Direction of 40k

[sturguard]

Hey folks,

 

I'm hoping to have a good discussion about where folks think 40k is headed. I'd really like to hear from vets like me who have been around the game from the beginning and have seen the ebbs and flows throughout the companies history. If you examine them carefully you will see that they constantly take things from their past. 

 

I guess I should start out by saying, I don't think this is a new GW vs an old GW. Its a company. While their practices might change over time, their number one goal is the same as it was 30 years ago, making a profit. No profit, they go out of business. And while some small portion of you who live in the UK may personally know some of the higher ups in the company, most of us don't. I say this because sometimes folks want to believe that GW is our friend, that somehow they establish this personal relationship with us, when in fact, their goal is to sell minis and will make whatever decision they need to to stay profitable- Warhammer should have taught us that fact. 

 

Don't get me wrong, this isnt doom and gloom. I love fishing. I buy alot of lures at Cabelas. Again, I may know some of the clerks at Cabelas but that doesnt mean they have me in mind when they make decisions, nor should they. 

 

So this is all from my perspective, and when considering this, you have to take into account that I have now moved past 50 (Im 51 now!) and have no children that want anything to do with miniatures games. I'd like to think I was one of those guys that allowed GW to stick around as long as they have. I used to buy everything. New 40k army box, Ill buy it, assemble all the minis and get rid of them. New fantasy army, the same. New supplement... check. New dice... you get the idea. I don't even want to guess the amount of money I have spent over the past 30 years. However, in my mind, I need to be more realistic in what I purchase. One day I might not wake up (I know it sounds dumb) and what is my wife going to do with all this stuff? She doesnt know anything about it, and I have thousands of dollars of stuff. Again, my klds arent going to hang onto it. It will either end up in the trash or yard sale, either way my wife will never get anything from my investment. So I have been kind of pruning the tree so to speak, selling this kit or this model. Ill never sell my SW completely, its been a work in progress for 20 years. I also wouldnt sell my HH Thousand Sons, although that army is a bit smaller than my wolves. Obviously I have no desire to add to my wolves and pick up more Primaris kits, I just dont need them to play. 

 

So my big question is, do I sell my eldar? I have a 3-4,000 pt eldar army I have worked on for years. No paint on them (nor any plans to paint them), but I do play them at times and have magnetized alot of the models and converted them. In recent years I have always tried to stay ahead of GW decisions that affect me financially. I'm still bitter about the Fantasy debacle- not that GW dropped fantasy, but the fact I didn't sell my armies earlier. So many folks ridiculed those of us that had said GW was going to drop the line, (I hate the sky is falling saying) so I waited, and ultimately it probably made the difference in several hundred dollars and to me, that's a big deal. 

 

So GW decided the best way to make money was to essentially remake the whole SM line. I accept the fact that you can't add models forever and at some point there are just too many units to even try to balance (again why I love HH). So we now have all these new Primaris that for the most part are huge compared to alot of other races not named Chaos Space Marines. So whats in line for the other races? So it looks like GW is in the process of redoing most of the Necrons. I didnt get the new box set, but it looks like most of those models make the older ones look tiny. Is this going to happen for all the races? Are we going to see an upscale on new models and gradually just phase all the older models out? Will some of the races just be squatted, especially those that dont seem to make GW any money? The Eldar in particular seem kind of vulnerable. Why? Well they really cant add any more units, the army has a ton of them already. They also can't really make new units larger without throwing the whole scale out of whack can they? I mean part of the hobby is aesthetics, and how models look on the table. Obviously Primaris are on deck now and I dont think anything is going to happen to Eldar in the near future, but I have the Bill Belichick  philosophy on unpainted models, Id rather get rid of them a year or two early, then a year too late. 

 

Now if I did get rid of the eldar, I would probably replace them with a much small project, like some Crons as they just came out. 

 

What do you guys think about all this, and sorry for the background dump!

[HighMarshalAmp]

I feel ya.
In fact, I meant to reply to @General Tullius's thread about starting an ew army now.

 

But C:SM? Problem there was that the range had everything and nobody needed new units. We all had our troops and vets.

