Dealing with Eradicators/Aggressors -- Chooser of the Slain

[L30n1d4s]

It seems like in the emerging 9th edition meta that fast moving and/or Outflanking Aggressors, Eradicators, or even Inceptors (notice a theme here... all 3W T5 Gravis Armored troops that put out some powerful shooting) are rapidly becoming one of the number one threats, especially if they can pop up from Reserves and eliminate a key target or two in your army.

 

Outside of really good use of screening, which is hard for Space Wolves (or any Astartes, for that matter,) due to the lack of cheap, expendable skirmishers units (maybe Fenrisian Wolves aside), it is quite difficult to deal with these "pop up" Gravis units. Fortunately, Russ has blessed his sons with a unique ability that separates them from the rest of their Power Armoured brethren.... Rune Priests with the "Chooser of the Slain" Stratagem.

 

As I am sure most are familiar with, Chooser of the Slain lets a unit within 6" of a Rune Priest engage any enemy units that arrive from Reserve, provided that both the RP and the Shooting Unit have LOS/range to the arriving unit. Like the "standard" Space Marine Strat "Auspex Scan," you shoot at -1 to Hit when employing this Strat, but unlike Auspex Scan (which is limited to engaging enemy units arriving within 12"_, THERE IS NO RANGE LIMIT on how far the shooting unit can engage the arriving enemy forces from (except, of course, the range of your shooting weapons)!

 

Why is this important? Because most of these "pop up" Gravis Units have a range of between 18-24", meaning they can arrive outside Auspex Scan range and then obliterate one or more of your most important units (i.e. think a couple of squads of Eradicators with their 24" range Melta Rifles).

 

So, what units pair best with the Rune Priest to engage these enemy Gravis Armor reinforcements? I would argue that an ideal "fire base" for this Strat is Hellblasters with their new profile Assault Plasma Incinerators: Regular -- Assault 3, 24 range, S6 AP-4 Dmg1 or, Overcharged -- Assault 3, 24 range, S7 AP-4 Dmg2.

 

If you do the math, a 10 man Hellblaster squad shooting at enemy Eradicators arriving by Outflank within 24" get 30 shots, about 15 hits, about 10 wounds, no armor saves for the Eradicators resulting in 10 unsaved wounds, or all 3 Eradicators dead BEFORE they even get to shoot their 6 melta shots.

 

Alternately, say your opponent is arriving with a squad of 6 Boltstorm Aggressors... if you Overcharge the Hellblasters, then they get 30 shots, 15 hits, 10 wounds, no enemy armor saves, and about 5 dead Aggressors (since it takes 2 unsaved wounds of 2 dmg each to kill a 3W Aggressor)... basically wiping out all the Aggressors firepower (and close combat ability) before they even attack.... with the loss of 5 models and Ld8, there is a pretty decent chance the last model runs away to morale, even with ATSKNF. Of course, shooting 30 shots there is a good chance of killing your own Hellblasters, so keeping a Wolf Lord nearby to re-rolls 1 (and so reducing your chance of overheating to 3% per shot) is probably a good idea.

 

[TiguriusX]

It seems like in the emerging 9th edition meta that fast moving and/or Outflanking Aggressors, Eradicators, or even Inceptors (notice a theme here... all 3W T5 Gravis Armored troops that put out some powerful shooting) are rapidly becoming one of the number one threats, especially if they can pop up from Reserves and eliminate a key target or two in your army.

 

Outside of really good use of screening, which is hard for Space Wolves (or any Astartes, for that matter,) due to the lack of cheap, expendable skirmishers units (maybe Fenrisian Wolves aside), it is quite difficult to deal with these "pop up" Gravis units. Fortunately, Russ has blessed his sons with a unique ability that separates them from the rest of their Power Armoured brethren.... Rune Priests with the "Chooser of the Slain" Stratagem.

 

As I am sure most are familiar with, Chooser of the Slain lets a unit within 6" of a Rune Priest engage any enemy units that arrive from Reserve, provided that both the RP and the Shooting Unit have LOS/range to the arriving unit. Like the "standard" Space Marine Strat "Auspex Scan," you shoot at -1 to Hit when employing this Strat, but unlike Auspex Scan (which is limited to engaging enemy units arriving within 12"_, THERE IS NO RANGE LIMIT on how far the shooting unit can engage the arriving enemy forces from (except, of course, the range of your shooting weapons)!

 

Why is this important? Because most of these "pop up" Gravis Units have a range of between 18-24", meaning they can arrive outside Auspex Scan range and then obliterate one or more of your most important units (i.e. think a couple of squads of Eradicators with their 24" range Melta Rifles).

 

So, what units pair best with the Rune Priest to engage these enemy Gravis Armor reinforcements? I would argue that an ideal "fire base" for this Strat is Hellblasters with their new profile Assault Plasma Incinerators: Regular -- Assault 3, 24 range, S6 AP-4 Dmg1 or, Overcharged -- Assault 3, 24 range, S7 AP-4 Dmg2.

 

If you do the math, a 10 man Hellblaster squad shooting at enemy Eradicators arriving by Outflank within 24" get 30 shots, about 15 hits, about 10 wounds, no armor saves for the Eradicators resulting in 10 unsaved wounds, or all 3 Eradicators dead BEFORE they even get to shoot their 6 melta shots.

