So what's left for Primaris after this year?

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

Okay, keeping in mind we still don't know for sure what the "Veteran Intercessor Squad" in the codex is, aside from being an Elites choice...

 

After 2020, what's really left to make the Primaris range feel like a complete army that someone who runs an Ultima Founding chapter can look at as not having any obvious gaps in its ranks?

 

We'll have fifteen squads as of this fall and I don't see the range getting a whole lot bigger in terms of infantry. Vehicles, characters and such - yeah, I don't think they'll EVER stop adding to the Primaris line with those. But as for big release waves, I think next year will be the last one. That will put us at around twenty options just for squads. Even with Primaris tending to be highly specialized, that's about as many different squad kits as I can see GW putting out for one faction.

 

Up front of course, there's the obvious: We are nowhere near to seeing all the various characters in different armor permutations. Surely we will EVENTUALLY see a nearly-full set of characters in Gravis, on bikes, and jump-enabled. But that looks to be something that GW's going to spread out over a much longer period than they will the introduction of the rank and file. And of course some characters will probably never get certain armor options: a Chaplain running around and barking litanies in Phobos armor doesn't make a lot of sense and in fact if they don't plan on giving us any more Phobos characters I wouldn't be surprised. I am also not expecting a Judiciar model in any other armor type.

 

But beyond that...

 

Jumpy Assault Marines: Like others have suggested, I think there'll be a multi-build option with the inevitable Suppressors MPK squad offering for shorter-ranged weapons at a reduced per-model cost. BUT I don't think those will be the melee dudes. I think the Suppressor/whoever squad will still come in a three-man kit with a max of six models per unit as with the Inceptors. As for the melee guys...

 

Jumpy Phobos Marines: I just don't think that Shrike look was intended to only ever be used by that one model (or even a squad specific to the Raven Guard). I think a typical 5-10 man squad of jumpy Phobos guys will be running wild with melee weapons this time next year. And unless they're cost-prohibitive, they may make the time of the Assault Intercessor brief but glorious.

 

Terminator-EQ: Other than jumpy dudes, I still think we haven't seen the Primaris equivalent of the classic TH+SS Terminator squad. It's possible that's what the Veteran Intercessor squad will be. But if not I think we'll still see that (and it would be the perfect squad to hold back until the final large release wave).

 

Centurion-EQ: Yep, I think Primaris "Centurions" will be a thing. MAYBE they will combine these with my next prediction, maybe not. If not, then this will be a new armor tougher than Gravis and will be the only armor type that doesn't have a jump variant (I consider Omnis to be a Tacticus variant). Call it "Hordebuster" armor for now.

 

Warsuits: I think we see one more of these, probably with a Tacticus operator. Tougher and punchier but costlier than the Invictor. Technically not a "squad" unit but close enough.

 

Clearly there are still a lot of vehicle options (more Dreads, Drop Pods, flying transports and gunships/interceptors, a turretless Repulsor, more Forge World goodies like the Overlord). And I mentioned the characters will continue to dribble out, but I think the above would pretty well cover it as far as squad units go. I don't expect Primaris variants of EVERY currently-available unit - I don't see a Phobos Scout Bike Squad happening, for instance.

 

What do you guys think - did I miss anything?

[WrathOfTheLion]

Definitely see jump assault, not certain if they will be in tacticus or not.

 

I think aggressors are meant to be the centurion equivalent. Centurions were them trying to throw things at the wall to see what stuck to get marine players to buy more models. What they really needed to do was a refresh like they are now.

 

For terminator equivalent, I actually think they might just keep terminators and update the kit/options, with something for Primaris using them. The new SW supplement has terminators on the cover, makes you wonder if they will do a new wolf guard terminator kit.

 

I don't really see another warsuit, but a venerable dreadnought sort of equivalent perhaps. Something like DA Deathwing would need this. Redemptors won't cut it unless they retcon them, as they burn out their pilots quite quickly. I always thought that was a bit stupid, so perhaps they just scrub that part.