Updating the kits wouldn't have created any real demand for new models, not with the kits themselves being merely a few years old in some cases.

 

That's why they added a completely new ruleset and there ya go.

 

As you can see with Sisters, Chaos MArines and Necrons, those ranges get new models that largely adhere to the old rules. It still creates a massive demand since those armies haven't had any new stuff for a long time and some armies (Sisters, Eldar still) never appealed to many newcomers since the models were just. so. darn. OLD!

No need to create new rules when new models suffice, and everything that isn't the flagship faction just needs new models and SIsters and Necrons haven't gotten more.

 

Keep your Eldar. Deal with the fact that in 2022, they will look like putty models compared to the standard model then. Recoice from the fact that you paid half what a new Eldar army will cost in 2022.

[sturguard]

You really dont think they are going to do anything to Eldar? I mean Sisters.... bigger models. Necrons.... bigger models. Chaos... bigger models. Orks, I think those models have gotten bigger correct?

 

Storm Guardians they dont even have official models for, and it doesnt seem like they have any intentions of addressing that. Regular guardians. most of the elites all need new models, but if they upscale those units, the rest of the army will be out of whack. So is GW satisfied with making small models for eldar and larger for all the other factions? Do eldar even pull in any revenue for them? Dark eldar are kind of in the same boat except they had their whole model range reworked a few years ago.

 

Let me ask you guys this, besides Marines and CSM I would argue because that is part of the whole Horus Heresy, are any of the model ranges safe? 

[Lord Commander Scrymgeour]

they did this with my (sorry, some of these armies aren't 40k)

high elves back in 5th edition

again when they did plastic beastmen

 

my space marines in 3rd ed

 

necrons when they did plastic

 

my metal guard when they released plastic cadians

Even a tiny forgeworld marine is quite a lot bigger than a metal rogue trader one, or a 2nd ed plastic one.

It happens, 

scale changes, and quality gets better (sometimes)

[Ahzek451]

Being the flagship seller army of the game and largely one of  the most bloated ranges that most people had, it makes sense for GW to (eventually)scrap the old line and start fresh to keep the sales momentum going. They will always receive this attention for the reason above. Other races will eventually get there day in the sun piece by piece. But I see eldar getting a lot of plastic aspect re-do's like the banshees. 

[Bryan Blaire]

I actually wish that GW would put more variation into the heights of models - not every Guardian is going to be the same height, not every Chaos Marine, Guardsman, etc. I get that this might throw people, but it would definitely be more realistic.

[MARK0SIAN]

I think we will definitely get some more new Eldar kits to replace the ageing models and I don’t think you’ll have to wait too much longer.

 

One positive though is that, even though Eldar may not have been favourites of the design team for a while, they absolutely have been a consistent favourite of the rules team going back decades. They have always performed at or near the top of the pack. So even though your army may look dated it is likely to remain competitive into the future. Unlike some armies that have both dated models and wax and wane in terms of competitiveness.

[Toxichobbit]

You really dont think they are going to do anything to Eldar? I mean Sisters.... bigger models. Necrons.... bigger models. Chaos... bigger models. Orks, I think those models have gotten bigger correct?

 

Storm Guardians they dont even have official models for, and it doesnt seem like they have any intentions of addressing that. Regular guardians. most of the elites all need new models, but if they upscale those units, the rest of the army will be out of whack. So is GW satisfied with making small models for eldar and larger for all the other factions? Do eldar even pull in any revenue for them? Dark eldar are kind of in the same boat except they had their whole model range reworked a few years ago.

 

Let me ask you guys this, besides Marines and CSM I would argue because that is part of the whole Horus Heresy, are any of the model ranges safe? 

 

The scale within the Eldar range has horrible internal consistency. The modern plastics are to scale with other 40k models, where as stuff like the Guardians and metal/resin models are small, even by the standards of models of the time. Compare Guardians to Cadians or Catachans and the Guardians don't compare favourably for a race that's meant to be tall and lithe.

