Thousand Sons Overview and Tactics videos

[DarkPhoenix]

Found these posted by the same channel that provided the new points cost reading. How do these compare to your experiences with Thousand Sons? Do you think they'll hold true in 9th?

 

Overview and tactics: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fzm0Doj3M8M&t

Five units you should have in your army: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpzfWXOxPUc&t

 

Spoiler: Rubric Marines, Ahriman, Maulerfiend, Daemon Prince, and Exalted Sorcerers

[Prot]

I think his videos are very much tilted towards narrative play, so I very rarely watch any of his stuff, but he always presents a very nice battlefield and fun advice for immersing yourself in your army.

 

I think the '5' units are pretty straight forward. Ahriman and Exalted's are a no brainer now. The DP is better for TS than other Chaos legions because we just came off a big point increase. Rubrics.. not much to say there, cultists are ugly, and Tzaangors are... Tzaangors. 

 

I would say my own changes to his picks would be:

 

Defiler>Maulerfiend

And Ahriman is such an auto take (on Disk) I wouldn't even include it in a top 5. 

 

I think ignored units would be a cooler video since these are mostly so obvious. The Defiler probably fits that. Spawn are something I always used in 8th as a 'hidden' gem. 

 

Forgeworld probably gets hit too hard, but I think a Forgefiend with Plasma looks really good, and I'd really look at Helbrutes again which were junk compared to FW dreads in 8th.

 

Another unusual consideration might actually be Magnus. Yes, I took him a lot in 8th but that was because I was trying to motivate myself to paint him, but in 90% of those games I wanted to see if he could fly out the window.

 

So why look at him now? Well he gets an increase of only 20pts and starting in 9th you do have the option of deep striking him for CP.

 

I am still really enjoying a Heldrake which is only going to be recommended by people playing 9th because on paper it's still not very attractive, but in game, I've found a spot for it (especially if you play aggressive.)

 

The big grey area unit for me is Scarab Occult. Going up in points... I don't see them being that much better than Rubrics to justify the extra point increase. I'm really not sure anymore.

 

I haven't watched the tactics video. I'm still forming my own (I'm about 10-12 games into 9th as I write this.)

[Raven1]

I watched the top 5, and I'm watching the tactics video.  They are 9th ed focused which is good, but these are based solely on what he runs and not an unbiased look at what the book has to offer.

 

The Top 5 was obvious.  These are models that almost every list had in 8th (except Maulerfiend & Exalted Sorcerer) and in 9th demon engines got a new lease on life as did Exalted Sorcerers.  

 

My lists I'm looking at using don't look like very much.  I haven't played any games, but I think I have some good ideas.

 

Personally, I dont mind using FW so I'm looking at running a Contemptor with either dual butcher cannons or ectoplasma cannons.  Even with the increased cost the butcher cannons are just so good.  The ectoplasma got blast if I'm not mistaken which improved them.

 

Also, even with the increased cost.  I'm a huge fan of the whirlwind scorpius.  You can target out of LOS and can either weaken a unit for Rubrics to mop up or vice versa.  

[MillionsSons]

I never used Exalted in V8. Well I did until I realised for 88pts I had the same magic output (cast 2 deny 1) from regular sorcerers.

 

Exalted are not strong in CC to make a difference anyway, and the reroll 1 bubble is already redondant with Ahriman’s and DP’s.

 

Now with only 10 point gap I might go for it.

 

For me since PA the auto include was the SoTs. A squad of 10 can shoot 80 shot with prescience and Votlw on, and be buffed up with 3++... can fall back with DMC and still shoot, or use DMC to reach the center at turn 1. Very powerful

[Skerr]

I always used exalted on disc, Ahriman on disc and DPwW in 8th (friendly meta). Quite often I would put the ES in cc, they have the Stateline of a chaos lord so I use them as such. Though always with support and what I think is the best timing plus he can give the rerolls to himself if there is no one else close by but I often do have chaff or other close by. Give him a flamer if you have the points and he is super versatile. With the drop in points I look forward to hearing about everyone's xp with them. Again, this worked in my friendly 8th ed meta and may not in yours or likely was not worth the 8th ed points so I get it. In my meta I did not want to buy another DP and it's also because I love the kit and have a few ES on disc to choose from. Edited July 24, 2020 by Skerr

[Prot]

I heard a lot of points adjustments were purely motivated by what GW felt -should- be used more. I think Cultists going up, and Exalted Sorcs going down is a good example of this. 

 

Really we should be using Exalted Sorcs. It's a unique choice in Chaos faction as a whole, and I always -tried- to use 1 in 8th.