 

Don't know about FW doing the overlord, I think FW is moving entirely to HH and the specialist games it produces. They could one-off do an overlord, but I wouldn't expect FW primaris releases when they can barely handle the games they actually are obligated to support.

 

There are some chapter specific things that would be needed. For example, DA will need Primaris bike HQs for Ravenwing to allow for an ultima founding unforgiven chapter. I think we can reason some gaps there might be filled this year/next year with the supplement releases.

Edited September 17, 2020 by WrathOfTheLion

[Shinespider]

I agree that upsized Terminators are inevitable at some point. Aggressors are close, but they don't have the basic silhouette, and the Terminator "look" is nearly as iconic as the regular SM "look." That's not something they're going to leave behind. 

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

Definitely see jump assault, not certain if they will be in tacticus or not.

 

I think aggressors are meant to be the centurion equivalent. Centurions were them trying to throw things at the wall to see what stuck to get marine players to buy more models. What they really needed to do was a refresh like they are now.

 

Could definitely be the case - I tend to forget how late in the game Centurions were produced.

 

 

I don't really see another warsuit, but a venerable dreadnought sort of equivalent perhaps. Something like DA Deathwing would need this. Redemptors won't cut it unless they retcon them, as they burn out their pilots quite quickly. I always thought that was a bit stupid, so perhaps they just scrub that part.

 

Yep - only thing I can figure is that it was actually introduced as a "What the Hell" bit of fluff since they figured Venerable Primaris Dreads would be kind of an oxymoron given the setting's timeline only covering the century-plus-change after the Primaris introduction. So as long as they weren't going to do Venerable Redemptors, they might as well throw in a grimdark reasoning as to why there would NEVER be such a thing.

 

 

Don't know about FW doing the overlord, I think FW is moving entirely to HH and the specialist games it produces. They could one-off do an overlord, but I wouldn't expect FW primaris releases when they can barely handle the games they actually are obligated to support.

 

There are some chapter specific things that would be needed. For example, DA will need Primaris bike HQs for Ravenwing to allow for an ultima founding unforgiven chapter. I think we can reason some gaps there might be filled this year/next year with the supplement releases.

 

Only reason I still think an Overlord could happen is that Guy Haley's description of it has been surprisingly detailed and consistent (I was corrected on the latter part a while back as I thought the Avenging Son novel's description clashed with The Great Work's, but they do actually fit together). I know it's not overwhelming evidence, but it does suggest to me that he's working from a refined design scheme.

 

And yeah, I forgot to mention that I'm sure they'll shift to producing chapter-specific squads after next year, along with continuing to put out chapter-agnostic characters and vehicles.

Edited September 17, 2020 by Lord Nord

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

I agree that upsized Terminators are inevitable at some point. Aggressors are close, but they don't have the basic silhouette, and the Terminator "look" is nearly as iconic as the regular SM "look." That's not something they're going to leave behind. 

 

I may prefer this to a heavier grade of Cawl-pattern armor, although it would be weird to have Primaris walking around in anything but a flavor of Mark X. Terminator armor is just a brand of cool that I don't think Gravis or Gravis-Plus could ever be. And again it would make sense as something they'd hold off on introducing until the last big wave of the Primaris range.

[Boldthreat]

For me:

 

Overlord. I don’t even need a model. Just show me what it looks like. It’s been described so vividly that I just want to see it with my own eyes lol.

 

Primaris Terminators - I go back and forth on if these could be a thing or not. If you took a Heavy Intercessor, gave him a double barreled Assault bolter and a power fist... it would be pretty damned close... but realistically we have Aggressors. All I know is that Terminators have a distinct visual flavor to them, and I would be shocked if we didn’t get a Primaris version. A future space hulk release just wouldn’t feel right if the Deathwing were all in Gravis armor... visually.

 

Hellfurries - I didn’t forget! Where are these guys? The way they were mentioned, the implication was that they were Gravis armored heavy support troops. With Hell being in the name, similar to Hellblasters... my assumption is they are plasma Gravis troops... maybe equivalent to the Heavy Intercessors and their relationship to Intercessors?

