librisrouge Posted August 13, 2020 Share Posted August 13, 2020 We apparently have to wait until the marines get updated but it looks like all heavy bolters will be D2 from now onward. This makes their costs in the codex make a LOT more sense. I suddenly find myself wanting to take full heavy bolter leman russ. Punishers with triple heavy bolters make a lot of sense, particularly in a world of 2W marines. Anybody else suddenly revising their feelings toward heavy bolters in 9th edition? duz_ 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
duz_ Posted August 13, 2020 Share Posted August 13, 2020 The D:2 does help stomach the point increase especially in light of 2W Marines across the board Still given their price I'm not sure I'd take them as Sponsons I'm also not sure if I'd switch them from my Hull heavy flamers since they're also going up to 12" Heavy bolter weapon teams sound like fun though librisrouge 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5584642 Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Angel Posted August 13, 2020 Share Posted August 13, 2020 Does this impact the viability of autocannons or will they still hold their spot from the increased strength. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5584672 Share on other sites More sharing options...
duz_ Posted August 13, 2020 Share Posted August 13, 2020 S5 is still a sweet spot for strength however autocannons still have their spot as you said for their strength especially vs medium vehicles and heavy infantry Which I imagine we'll see more Custodes and DG this edition Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5584683 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phubar Posted August 13, 2020 Share Posted August 13, 2020 I dont know if autocannons will be a good choice... the only andvantage that they have is the range as the increased strength is mitigated by one less shot :/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5584833 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Incompetence Posted August 13, 2020 Share Posted August 13, 2020 The D:2 does help stomach the point increase especially in light of 2W Marines across the board Still given their price I'm not sure I'd take them as Sponsons I'm also not sure if I'd switch them from my Hull heavy flamers since they're also going up to 12" Heavy bolter weapon teams sound like fun though I don't know why you're hesitant about the sponsons, but 30 points for 6 S5 2D shots seems like a great investment to me. All they need to do is kill 2 Primaris marines in a game and they've made back their cost and more. That's just 2 unsaved wound rolls. In my opinion the increase in damage makes them crazy good now. Even if you're shooting into T6 or higher vehicles you end up with a 50% chance of causing 2 damage to them with just the sponsons. Warhead01 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5584845 Share on other sites More sharing options...
domsto Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 With D2 on the Heavy Bolter he now is only a little bit overcosted, instead of brutaly overcosted. As the HB was alway a lackluster Weapon to begin with. I still won't use it if i don't have to Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585101 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamansky Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 (edited) GW will have to compensate those 2W marines. And i intentionally am not using 'balance' word in the same sentence with 'GW' in order not to make some old chaos gods pleased or create a new one. That's a 'power creep' we're looking at here. It rarely goes and ends well for everyone. edit: *Tinfoil cap mode on* It may end up as an "Astartes Heavy Bolter" Edited August 14, 2020 by Shamansky tychobi 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585128 Share on other sites More sharing options...
sairence Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 We'll, they already confirmed that all Imperium armies will get the new weapon profiles once the SM codex drops. What I'm more concerned about is less the price of the sponsons, but rather how the new profiles will make it even harder to keep tanks. Yes, slapping on 30p of sponsons sounds a bit better now than it did yesterday, but being shot by the new HBs will take a 6th of its wounds. The new Multimeltaprofile will be able to outright destroy one in one salvo, fairly reliably too in half range, with no inherent defence. Even buffing will only add a thin layer. :-/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585173 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamansky Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 (edited) Ah, yes just found the article. Makes even less sence in taking tanks unless GW will provide some means to keep 'em alive longer than 1 shooting phase. Reminds me of a pre-7th Ed. situation, when one lucky hit could one-shot a Land Raider Edited August 14, 2020 by Shamansky Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585189 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 This is quite a change, I have long used HBs in their role of some heavier anti-personnel but this specialises them. With D2 I won't be aiming that at basic infantry so much now, I'm wondering if they will become one of the main anti-Marine weapons. I'm also wondering what else may be coming, Autocannons may well be changing also! It does make them better in their alternate role of lighter anti-armour, before you could handily plink off wounds but now this is twice as effective. I was using HBs before but I think I might end up using them less... D2 is nice, but it's a bit pricey when I was after anti-infantry stuff. I'll see how things pan out when I start getting games in. Sadly this does make HB HWSs less appealing as they'll only be higher priority targets for this improvement Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585204 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamansky Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 ...Autocannons may well be changing also!.. May be those will get an AP boost or (what seems to be more in current line) D3. Still desperatly want a reason for my Exterminators on the table. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585216 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 I think that would go far, Autocannons have often been foiled by their low AP but I reckon D2 will remain - we shall see as always. I don't think Marines use any standard Autocannons so we may need to wait a bit to find out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585220 Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero88 Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 Slightly off topic but Punishers with Multi Melta sponsons and Spotter Details/Vostroyan is sounding like a nasty combination, even in Melee. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585301 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamansky Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 Slightly off topic but Punishers with Multi Melta sponsons and Spotter Details/Vostroyan is sounding like a nasty combination, even in Melee. it just needs to survive 6 assault multimelta shots from those Salamanders Eradicators Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585307 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Santaclauswitz Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 (edited) I suppose the next question will be what changes would we like to see to our other weapons? The first one that jumps out to me would be the vanquisher. If that gets A2 with the D6+2 at half range then I'd be very happy. The other weapon I'd like to see improved is the lasgun, rapid fire 2 would be awesome though i might need to invest in bigger hands to roll all the dice! Edited August 14, 2020 by Santaclauswitz Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585352 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 The Macador defender got a nice boost with the 2D Heavy Bolters! I have always preferred autto-cannons over Heavy Bolters so this is a delightful change indeed. librisrouge, Ldorte and SteveAntilles 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585355 Share on other sites More sharing options...
