Other Games Workshop "Hobby" Games

[Brother Tyler]

Games Workshop has produced quite a few games over the years. This site was originally created to support players of the various Space Marine factions in the Warhammer 40,000 game. Over the years, the scope of the site has increased to our present scope, which is the entire range of games set in the Warhammer 40,000 setting.

 

Our site structure has evolved over the years, growing to include (sub-)forums for each of the (sub-)factions that we cover. Among the many things that the admins are looking into now (as we lean into the software upgrade and server migration - not happening as soon as we'd like, but probably happening before Codex: Squats ) is whether or not our site structure adequately supports the range of games that take place in the Warhammer 40,000 setting.

 

Our focus in this is somewhat narrow (for now), looking at what I call the "hobby" games. These are all in the tabletop miniature wargames category, as opposed to the electronic, roleplaying, and board games. These include the following games (links go to the game pages at Board Game Geek):

• Battlefleet Gothic (and its predecessor, Space Fleet)
• Epic (as well as Epic Armageddon)
• Gorkamorka (it might be argued that Warhammer 40,000: Speed Freeks was a reimplementation of this game)
• Inquisitor
• Shadow War: Armageddon

Games like Space Hulk, Gangs of Commorragh, and Warhammer Quest: Blackstone Fortress aren't part of this discussion because they're more limited boardgames. Similarly, we're not looking at any of the electronic games or roleplaying games right now. We'll get around to all of these games later. Similarly, we're not talking about any of the homegrown alternatives such as Inquisimunda.

 

We've seen a number of recent games that are updated version of old GW "hobby" games. These include all of those for which we currently have sub-forums of the Other Games forum (Adeptus Titanicus, Aeronautica Imperialis, Kill Team, Necromunda). Without getting into wish-listing, many of us would like to see some of the other games that I've named being brought back by Games Workshop. This discussion isn't about whether or not individuals would like to see Games Workshop bring any of these games back. Instead. we're looking at how well the Bolter & Chainsword provides structure for hobbyists to discuss these games.

 

Several of these games receive a degree of coverage at other excellent websites. For example, Necromunda is the focus of Yaktribe.com (though that site also provides files for a number of the other games we're discussing here), Specialist Arms is the inheritor of the Specialist Games forums and provides files for all of the old Specialist Games, and The Conclave is an excellent resource for players of the Inquisitor game. If you are a fan of any of these games, I highly recommend that you check out these sites and any others that are out there. Ultimately, the B&C isn't in competition with these sites. Rather, our role is to complement these sites.

 

The feedback we're looking for at this point is whether or not you think that our current structure is adequate for your needs/desires insofar as these games are concerned. All of the "hobby" games listed above are currently covered under the general "Other Games" forum rather than in their own dedicated sub-forums. In theory, the proper use of tags will help to identify discussions about each of these games (e.g., we recommend that tags that I've used in this discussion).

 

In addition, we're conducting a little survey to gauge interest in these games, either past, present, or future.

 

All of the input, both text replies below and survey responses, will inform decisions we make about site structure. If little or not interest is expressed, we might maintain status quo. Alternately, if sufficient interest is expressed and a number of other factors come into play (larger technical things that I won't bore you with), we might provide more direct support for some or all of these games.

[Joe]

There's, uh, a fatal flaw in the last poll multi-choice - there's no "none" or "N/A" option.

 

Like, I don't play Gorkamorka, and I have no interest in playing it.

[Brother Tyler]

Ah, good catch. I've fixed them.

[Fajita Fan]

BFG is still played all over the world and there’s tons of simplified 3D models out there to print OOP and unsupported ships. Ork players can always just drip glue in their bits box and come out with their ships :lol:

[tangoalphatwo]

I would love a dedicated Necromunda Sub. No offense to yak tribe but I love this forum. That said, I honestly don’t know if there are enough people into Munda to justify a sub forum.

[Brother Tyler]

I would love a dedicated Necromunda Sub. No offense to yak tribe but I love this forum. That said, I honestly don’t know if there are enough people into Munda to justify a sub forum.

We have a dedicated Necromunda: Underhive sub-forum. 

[Brother Tyler]

Some thoughts after this poll has been running for a bit...

Battlefleet Gothic is probably the only game that I can see Games Workshop revisiting in the future. We're already discussing that in this topic, so I won't dwell on it further in this discussion.