 

Alternately, say your opponent is arriving with a squad of 6 Boltstorm Aggressors... if you Overcharge the Hellblasters, then they get 30 shots, 15 hits, 10 wounds, no enemy armor saves, and about 5 dead Aggressors (since it takes 2 unsaved wounds of 2 dmg each to kill a 3W Aggressor)... basically wiping out all the Aggressors firepower (and close combat ability) before they even attack.... with the loss of 5 models and Ld8, there is a pretty decent chance the last model runs away to morale, even with ATSKNF. Of course, shooting 30 shots there is a good chance of killing your own Hellblasters, so keeping a Wolf Lord nearby to re-rolls 1 (and so reducing your chance of overheating to 3% per shot) is probably a good idea.

 

The "best' option IMO is a Leviathan with dual storm cannons.

 

Same exact range as the Eradicators and more range than Aggressors

 

A single unit is superior to a multi model unit because your opponent can place models to barely reach your closest model while keeping the rest of your guns out of range.

That is not possible against a Leviathan.  If he can shoot the leviathan...the leviathan can return fire

[Dark Shepherd]

Invictors and Executioners best ones for my money. Maybe some heavy bolter long famgs but IMO static firebase units noy great this edition

 

10 man hellblasters going to be hard to hide/keep in cover or alive. Plus blast sturf

[L30n1d4s]

Another good (but expensive) option is a Fire Raptor... lots of LOS, amazing firepower out to 36", even enemy units coming in more than 24" away can be engaged, plus the nearby Rune Priest can use his Tempestus powers to give the Fire Raptor the benefit of cover for a 2+ save.

[NightHowler]

Not entirely off topic I suppose, does the Fire Raptor have a 9th Ed update yet?

[The Saint Ragnar]

FW will be updated eventually, but they haven't as of yet

[CrystalSeer]

 

So, what units pair best with the Rune Priest to engage these enemy Gravis Armor reinforcements? I would argue that an ideal "fire base" for this Strat is Hellblasters with their new profile Assault Plasma Incinerators: Regular -- Assault 3, 24 range, S6 AP-4 Dmg1 or, Overcharged -- Assault 3, 24 range, S7 AP-4 Dmg2.

 

If you do the math, a 10 man Hellblaster squad shooting at enemy Eradicators arriving by Outflank within 24" get 30 shots, about 15 hits, about 10 wounds, no armor saves for the Eradicators resulting in 10 unsaved wounds, or all 3 Eradicators dead BEFORE they even get to shoot their 6 melta shots.

 

Alternately, say your opponent is arriving with a squad of 6 Boltstorm Aggressors... if you Overcharge the Hellblasters, then they get 30 shots, 15 hits, 10 wounds, no enemy armor saves, and about 5 dead Aggressors (since it takes 2 unsaved wounds of 2 dmg each to kill a 3W Aggressor)... basically wiping out all the Aggressors firepower (and close combat ability) before they even attack.... with the loss of 5 models and Ld8, there is a pretty decent chance the last model runs away to morale, even with ATSKNF. Of course, shooting 30 shots there is a good chance of killing your own Hellblasters, so keeping a Wolf Lord nearby to re-rolls 1 (and so reducing your chance of overheating to 3% per shot) is probably a good idea.

 

This is a simple matter of picking the most relevant weapon system for your target. Hellblasters are good against aggressors but are expensive and struggle against certain other targets. I prefer my hellblasters to be in the front using AP 3-4 to dig units out of cover.

 

An easy solution is to pair a couple of units around the priest. Longfangs and intercessors come to mind, so that you can address a variety of threats. This will give you options if the enemy puts armor in strategic reserve.

[Debauchery101]

Fortunately as marines I can fight fire with fire pun intended... also using the MSU approach helps. I have been running lists that basically everything costs almost the same amount of points. I don't run anything over 200 points. Theyre only good shooting vs 1 target. Which you can limit their ambushing/flanking easily with more units. As wolves ive always tried to be semi redundant and play a 1 for 1 game. I just need to get 1 or 2 guys into hth and my points are made up.

 

I've also played the bait game. Yeah ill let you come in on that board side but you're also going to get stuffed with Chooser of the Slain or Auspex scan

 

1 particularly cheap option is using a Land Speeder Tempest for that priests ability. 80 points rng 36 in. hvy 2d3. Str6 ap-3 dmg 2..

[jay170788]

Fortunately as marines I can fight fire with fire pun intended... also using the MSU approach helps. I have been running lists that basically everything costs almost the same amount of points. I don't run anything over 200 points. Theyre only good shooting vs 1 target. Which you can limit their ambushing/flanking easily with more units. As wolves ive always tried to be semi redundant and play a 1 for 1 game. I just need to get 1 or 2 guys into hth and my points are made up.

 

I've also played the bait game. Yeah ill let you come in on that board side but you're also going to get stuffed with Chooser of the Slain or Auspex scan

 

1 particularly cheap option is using a Land Speeder Tempest for that priests ability. 80 points rng 36 in. hvy 2d3. Str6 ap-3 dmg 2..

 

That tempest is cheap but when looking at the maths it doesn't stack up.

 

Heavy 2d3 = 4 shots

4 shots = 2 hits

2 hits = 1.33 wounds

1.33 wounds = 1.11 unsaved wound = 2.22 damage

 

Not worth the CP investment to do 2 wounds to a gravis armoured marine

[FabulousRex]

A wierd idea I've thought about is using Eliminators with Las as an anti tank unit. Supported by a Phobos RP casting Soul Sight to reroll all hits and ignore cover for a turn, 3 las fusil shots are pretty decent for their points against tanks, but could also do well against Gravis with the flat 3 damage.