Terminators - patterns and legions

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

So over the course of many years I've stockpiled a number of patterns of terminators, so I was wondering the best patterns to match to the legions I play.

 

I've already got 10 indomitus for the iron fourth, a squad of 5 justaerin for the SoH, and 5 cataphractii for the imperial fists.

 

I'm looking at 10 cataphractii for for the Sons, Im assuming that they had regular termies as well as justaerin?

 

So with all that in mind, are there any patterns that go better with the above legions more than others?

 

I'm also looking at some small forces of Iron Hands, Word bearers, and blood angels. So if my stockpile stretches that far I'd appreciate the same question applied to them

[TheCelticRaven]

So over the course of many years I've stockpiled a number of patterns of terminators, so I was wondering the best patterns to match to the legions I play.

 

I've already got 10 indomitus for the iron fourth, a squad of 5 justaerin for the SoH, and 5 cataphractii for the imperial fists.

 

I'm looking at 10 cataphractii for for the Sons, Im assuming that they had regular termies as well as justaerin?

 

So with all that in mind, are there any patterns that go better with the above legions more than others?

 

I'm also looking at some small forces of Iron Hands, Word bearers, and blood angels. So if my stockpile stretches that far I'd appreciate the same question applied to them

To answer your questions in order

Yes they had other terminators

I'd say Tartaros is better for Sons of Horus, as it was the most advanced and Horus kept his legion well stocked with the latest gear,

Iron hands have their own Gorgon Terminators, which are hella pretty IMO

I'd go for Tartaros on the Word Bearers as they were one of the original traitors and therefore often well supplied by Horus as well Tartaros terminators have a lotta space for geometric designs and scripture.

Finally Blood Angels have their own special Terminators, The Crimson Paladins, but they are a touch naff rules wise even though they are pretty models, i'd personally go for a Tartaros squad for them as well.

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Cheers for the the response, so what about the cataphractii and indomitus patterns I have knocking around?

 

Or are you going to suggest taking them off my hands as a favour ;)

[Fenbain]

Indomitus was significantly more prevalent in the Imperial Fists, so I'd use them there and use the Cataphractii in the Iron Warriors (which was their preference).

 

SoH did indeed have non-Justaerin/non-First Company Terminators.

 

Iron Hands also made slightly more use of Indomitus than your average Legion (I believe the Gorgon TDA was based on the early prototype plans for Indomitus, though could be wrong there).

 

I think WB look best in Cataphractii personally, but they would have access to other types so up to your personal preference. They're getting a model for a WB Praetor in Tartaros TDA for what it is worth.

 

BA look great in everything and don't have a preference in the fluff that I'm aware of.

[Atia]

Cheers for the the response, so what about the cataphractii and indomitus patterns I have knocking around?

 

Or are you going to suggest taking them off my hands as a favour

 

Blood Angels and Imperial Fists both used a lot of Indomitus iirc :)

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Great responses guys and I really appreciate it.

 

Would there be any rules reasons to take one pattern over another with those legions?

 

Thanks

[Vykes]

Aye, I'd just chime in and more or less say what already was said as a 'hear-hear' sort of thing 

 

There's also nothing wrong with mixing and matching different sets of terminator armour inside the legions themselves so long as you think it makes sense and works with the aesthetic.  It's kinda common to look at the legion-specific terminators and then extrapolate a bit from there (though common, and even 'rules wise' some work far better, it's not always the case that the patterns make sense.  Ex: the Ebony Keshig of the White Scars have the more advanced Tartaros plate, but the legion tended to be under-equipped with the newest latest-and-greatest from Mars due to their far-flung operations, and were noted for not using Termiantor plate for much in general.)  So, while it's true, some legions definitely had a preference or supply of certain types of armour, it's not exactly a rule so much as a guideline of course.  But, lets get on to a bit more, eh? 

 

Sons of Horus had quite a few terminators (even in the older BL stuff, Loken's 10th company had a terminator squad), and patterns are likely mixed and matched here and there.  Horus was an early advocate of the Terminator program and his legion was exceptionally well supplied.  Unsurprisingly, it means he'd have a mixture of the older sets of Cataphractii plate in reserve and likely non-premier companies, as well as a large number of the much more advanced Tartaros plate in his arsenal.  More over, we've seen images of ships guards from the Vengeful Spirit using Tartaros plate, and Justaerian have their own warplate that is closer to a nice mix of Cataphractii and Tartaros plate. 

 

The 4th legion did tend to use Cataphractii plate more than the other patterns and seemed well equipped (though there's always the question of the often dispersed deployment patterns, especially at the end of the Heresy where supply lines were cut or significantly thinned).  But, given they are something of a well stocked heavy equipment legion as well, they would likely have access to most types of terminator plate (though their Siege Tyrants have slightly altered Cataphractii plate as a basis).  

 

Ah, the 7th, Imperial Fists.  yeah, they tended to be one of the 'Indomitus' plate users.  If memory serves, their Huscarl unit was also made up of Indomitus plate, but we haven't seen that brought out as a model.  More over, I'm pretty sure they can have both assault cannons and shields, making them look relatively 'modern' in comparison to some other legions.  (Or at least, more at home in the 41st millennium comparatively)

 

Blood Angels are kinda another interesting group: we typically see their terminators as the faster Tartaros plate, but their Crimson Paladins use Cataphractii as a base.  More over, they were deployed to Signus, and hadn't gained widespread materiel supports in the early portion of the heresy, leading to some of their equipment being a little more 'antiquated' compared to Horus's legions.  As such, when they did get more supplies late in the heresy, they ended up adopting more of the Intomidus as well as, eventually, mk VI Corvus 'beaky' plate in the battle of Terra.  I haven't kept up with everything in the history books, so it's very much just 'what I remember being a thing, once upon a time.' 