 

GW have already scaled the Eldar up, so new releases aren't going to make the rest of the range look out of wack. They did it a while ago, it's just not taken full effect because they've been neglecting the faction for so long. So you have a range which is in three different scales: old RT/2nd ed scale of things like Warp Spiders, Phoenix Lords and Warlocks. 3rd - 5th ed scale of Guardians and the metal/resin Aspect Warriors. And the new scale of the current Farseer, Autarch, Jain Zar, Eldrad and Banshees. Interestingly despite being 5th ed, Dire Avengers are close to the current scale. It's difficult to tell if they're an exact match as they're in the infamous squatting pose of older GW models while newer stuff is standing tall or leaping, but they don't look out of place alongside modern Banshees.

 

Any new releases will match the current scale. Given Banshees just released it's highly unlikely we'll see another scale increase for the range. Everything released in the modern era (post 5th) is scaled well internally and when compared to modern humans like Sisters or stuff from the side games (BSF, Kill Team). They're also taller than modern Guardsmen (Scions or the Traitor Guard from BSF) rather than being the same size or smaller like they were in 3rd.

 

That said, the scale difference isn't enough that the old stuff will look out of place. Anything from 3rd onwards can, IMO (and I have all the models to compare to one another) mix fine. The 2nd ed stuff, not so much. They're noticeably smaller. But either way, you don't have the huge scale difference of modern Primaris/Chaos Marines compared to the older ones.

 

Also, you don't have to use new models. The old ones are still perfectly valid. If you don't want your Eldar to get bigger, just keep using the old ones and you'll be grand. If you're just worried about another scale increase when the old models (Guardians + the metal/resin) are replaced, don't worry. It's already happened and the range has been using the increased scale for the best part of a decade.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Toxichobbit

[sturguard]

Really though, what direction can they go in with the eldar, I mean there really arent many new kits they could use, so you guys think they are just going to reproduce old existing kits? That doesnt seem to jive with their current direction. 

[ThePenitentOne]

Obviously profit is a factor, and likely even the most significant driver of the company's direction, but I do not believe it is the only driver.

 

I think that the last two editions demonstrate that GW has realized how broad their player base is; from their emphasis on multiple ways to play, different point systems, different sizes of starter boxes, different sizes of games... we really are spoiled for choice, and everyone has the capacity to play exactly the game they want, provided they can find people who will play.

 

So I think that it's arguable that this push to broaden the game's appeal so that it has something for every niche is a huge part of the company's success. What we're dealing with here is another really important metric that matters a lot to both the company and its shareholders: customer satisfaction. It's related to profit, to be sure, but it is distinct enough to be seen as its own end.

 

The architect who designed the convention centre certainly got paid, but if you don't think the pride they feel when they see their vision come to life drives them as much as their paycheck, I think you're underestimating humans in general, and the architect in particular. Do you think folks like Rick Priestly, Jes Goodwin and John Blanche aren't proud to have left their stamp on popular culture and influenced the way millions of people world wide think of when somebody starts talking about the far future?

 

Every action has cost and provides both intrinsic and extrinsic rewards, and I think a lot of artists, craftsmen and labourers put a lot of love into this game.

 

For those who are more cynical, customer satisfaction can still be regarded as a motivating force because without it, profits fall. A corporate cost cutting measure or revenue generating, bad-faith practice is only profitable to shareholders until it begins to interfere with customer satisfaction. For those of us who post and stalk these forums, we may convince ourselves that there is tremendous dissatisfaction in the player base at large, but the numbers tell a different story. 40k is reaching a bigger audience now than ever before.

 

Enough about business practices; let's talk Eldar of all stripes, shall we?

 

In short, Ynnead was the shot heard round the world and my hunch is that it's the seed which will grow the Eldar to an Empire of models that rivals that of Imperium. I have always believed that Ynnari are the way to bring Exodites and Corsairs into the model range at long last. I think it's possible, because I think 8th explored the possibility of cannibalizing DE and CE units might just bring the whole thing down. If Banshees became Ynnari only, for example, I'd be furious, and I think a lot of players would be. Once GW explored the possibility, they decided not to pull the trigger, and Jain Zar and the Banshees, though sympathetic, remained plain old CWE.