zero88 Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 Slightly off topic but Punishers with Multi Melta sponsons and Spotter Details/Vostroyan is sounding like a nasty combination, even in Melee. it just needs to survive 6 assault multimelta shots from those Salamanders Eradicators And D3 AP-2 exploding on 6s Heavy Bolters from Imperial Fists Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585384 Share on other sites More sharing options...
duz_ Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 I don't know why you're hesitant about the sponsons, but 30 points for 6 S5 2D shots seems like a great investment to me. All they need to do is kill 2 Primaris marines in a game and they've made back their cost and more. That's just 2 unsaved wound rolls. In my opinion the increase in damage makes them crazy good now. Even if you're shooting into T6 or higher vehicles you end up with a 50% chance of causing 2 damage to them with just the sponsons. Having played 2 games both hammer and anvil deployment the gap closed extremely quickly Which for LR means they'll be in cc shortly 30 pts seems a lot for a weapon that might only get a round or 2 of full output I'd rather take more toys or as others have pointed out Multi Meltas on my LRs :D Captain Incompetence 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585404 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ldorte Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 The Macador defender got a nice boost with the 2D Heavy Bolters! I have always preferred autto-cannons over Heavy Bolters so this is a delightful change indeed. I have to say having used my Malcador Defender in a match the other day (where it did a pretty big chunk of damage) between the double tapping demo cannon and the ability to fire up to 21 heavy bolter shots with 2 damage it might actually see the table more than twice this edition! Warhead01 and SteveAntilles 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585497 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthWaffle Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 The Macador defender got a nice boost with the 2D Heavy Bolters! I have always preferred autto-cannons over Heavy Bolters so this is a delightful change indeed. I have to say having used my Malcador Defender in a match the other day (where it did a pretty big chunk of damage) between the double tapping demo cannon and the ability to fire up to 21 heavy bolter shots with 2 damage it might actually see the table more than twice this edition! That sounds so spicy! I can't decide between Malcador Annihilator or Defender, but I know I need one or the other :) Ldorte 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585524 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted August 14, 2020 Share Posted August 14, 2020 The Macador defender got a nice boost with the 2D Heavy Bolters! I have always preferred autto-cannons over Heavy Bolters so this is a delightful change indeed. I have to say having used my Malcador Defender in a match the other day (where it did a pretty big chunk of damage) between the double tapping demo cannon and the ability to fire up to 21 heavy bolter shots with 2 damage it might actually see the table more than twice this edition! I'm finding myself with this weird feeling of motivation... Best get mine constructed. Honestly haven't even looked at the points for them yet. Ldorte 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5585580 Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuardDaddy Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 Isn't 12" heavy flamer bigger news? 3 auto hitting? Hit in ovetwatch? Shoot in combat? Warhead01 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5586422 Share on other sites More sharing options...
x01848m Posted August 16, 2020 Share Posted August 16, 2020 I find myself quite torn between putting two Heavy Bolters (2D will be great for killing marines and makes HB a decent back up AT choice) or two Heavy Flamers (especially with Gunnery Experts to re-roll number of shots they become reliable damage dealers) on my Chimeras now. I think there are big benefits to both, so maybe a mix of these two load-outs for a few to sit on back objectives and a few to move forward to midfield objectives. Warhead01 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5586723 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthWaffle Posted August 17, 2020 Share Posted August 17, 2020 (edited) I've seen a few reddit posts with Heavy Bolters being 1 Shot, 2 Damage? Am seeing this wrong or will that just be for Astartes Heavy Bolters. Edited August 17, 2020 by DarthWaffle Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/365908-so-2d-heavy-bolters-are-a-thing-now/#findComment-5587211 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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