 

 

 

Personally, I dont mind using FW so I'm looking at running a Contemptor with either dual butcher cannons or ectoplasma cannons.  Even with the increased cost the butcher cannons are just so good.  The ectoplasma got blast if I'm not mistaken which improved them.

 

Also, even with the increased cost.  I'm a huge fan of the whirlwind scorpius.  You can target out of LOS and can either weaken a unit for Rubrics to mop up or vice versa.  

 

I don't know much about the Contemptor with Ectoplasma, but I do believe the dual las never went up (which makes sense to me), and that's the build I always used. But I'm thinking of pulling my Contemptors. And yea, indirect is very powerful I've found on tables with any moderate obscurring. My games against Astra have been so painful in that regard.

 

I never used Exalted in V8. Well I did until I realised for 88pts I had the same magic output (cast 2 deny 1) from regular sorcerers.

Exalted are not strong in CC to make a difference anyway, and the reroll 1 bubble is already redondant with Ahriman’s and DP’s.

Now with only 10 point gap I might go for it.

For me since PA the auto include was the SoTs. A squad of 10 can shoot 80 shot with prescience and Votlw on, and be buffed up with 3++... can fall back with DMC and still shoot, or use DMC to reach the center at turn 1. Very powerful

 

- About ES's... for what it's worth, and this is meant as friendly advice, in my 9th ed games you will find value in 1. The extra wound, and 2. The ability to take a disk to 'hide' more effectively.  

 

- SoT's were auto take for me before PA, but usually only 5. When PA came out I was right in there with 10 man squads with dual missiles, and did some crazy fun stuff. (One time I actually had an 11" heroic intervention from them that flipped a game completely in my favour.) 

 

The reason I'm on the fence right now is I believe that 10 man squad goes up by 50 points! As a percentage that's more than Magnus, or more than 20 Rubrics! I am not sure I have this right, but if so, that's a hard pill to swallow because of 'power swords' which I never really use.

[Skerr]

I thought I read the 1k sons playtesters WH Community article that listed SOTs as a winner though I cannot remember the article offering anything substantial as to why.

Maybe I need to reread it.

 

I always had a use for them in 8th as a bully force and perhaps surgical tool if opportunities presented that though were not always successful as my buds made them priority targets when they were on the table because of their bolter fire. Often they were either MVPs or victims of First Blood, lol.

[GreenPlasma]

Just to point something out regarding the Exalted Sorcs, Matthew Allee used one in tournaments to really good effect by fishing for +1 damage in CC and then stacking it onto Seer's Bane. Even without a relic, just adding +1 damage to a Power Sword alongside a support power like Diabolical Strength would let an Exalted Sorcerer chew through 2W Primaris marines easily. So they're not completely incapable in CC, you just need to apply some unconventional thinking.

[Prot]

I thought I read the 1k sons playtesters WH Community article that listed SOTs as a winner though I cannot remember the article offering anything substantial as to why.

Maybe I need to reread it.

 

I always had a use for them in 8th as a bully force and perhaps surgical tool if opportunities presented that though were not always successful as my buds made them priority targets when they were on the table because of their bolter fire. Often they were either MVPs or victims of First Blood, lol.

 

Well I would also declare them a 'winner' prior to the points increase. That's a big difference per model that really doesn't translate into a power jump in performance. These aren't Blightlord Terminators with Combi weapons and super survivable options. We need CP and psychic powers to go off to keep them alive, and their guns are mostly inflexible. 

 

They were 'good' in my opinion. Fun unit, but it's the points jump for me that would have them leaving the list in a competitive situation.

[Brom MKIV]

I use scarab occult and always felt they were superior to nilla termies which I also tried plenty of times.

Now in 9th they went up just 16 pts for base size. That isn't enough to deter me personally. At 8 they increased 31 pts which is typically aroundnwhere I run them but if I were to use 10 I would drop a model and it's pretty much a wash.

[Skerr]

Hmmm, was not aware of what the margin of increase was for SOTs and agree its not much.

 

I must confess to starting a Talons of the Emperor force recently and have been list building with them but have been coming back here to keep up with Sons.

Edited August 7, 2020 by Skerr

[Archaeinox]

I've got a 15-20 person event this weekend that I'll be attending and will report back by Monday with what I used, saw and learned.

[Prot]

I've got a 15-20 person event this weekend that I'll be attending and will report back by Monday with what I used, saw and learned.

 

Please do.

 

And start a new thread... perhaps your list as well? I'm curious if any SoT will be in the list?

[DarkPhoenix]

I've got a 15-20 person event this weekend that I'll be attending and will report back by Monday with what I used, saw and learned.

Looking forward to reading about it!