 

The Exodites and Corsairs, however, will not make anyone unhappy if they showed up as Ynnari supporters, and provided GW releases just a generic HQ and unit for each of Exodites and Corsairs, it would be possible to field them in mono-detachments as just Exodites or just Corsairs. These "Armies" would be like the Blackstone and Rogue Trader factions- small, but present, waiting to be built on. Release all four of those kits as dedicated Ynnari units, then put out a WD Exodite dex and WD Corsair dex of roughly the same size as the dexes we got in 8th for Inquisition, Ynnari, SoS and Assassins, all of which were subsequently made official. On a side note, I believe they will all be combined in an Imperial Agents dex once the Blackstone Fortress stuff wraps up.

 

Which brings me to my next point/ prediction/ wish for 9th. The best and most unexpected and brilliant things to happen in 8th were what Blackstone and Kill Team did for 40k. Blackstone is as much Ecclesiarchy as the Sisters Dex IMO; Taddeus, Pious and Gotfrett can't join my Crusade until they wrap up on Blackstone, but all of them are on the way; if GW can fix her Keywords so that I can get her to lead the Death Cult Assassins of Taddeus' battle conclave, she's coming too. Before the Kellermorph was cool, he used to roll with Sarn's Disciples, and there's tons of Admech originals in both KT and Blackstone.

 

Funny though. Blackstone's wrapping up and we haven't heard about Kill Team in awhile, outside of a fairly firm reassurance that there are plans in the works. I think that Blackstone and Kill Team as vehicles for building the Eldar range are incredible. Kill Team releases for Striking Scorpions, DE Trueborn, Hekatrix Bloodbrides, Grotesques, and a new Harlequin infantry unit. You could release them in 40k too, so to do it right and sell the kill team, you could include a unique exarch sculpt, or make them all special push fits with multipart kits to be released later. If the launch of KT Eldar include a new KT box, that's an opportunity for CWE/ DE scenery- I want an Aspect Shrine model. At the very least, Eldar themed gaming boards. Blackstone is used to introduce characters, as opposed to units. They'd have to shift the game a little to achieve this; the characters they'd need to create would be way more powerful than the BSF characters.

 

Some will say it's all a pipe dream, and much of it might be. But we really are reaching Marine saturation- even just within Primaris now. Pretty soon there won't be many more marines to make. Eldar are the next logical choice for Empire updating. Tau could almost use the same treatment but they aren't quite there yet. Maybe they get the treatment in 10th. Nids and GSC are harder. For sure this edition, Tyranids need a fortification- at last, the old capillary towers and digestion pools should see plastic. Tyranids should get a sub-faction specific character or unit that shakes things up a little. There is also that Tyranid planet that isn't being devoured, which could lead to expansions in both Nids and GSC. But again, they've got a lot build before an big expansion is possible.

 

Eldar have the Infrastructure to rival the Imperium Empire to Empire in a way that no other species does (with the exception of Chaos, which is even larger in scope than the Eldar). Also, Eldar are human enough to still be relatable.

 

Chaos needs a lot of love as well, but I feel they need rules love more than model love... Although Emperor's Children would be great against Eldar, wouldn't they?

 

Anyway, sorry to ramble- that was longer than I intended.

Edited July 28, 2020 by ThePenitentOne

[Lucerne]

New craftworld Eldar sculpts for the aspects seem inevitable to me, the question is if it's in 2 years or 5. I don't think we'll see much in the way of Eldar expansion, just a token remake like we got for Necrons before GW returns to its obsession with Primaris releases as easy and instant profit, loyal fanbases for the other factions be damned.

 

For your eldar, I would go through them, see which models are "modern", ie: first released < 10 years ago and therefore unlikely to be replaced in a range refresh, and what characters/conversions you'd want to keep if GW released a full range refresh tomorrow. Then see if you get rid of the rest- and prepare for a 2-5 year hibernation period before GW modernizes the range, at the least.

 

Eldar being actively squatted is unlikely but neglected for long periods before being updated and with a phoned in replacement of the current models without much that's actually new seems likely, unfortunately.

