in the habit of and getting slowly reducing performance!

 

I never much liked UK baking paper, as all the high street brands I tried are 'non stick' either with silicone or wax, and I'd find the paint (and water) would bead up constantly, and not actually let much water through. I did find an OK random brand from a local discount store that acted like US baking parchment, but they stopped doing it. Admittedly, I've not looked again for about 4 years; I think it was greaseproof paper rather than baking paper.

 

I believe proper parchment paper for this use is pulped and treated with acid so it's semi-permeable, rather than the non-stick stuff that's coated.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Arkhanist

[Firedrake Cordova]

So ... I ended up getting the Red Grass Painter Starter Pack.  I figured that whilst the Army Painter palette was unquestionably better value, there were some design elements of the Red Grass palette which made it worthwhile - primarily being able to lock the lid to the underside of the base to give a compact but solid construct (so I don't have to find somewhere to put the lid), and the enclosure being a bit bigger than the foam/paper (making it easier to top up the water).  I also figured that as the RG one was slightly bigger, if for whatever reason I could only get the AP supplies, they'd fit fine.

 

I've only had it for a little over a day, but initial impressions are positive - it seems solidly-constructed, and seems to seal well (you have to pay attention when putting the lid on to ensure you have actually aligned it properly).  The foam was a little bit difficult to wet evenly (it required several "pourings" and "proddings" to get it uniformly wet as it soaked up the water), but it seems to keep the paint wet for a good while (unless you're silly and decide to try to paint in the shade outside - it was 29C/60% RH with a breeze - the paint did dry on the paper after "5-10 minutes", but there again the water was disappearing from the palette quite rapidly too).

Edited August 2, 2020 by Firedrake Cordova

[Tyberos the Red Wake]

The foam was a little bit difficult to wet evenly (it required several "pourings" and "proddings" to get it uniformly wet as it soaked up the water),

This happened to me the one time I let the foam dry completely bone-dry by leaving the lid open for several weeks and I thought it was somehow damaged. You have to sort of massage the water into the stubborn spots to completely hydrate it and keep them under running water a bit more, even though the edges and most of the surface will revive with minimal effort. It leaves these weird bright spots that make the foam look like it's damaged somehow until you get it to actually saturate completely.

[Fajita Fan]

 

 

You have to sort of massage the water into the stubborn spots to completely hydrate it

I actually laughed out loud 

[Arkhanist]

 

The foam was a little bit difficult to wet evenly (it required several "pourings" and "proddings" to get it uniformly wet as it soaked up the water),

This happened to me the one time I let the foam dry completely bone-dry by leaving the lid open for several weeks and I thought it was somehow damaged. You have to sort of massage the water into the stubborn spots to completely hydrate it and keep them under running water a bit more, even though the edges and most of the surface will revive with minimal effort. It leaves these weird bright spots that make the foam look like it's damaged somehow until you get it to actually saturate completely.

 

For what it's worth, I found the easiest way to hydrate the foam when it has dried out completely is to submerge it in shallow water in a bowl and leave it there for a bit (with something heavy on it to hold it down). Minimises the massaging :) It does get all twisted up and go rock hard if you intentionally let it dry out completely because you're not going to use it for a while - this is normal behaviour.

[Spacecow]

Yeah the rock hard twisted shape is normal when dry.

 

I also have the habit of leaving it to soak in my kitchen sink for a bit .

 

I use a dropper bottle with a finer squirty point to add water during use so it stays moist too.

 

Generally happy with the palette. Only issue I found is the rubber rim when closing. It makes the moisture go too much to the lid.

 

I’ve started with not closing it completely but leaving it slightly ajar

[Dantay VI]

Has anyone tried the AK interactive or scale 75 wet palettes?

[Firedrake Cordova]

Has anyone tried the AK interactive or scale 75 wet palettes?

I briefly looked at the AK Interactive one.  It seems to get good reviews, but is smaller than I was after.