I doubt that Games Workshop will revisit any of the other games. Epic [Armageddon] uses a different scale of miniatures, so Games Workshop would have to align too much in terms of resources in order to bring the game back. What GW has done is utilize that scale for bigger things - Adeptus Titanicus and Aeronautica Imperialis. These are games that use models of a size that playing them using 28-32mm miniatures is impractical. I think that GW has shifted the larger scale of battles that Epic [Armageddon] represented into Apocalypse. Gorkamorka was revisited as Speed Freeks, becoming more of a board game. If GW were to revisit any of these games (other than BFG), this would be the easiest. While there is a thriving Inquisimunda/INQ28 community, I doubt that Games Workshop has the appetite to revisit Inquisitor at the 54mm scale. In addition, the complexity of the rules is far beyond what I think GW wants to use. If they were to revisit this game, I think it would be as an expansion to/adaptation of Kill Team. Shadow War: Armageddon is dead. It was a 7th edition version of Kill Team, using the old Necromunda rules. Games Workshop has moved on from these rules. The squad/warband level skirmish wargame that this represented has been replaced by Kill Team.

The reason I posted this poll was to gauge interest in these games and to determine if our current site structure is sufficient to support the community's interest in these games. If there were sufficient interest in these games, we might create sub-forums for them, as we've done with the current crop of games (Adeptus Titanicus: The Horus Heresy, Warhammer 40,000: Kill Team, etc.). Judging by the feedback so far and the trends of discussions, none of these games needs its own sub-forum - we can continue with the current method of discussing them in the main Other Games forum using the appropriate tags (recommended tags for each of these games, and all of the other games set in the Warhammer 40,000 universe, are provided in the Other Games Resources topic).

Some side issues that haven't been settled, however, are whether or not our current Downloads and Galleries categories are sufficient for these games. For example, would it be easier for members to find files for Battlefleet Gothic if we created a "Battlefleet Gothic" (or similar) category in the Downloads section?

Something else this brings up is whether or not the B&C should host the vast range of files that are currently hosted at other sites. I've avoided doing this so far for two reasons. First, I don't know if it's "legal" to do this. Specialist Arms was given permission to continue hosting the files that they have. If that permission was necessary in the first place, I don't want to expose the B&C to risk by violating whatever legitimate restrictions there may be. Second is courtesy - it would be rude to just poach these files from these other sites (although it looks like there are files that are common to multiple sites, which makes me wonder as to their exclusivity). The main sites I'm talking about are the Conclave (for Inquisitor), Specialist Arms, and Yaktribe, though there are some others. For now, I'd rather link to these sites and help them out by directing interested hobbyists to them so that they can stay healthy. My long term concern, though, is if these sites die off. All of them seem pretty slow compared to us, but they really only cover niche portions of the hobby, so that's to be expected. It would be a shame if these files were to become unavailable to hobbyists because of the death of the sites that host them. From a long term perspective, assuming the B&C can continue to thrive, I would want to see those files continue to remain available. What I might do is contact the owners of those sites to see if they approve of us hosting the files, either upon the demise of their sites or earlier (whatever they're comfortable with).

 

Another issue to consider is the aggregate size of these files and their impact on our server/database. Even if we host the files, that won't happen until after the software update and server migration.

 

So much of this is preparatory for some time next year.

 

I'm interested in others' thoughts on whether or not we can better support these games here at the B&C. Also, I didn't include the Blackstone Fortress game and many others, but I'm interested in your thoughts on all of the "other" games set in the Warhammer 40,000 universe and how we can support them.

[Brother Tyler]

Another note for those of you that indicated that you are interested in any of the games in the poll...

 

If you don't have the rules for these games, all of them except for Shadow War: Armageddon have robust online support. Check the resources topic linked above. You can find the rulebooks, expansions, and a large number of articles that were published by GW in various publications and online. You can also find a lot of homegrown rules and continuing support for these games in living rulebooks and community rules (subsequent to GW dropping these games). The main trick with most will be getting the models, but 3D printing has mitigated that problem.

 

As for Shadow War: Armageddon, it's recent enough that you can still find it online and at some local game stores. If you really want to play it, but can't find it, consider downloading the 2nd edition Necromunda rules and look for the files with the rules with each of the factions (I think most of those are available online at the sites I've linked). Some tweaks will be necessary, but that method should get you in the ballpark.