 

Hope that helps.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Lucerne

[MegaVolt87]

My thoughts (not advice) for older collectors would be to downsize parts of your collection you won't realistically finish before you pass on. Also for the stuff you are keeping + will finish before you pass on, note how much it is worth at the time you paid for it, if its decently painted have that as a separate cost addition noted separately for a combined total value. This way your family/ friends etc don't mindlessly throw it out/ sell it for basically nothing. If its sealed in box, might be worth keeping, note down its initial cost, why its still sealed/ importance etc. eg. sealed saga of the wolf box. You could leave instructions with your lawyer/ executor on where they can find the valuations of your warhammer collection. 

[ThatOneMarshal]

So even though your army may look dated it is likely to remain competitive into the future. Unlike some armies that have both dated models and wax and wane in terms of competitiveness.

It’s okay to say Orks and tyranids :(

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Is too early too really say... give it a year.

[mughi3]

Well sturguard i am just a little younger than you but not by much. i am basically in the same boat. 

 

Got married later in life so children were never really in my future. my family and i are not close geographically or in similar interests 

 

As somebody who has been mini gaming since 87' (classic battletech was my gateway drug)  and 20 years with 40K  (started mid 3rd ed) these are the key points. 

 

I currently actively play 

.DUST 1947

.infinity

.victory at sea

.B5 wars (and conversions for star trek and star wars using armada and attack wing ships)

.30K and 40K(5th edition) where i re-use many of the same models

.epic 40K using index 8th ed rules

.monster apocalypse

.warmachine

.heavy gear

.clasic battletech

.battlefleet gothic

 

As such you can imagine i have collected a lot of stuff over the years. I started downsizing my 40K years ago. sold off my SOB, tau,  nids, a large chunk of my old ravenwing and deathwing super cheap to pass on to new players. i still have my salamander successors a small bit of mechanicus and a smattering of dark angels, enough to do a hybrid death/raven wing force. although i must admit from time to time i do miss  some of the units i sold. 

 

As of late i have taken to gifting things like the odd 40K mini or things from the other game systems i don't really use so as to help the local FLGS community. as i get older and get tired of lugging around all this stuff (including all this fantastic terrain i have collected) i will probably part with more, but for now it is my main hobby. 

 

There does come a point where you decide, it is enough. i have reached that point. the new minis from GW are as always fantastic looking, but for the direction of the game, i am not on board. i found index 8th to be fantastic as an engine to play epic 40K just by halving all the ranges but 5th edition is still the best edition to play in my book. and adding in a few house rules like pulling snap fire, over watch and grenade throwing from 6th/7th, while going back and pulling the assaulting vehicle rules from 4th for example  makes 5th an even better game. fortunately i have a veteran group of like minded players at the FLGS who also enjoy it. 

 

With looking at 9th edition i decided to hop off the GW roller-coaster many of the "fixes" from 8th that players seem to praise were things they had previously fixed in 5th, then messed them up again and had to fix them again. i find the re-roll auras drag out the game to much(especially combined with the increased amount of shots in the game), i hate the stratagem bloat as much as the formation bloat of 7th.  the new extra turn phases are not needed (far more intuitive before when everything was wrapped into 3 instead of 7). the objective scoring system in 5th encouraged play to the end of the game without the extra complexity of 9th. the terrain interaction was simple and intuitive before, now it is convoluted at best. i am also very much a lore/casual player so when i saw that 9th is more catered towards the tournament crowd i realized i did not like the direction the game itself was heading in. 

 

At this point all the hype over 9th is just something i ignore as i will never play it. and i will probably never play another new edition since GW will never go back to the core mechanics i loved that made 3rd-7th back compatible. 

 

Great news though, i will never have to worry about another errata or FAQ ruining my army, i will never have worry about points cost changes or  to wait for a new codex as our group encourages players to use their favorite codex from 3rd-7th in the core 5th ed rules set. everything is available. 

 

When it comes to selling your eldar-you have to ask yourself-do you love to play them, do you even use them anymore? will you miss having them in your collection? 

 

I have even kept a few key pieces from those long gone armies  because i just loved the minis. but that's about as much as i dared to hang on to. 

 

My interest in building and painting for war gaming has really gone away, i more just want to play now, so there really isn't any new project in my future...other than getting around to finishing these last few gundam 0083 mastergrade kits i have had for 20+ years.  :P

 

There is my long winded response, your mileage may vary. 