 

Multi Kit Suppressors - we never got a box of these guys. I like them and I was hoping for more weapon options as well. Right now they kind of feel forgotten.

 

Various character kits - Lts, Ancients, Captains in various armor and setups.

 

If we got the above I would be pretty content.

[Red_Shift]

Primaris terminators are a given. Basically a true scale remodelling with more options would be my preference. I have always loved assault cannon and cyclone missile launchers!

 

Heavy and siege dreadnoughts would be cool and I'm kind of surprised that one hasn't been released this time around. I've been hoping for a knight sized sm dreadnought just because it would be cool.

 

The grey knights haven't made the primaris transition yet and I think an anti daemon release like the sacrosanct chamber of stormcast would make sense. Could bring back all the old ranks of librarian with say small units of codiciers.

[Jacques Corbin]

Primaris Thunderfire Cannon!!!

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

Hellfurries - I didn’t forget! Where are these guys? The way they were mentioned, the implication was that they were Gravis armored heavy support troops. With Hell being in the name, similar to Hellblasters... my assumption is they are plasma Gravis troops... maybe equivalent to the Heavy Intercessors and their relationship to Intercessors?

 

My bet is that "Hellfuries" was simply the work-in-progress name for the Eradicators. Not a code-name - I'm sure they absolutely intended for it to be the squad's final name when that was written, but for whatever reason they decided to change it after the Ultramarines supplement went to print.

 

Could be wrong, but if there isn't a Hellfury squad announced next year, I'd feel pretty safe saying that's what happened.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

Primaris Thunderfire Cannon!!!

 

Indeed - I have to think one of those will be in the lineup for next year.

[Marshal Reinhard]

I keep flip flopping on wether Primaris Terminators could be a thing or not. I just don't know one way or the other anymore

 

On the one hand it seems pretty clear that Gravis was, at least initially, intended to be the Primaris equivalent of Terminator armor. Big and bulky, take up 2 spots in a transport, which they can only ride in the bigger heavier versions. They even had a hood that encapsulated the head, even though it made little sense outside of Inceptors and arguably stormbolter aggressors.

The design was initially recieved rather lukewarm with the aforementioned hood and also lack of a proper belt complained about the most. Does any think its a coincidence that every single Gravis release since (Calgar onwards) has toned down the hood a lot as well has all had proper belts, cuz I certainly don't

 

On the other, we're now getting Gravis troops, which means we got some in every category, HQ, Elites, Troops, Fast Attack and Heavy support. It's a pattern more diversified than the previous Phobos armor. So even though they're clearly the 'heavy marine equivalent', they're very clearly different in both function and roles to terminator armor. Could this mean we're eventually in for a Super heavy elite only armor variant, that will sport that 2+ save? I just don't know anymore.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

New scouts!

[Subtleknife]

For terminators I just want an upscale version with the shoulders not on their ears.

 

I would like a drop pod or just be able to use the existing one.

 

I would also like some jump pack troops with assault weapons.

[Sergeant Centurion]

Impulsor/repulsor variant whit demolisher cannon or whirlwind missile launcher.

Stand alone Ancient.
Multipart kits for actual units like Supressors.

[Doghouse]

I think the only way you'll see Primaris Terminators is if they phase out firstborn altogether but want to maintain the silloutte of them in a new updated model perhaps with a new Space Hulk or something. I personally think for all intents and purposes Gravis is their terminator armour. An even heavier version doesn't make much sense to me.

 

It's hard to say what else they do need, maybe some jump assault Intercessors? Marines are spoiled for choice now as it is. What I'd personally like to see more is a rescale of existing Firstborn models.

 

It still feels like the faction is in flux and the moment to mw, as if there has been an unexpected course correction which is making it hard to know where it's going as an army. 

[Boldthreat]

 

 

Hellfurries - I didn’t forget! Where are these guys? The way they were mentioned, the implication was that they were Gravis armored heavy support troops. With Hell being in the name, similar to Hellblasters... my assumption is they are plasma Gravis troops... maybe equivalent to the Heavy Intercessors and their relationship to Intercessors?