 

Cheers!

[Antarius]

On the topic of scale: ARE the models actually getting larger, apart from Marines? Looking at the newer sculpts for humans (Sisters, and BSF traitors and cultists) they actually seem to get slightly more delicate (due to better design/mould technology, I guess). I don't really like Primaris from a fluff perspective, but scale-wise they seem to be perfectly scaled against other factions, going by what the fluff tells us about Marine stature.

[Volt]

On the topic of scale: ARE the models actually getting larger, apart from Marines? Looking at the newer sculpts for humans (Sisters, and BSF traitors and cultists) they actually seem to get slightly more delicate (due to better design/mould technology, I guess). I don't really like Primaris from a fluff perspective, but scale-wise they seem to be perfectly scaled against other factions, going by what the fluff tells us about Marine stature.

Ironically while being true scale for oldmarines, Primaris aren't actually even the scale they should be for their supposed stature

 

Also I doubt they will add new units to Eldar. They don't need to. Much of the range is so bloody old (almost all aspects) that all you'd probably have to do is just replace the outdated sculpts and Eldar players will gobble them up simply so they can have Aspects models that aren't older than they are.

[clanfield]

 well we are simillar age.

i have a large biel tan army i started in 92 with some olde bits from rt and over the years it has grown to include most models as they have come along,

 

i get a huge amount of joy and memory lane trips having this vast collation of boys and gals true i do hold a reserve box of older smaller models for bigger games,

 

i would say if you cn afford to keep them and can store them then they stay start the crons if that tickles your fancy .

 

lol i have way to many collections im not even calling them armys anymore my imperial troops are organised into battlegroups lol not even chapters

 

hope that helps

[Doctor Perils]

Really though, what direction can they go in with the eldar, I mean there really arent many new kits they could use, so you guys think they are just going to reproduce old existing kits? That doesnt seem to jive with their current direction.

They updated the shooty wraith guard and wraith lord, and created the choppy wraith guard and wraith knight; then they updated all the jetbike stuff; they updated Eldrad and Banshees and Jain Zar, and created the Ynnari. Since Eldar are competitive and have been for a long time, they sell, and as long as they sell, they'll get model support. Realistically, the aspects will be updated, probably the guardians too. When/if they do, it will likely be at the scale of the new banshees.

 

 

TL;DR: Eldar as a faction aren't going to disappear, and nor will they lose all their old units. The older models might look slightly smaller, but not too badly.

 

 

____

 

However, the important question is, do you have any emotional attachment to them? You obviously do for your wolves and KSons, but didn't mention any for your Eldar. If you have any whatsoever, do not sell them imo. If you don't, I'd say sell them earlier rather than later, because if the new models come out it'll probably be more complicated to "get rid of" them.

 

However, I'd recommend not holding out too much hope for selling them without fair losses - from what I've understood, even models that have been OOP for 20 years haven't really shot up in price that much. Like they said on the independent characters a few times, you have to regard this as one time entertainment payment, not an investment.

[Vermintide]

So I was reading through the 9th ed core book last night and I did notice one thing- Fuelling the Golden Throne has been ret-conned to only devour hundreds of souls per day, not the previously established thousands.

 

40K CONFIRMED FOR NOBLEBRIGHT

 

RIP GRIMDARK

[Bryan Blaire]

I thought that it was always one thousand souls (which is 10 hundreds), not thousands.

 

Not seeing how dividing the number by ten spells the end of the grim darkness of the far future - that’s still a pretty raw deal if you are accidentally born a psyker and can’t be purposed in some way.

 

Also, could it be a sign of a reawakening of the God-Emperor?

[Robbienw]

On the topic of scale: ARE the models actually getting larger, apart from Marines? Looking at the newer sculpts for humans (Sisters, and BSF traitors and cultists) they actually seem to get slightly more delicate (due to better design/mould technology, I guess). I don't really like Primaris from a fluff perspective, but scale-wise they seem to be perfectly scaled against other factions, going by what the fluff tells us about Marine stature.

Yes, and not really due to technology imo, more just to an internal rescale. At least not terms of size and body proportions, Technology has massively helped with finer detail of course.

 

Compare a sister to a skitarii for example. Only down 4 years apart, with pretty much the same digital and molding technology. Sister is way taller. The sisters look too tall compared to most other Imperial stuff, Primaris included.

[sturguard]

Well sturguard i am just a little younger than you but not by much. i am basically in the same boat. 

 

Got married later in life so children were never really in my future. my family and i are not close geographically or in similar interests 

 

As somebody who has been mini gaming since 87' (classic battletech was my gateway drug)  and 20 years with 40K  (started mid 3rd ed) these are the key points. 

 

I currently actively play 

.DUST 1947

.infinity

.victory at sea

.B5 wars (and conversions for star trek and star wars using armada and attack wing ships)

.30K and 40K(5th edition) where i re-use many of the same models

.epic 40K using index 8th ed rules

.monster apocalypse

.warmachine

.heavy gear

.clasic battletech

.battlefleet gothic

 

As such you can imagine i have collected a lot of stuff over the years. I started downsizing my 40K years ago. sold off my SOB, tau,  nids, a large chunk of my old ravenwing and deathwing super cheap to pass on to new players. i still have my salamander successors a small bit of mechanicus and a smattering of dark angels, enough to do a hybrid death/raven wing force. although i must admit from time to time i do miss  some of the units i sold. 

 

As of late i have taken to gifting things like the odd 40K mini or things from the other game systems i don't really use so as to help the local FLGS community. as i get older and get tired of lugging around all this stuff (including all this fantastic terrain i have collected) i will probably part with more, but for now it is my main hobby. 

 

There does come a point where you decide, it is enough. i have reached that point. the new minis from GW are as always fantastic looking, but for the direction of the game, i am not on board. i found index 8th to be fantastic as an engine to play epic 40K just by halving all the ranges but 5th edition is still the best edition to play in my book. and adding in a few house rules like pulling snap fire, over watch and grenade throwing from 6th/7th, while going back and pulling the assaulting vehicle rules from 4th for example  makes 5th an even better game. fortunately i have a veteran group of like minded players at the FLGS who also enjoy it. 

 

With looking at 9th edition i decided to hop off the GW roller-coaster many of the "fixes" from 8th that players seem to praise were things they had previously fixed in 5th, then messed them up again and had to fix them again. i find the re-roll auras drag out the game to much(especially combined with the increased amount of shots in the game), i hate the stratagem bloat as much as the formation bloat of 7th.  the new extra turn phases are not needed (far more intuitive before when everything was wrapped into 3 instead of 7). the objective scoring system in 5th encouraged play to the end of the game without the extra complexity of 9th. the terrain interaction was simple and intuitive before, now it is convoluted at best. i am also very much a lore/casual player so when i saw that 9th is more catered towards the tournament crowd i realized i did not like the direction the game itself was heading in. 

 

At this point all the hype over 9th is just something i ignore as i will never play it. and i will probably never play another new edition since GW will never go back to the core mechanics i loved that made 3rd-7th back compatible. 

 

Great news though, i will never have to worry about another errata or FAQ ruining my army, i will never have worry about points cost changes or  to wait for a new codex as our group encourages players to use their favorite codex from 3rd-7th in the core 5th ed rules set. everything is available. 

 

When it comes to selling your eldar-you have to ask yourself-do you love to play them, do you even use them anymore? will you miss having them in your collection? 

 

I have even kept a few key pieces from those long gone armies  because i just loved the minis. but that's about as much as i dared to hang on to. 

 

My interest in building and painting for war gaming has really gone away, i more just want to play now, so there really isn't any new project in my future...other than getting around to finishing these last few gundam 0083 mastergrade kits i have had for 20+ years. 

 

There is my long winded response, your mileage may vary. 

 

Cheers!

Mugh,

 

Awesome post, really enjoyed it. I am slowly coming to that realization. I mean I do at times like modelling still, but for the most part it just proves frustrating when I can't see the parts, glue my fingers to the part or simply can't get my fingers to work the right way! Painting went out the door awhile ago - shaky hand syndrome, can't see etc. My biggest issue is I really dont get to play at all, now especially with covid. We had some turnover and I was genuinely looking forward to going down to the local hobby store and meeting some folks and then covid hit and they shut down. So yeah, when things return to normal I am hoping to get some games in, but when is that going to be, 6 months? a year? I would guess probably when a vaccine is available. 