My bet is that "Hellfuries" was simply the work-in-progress name for the Eradicators. Not a code-name - I'm sure they absolutely intended for it to be the squad's final name when that was written, but for whatever reason they decided to change it after the Ultramarines supplement went to print.

 

Could be wrong, but if there isn't a Hellfury squad announced next year, I'd feel pretty safe saying that's what happened.

I have contemplated the same. You could be right.

[War Angel]

Impulsor/repulsor variant whit demolisher cannon or whirlwind missile launcher.

Stand alone Ancient.

Multipart kits for actual units like Supressors.

The tanks would likely be the gladiator chasi, though they could have decided that Marines don’t get artillery anymore.

 

Suppressors.... where the hell are they? I wonder if GW saw too much hate online and decided not to make a srandalone kit for them because it could possibly not make profits?

[WrathOfTheLion]

Perhaps. It is possible suppressors are being reworked.

 

I am not a big fan of the grav boots in general, but it is worst on the inceptor, which looks like it has clown shoes with its proportions. I think just as gravis has made some design changes since aggressors, we may see some design changes there as well.

Edited September 18, 2020 by WrathOfTheLion

[Marshal Reinhard]

Supressors being held back to get a bit of rework and then released alongside a bigger omnis pattern release doesn't seem unlikely to me. 

 

We see omnis pattern helmets on the speeder crew, so the design isn't forgotten. Put perhaps a multipart surpressor will have a bit more visible thrusters and such, which i think was the main complaint with them. Wouldn't be surprised.

[War Angel]

How many more “waves” can we get? Primaris is a new line (well, was a new line) so it has/had a lot of gaps that needed filling, so I don’t mind us getting a lot of attention to fix that, but the whining from people complaining that they aren’t getting anything when it’s our codex dropping is becoming very tiresome, some more Xenos releases might stop that? Or maybe they just cry anyway.

[Marshal Reinhard]

The crying of xenos players is one of the few constants in the universe.

 

That said, other than an Omnis wave, what else is there? Personally I think an Omnis wave, if there even is one, will be small, and focused to 'airborne' units? So maybe a few 'jumppack units', maybe they're crew to some flyer vehicles and that's it?

[War Angel]

The crying of xenos players is one of the few constants in the universe.

 

That said, other than an Omnis wave, what else is there? Personally I think an Omnis wave, if there even is one, will be small, and focused to 'airborne' units? So maybe a few 'jumppack units', maybe they're crew to some flyer vehicles and that's it?

Other than that, are the other armors complete?

 

We currently only have one veteran unit (bladeguard) so is there more first company models?

[TheNewman]

I don't think Primaris need any new models at all, fix Reivers properly and they have all the tools.

 

Make the Grapnels, Grav-shute, Combat Knife, Heavy Pistol, Bolt Carbine, and grenades their standard kit, and bump them to a 10" move. Justify it with them using the Grapnels and Shute to make short hops.* Add proper melee weapons to the Sergeant, and now Primaris have the fast melee troop slot covered.

 

* - I'll admit that's a tad silly, but if it's good enough for Spiderman it's good enough for us.

Edited September 18, 2020 by TheNewman

[WrathOfTheLion]

I think they will just cry anyways. A whole xenos line is being refreshed at the same time, and I personally expect to see a minor update to one this edition, perhaps the other half of orks or the older eldar stuff.

 

I think any remaining waves will be small, probably just a flyer and some jump pack units.

 

On even our side, the whole thing where books are invalidated so quickly while they roll the range out is not good. One could hope the codex would stabilize at some point.

[TheNewman]

Impulsor/repulsor variant whit demolisher cannon or whirlwind missile launcher.

The Gladiator Valiant is more than covering the Demolisher's niche, I'll take S8/9 Ap4/3 Dd6+2/Dd6 and always getting six shots over S10 Ap3 Dd6 d6 shots with Blast any day of the week.

 

I'll grant that a Whirlwind equivalent would be nice, but I shudder a bit at the likely points cost.

Edited September 18, 2020 by TheNewman