 

I definitely agree that 5th was my personal favorite for a rules system. GW is capable of creating a perfect game system, but its not in their best interests to do so. You almost certainly risk model sales and obviously its something folks look forward to, I mean the videos are the same each time- best rules system yet!!! All they do is recycle rules and ideas. I guess thats the main appeal for me for HH. The rules are now (and hopefully forever) set. I can play just several times a year and really learn the rules, I dont have to worry about them changing after 13 games (or however many I play in 2 years). 

 

I do enjoy playing eldar from time to time, the key issue is my wolves are fully painted and my thought is, if I am going to play, I should use the models I have painted (that and I have enough wolves that I could change my list up almost each time I play). 

[sturguard]

 

Really though, what direction can they go in with the eldar, I mean there really arent many new kits they could use, so you guys think they are just going to reproduce old existing kits? That doesnt seem to jive with their current direction.

They updated the shooty wraith guard and wraith lord, and created the choppy wraith guard and wraith knight; then they updated all the jetbike stuff; they updated Eldrad and Banshees and Jain Zar, and created the Ynnari. Since Eldar are competitive and have been for a long time, they sell, and as long as they sell, they'll get model support. Realistically, the aspects will be updated, probably the guardians too. When/if they do, it will likely be at the scale of the new banshees.

 

 

TL;DR: Eldar as a faction aren't going to disappear, and nor will they lose all their old units. The older models might look slightly smaller, but not too badly.

 

 

____

 

However, the important question is, do you have any emotional attachment to them? You obviously do for your wolves and KSons, but didn't mention any for your Eldar. If you have any whatsoever, do not sell them imo. If you don't, I'd say sell them earlier rather than later, because if the new models come out it'll probably be more complicated to "get rid of" them.

 

However, I'd recommend not holding out too much hope for selling them without fair losses - from what I've understood, even models that have been OOP for 20 years haven't really shot up in price that much. Like they said on the independent characters a few times, you have to regard this as one time entertainment payment, not an investment.

 

 

Doctor Perils,

 

The wraithlords were updated a LONG time ago, years, even the wraithknight and wraithguard have been years. Bikes and flyer kit relatively new and of course the banshees just came out. Although I have to wonder if the banshees were a test, would they sell well, would it be worth it to redo all the aspect warriors. I certainly dont think it would happen anytime soon, but I honestly could see GW pare down the universe and sunset some of the factions, again it would likely depend on model bloat and sales. If GW felt they could make alot more money just selling marines vs marines, and trim their expenses, they'd probably do that. 

 

I look at the investment a bit different, and I've been buying and selling models for almost 30 years. Lets say I buy a unit of dire avengers for $30. To me, they aren't worth $30. I look at them as maybe a $10 investment cost and of course the enjoyment in using them in an army. I expect to sell them for $20 (whenever that date is) to drop that cost. I realize Im not getting full value when I sell my minis, I generally shoot for 60-70 percent of the models current value (assuming the model is still current), some models are generally more in demand than others (typically it comes down to how competitive the model is in game terms, but not always, see Storm Guardians where hardly anyone uses them but they are almost impossible to find even on ebay).  Anyways, I would suspect if I sold my eldar I could probably get around $350 for them. 

[mughi3]

sturguard, 

 

fortunately for me even with the restrictions i am still getting some games in. under normal conditions i run the late night gaming area at the FLGS on saturday nights. so i usually get plenty of play time-hence the number of games i own. between private games and limited store use i am still getting in about 5 hours of game time on saturdays. 

 

Given the painting/building situation i am really liking dust 1947 for both a well written and solid rule set, and the fact if i want to spend a little extra i can buy the models assembled and pro-painted from the company that makes the game and with the option to buy un-assembled kits, assembled ready to play primed kits as well. depending on what you want to spend in time and money. 

The new battletech sets in high grade plastics are also really nice, no assembly just painting and at that scale painting from start to done only takes a few hours. 

 

Find what works for you and your area is the best advice i can give.