 

Iron Tenth, the Iron Hands.  Big time tecchy group, Gorgons being the only specialist terminators based on the Indomitus plate, I'd say you could probably add them as another group where all of the above patterns would fit in comfortably. 

 

World Bearers, the less-than-illustrious but oh-so-illuminated 17th.  This is another one of those odd things where it partially hinges on what you think of the aesthetics.  On one hand, they were one of the original traitor legions, and fairly well equipped so Tartaros makes sense.  More over, big broad plates means nice spots for scripture and special memorae pieces.  But, they also end up having that 'baroque' look, and thus the trim and decorations of Cataphractii plate as well as something as simple as talons looking 'eeeeeevil' can make that a tempting prospect in some aesthetics as well.  

 

I don't think there's a hard and fast rule for any of those legions, and some may well depend on the time periods in which you want to place them.

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Cheers guys the responses have been excellent.

 

Sounds like the fists are getting indomitus, do the FW storm shields fit indomitus?

 

The sons of Horus will get that 10 man green cataphractii then.

 

How many terminator squads (5 or 10 man) should each force have? I ask because while I could happily give a legion 30+ terminators, how often would they actually see combat?

 

For reference I have 5+ boxes each of calth and prospero, and just as many sets of indomitus, and I'm currently the only one in my circle of friends that has the HH bug, so I'm trying to have a spread of legions to tempt people into games with me

[Vykes]

I thiiiink the catii shields fit Indomitus with a bit of work.  But, then again, every conversion can see it through with 'a bit of work'.  A fair number of the 7th legion players around here (3 of them that play Fists primarily) generally use left over Custodes shields with their terminators given how ubiquitous they are in the communities. 

 

As for Terminator Squads and how often you use them... that's up to you and how dedicated you want to be .  Again, I'm an awful person to base any sort of 'restraint based collection' off of as I have 35 Tartaros (including a command Squad), 5 Cataphractii (10 more on the work bench), and 10 Justaerin for my SoH and use them intermittently en masse as I'm allowed to.  

 

With so many models up in the air, it really is one of those 'sit down and plan' sorts of things on what themes or motifs you want to give each force.  A large number of terminators, for instance, may well appeal to certain plays in your community who wouldn't look at it the same as if there was just the obligatory squad mixed in to a 'standard' force.  

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

Also, if you're looking for an excuse to give the Iron Hands Cataphractii, Ferrus was its original designer, and in terms of rules synergy their higher invulnerable save pairs very well with the Iron Hands -1 to the Strength of incoming ranged attacks to make them even tougher.

 

Also here's a little snippet from the Gorgon Terminators' background which might be useful:

 

"It is an interesting case in point that while several thousand suits of Terminator Armour in the most common Tartaros, Cataphractii and Indomitus Patterns were in service with the Legion (many of which were concentrated in the hands of the doomed warriors of the Avernii Clan and lost at Istvaan V), the Primarch himself was known to not be entirely satisfied with the performance of any of these designs and so a full issue to his Legion of these patterns was never approved."

Edited September 23, 2020 by Iron Hands Fanatic

[Robbienw]

I really wish FW would do a plain 30k legion version of Indomitus armour.

[Elzender]

For what it is worth, the Imperial Fists are noted in their Black Book as being heavy users of terminator armour, so any pattern would likely fit lore-wise for them.

 

Regarding using the cataphractii shields on indomitus terminators, the shields are separate from the arms. If you have assault terminators, it should not be too difficult to do the conversion, although you would need to get the hands to hold the shield from somewhere. There are two main options: either carving/casting them from the original plastic shields, or cutting the hand off the resin arms from the shield upgrade kit and grafting them to the plastic arms.

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

See I was looking potentially at using those custodes shields for fists breachers/phalanx warders.

 

Haha well I'll bear in mind your stance on things then vykes ;)

 

You're right of course, I should plan my armies, and this is probably the start of that, getting a feel for where some of those models should sit.

 

Fanatic, that makes it sound like Gorgon pattern or nothing if you're part of the iron tenth! While I do love the models, my wallet says differently ;)

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

I mean, it still says they had several *thousand* of each of the other patterns across the Legion, and the Iron Hands were known to have extensive reserves of wargear, no doubt including Terminator plate, and both the Iron Father mini and their special character Autek Mor are wearing Cataphractii plate - also I checked and apparently they were also the originators of Indomitus TDA too, so even more of an excuse.

 

Plus look at the great art of Iron Hands Cataphractii & Tartaros from Massacre:

 

[Fenbain]

Also, if you're looking for an excuse to give the Iron Hands Cataphractii, Ferrus was its original designer

Do you have a source on that so I can read up on it? :-) I don't recall seeing that and it seems at odds with what I thought I had read.

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

 

Also, if you're looking for an excuse to give the Iron Hands Cataphractii, Ferrus was its original designer

Do you have a source on that so I can read up on it? :-) I don't recall seeing that and it seems at odds with what I thought I had read.

 

 

It's under the 'Medusan Carapace' in his unit profile (the lore that indicates the X^th developed Indomitus is in their Organisation section in Massacre too).

[Fenbain]

It's under the 'Medusan Carapace' in his unit profile (the lore that indicates the X^th developed Indomitus is in their Organisation section in Massacre too).

Thanks :-) I had completely forgotten about that. Seems to read that he came up with a lot of the tech and concepts behind the design (and many others), rather than explicitly designing it. I could be misinterpreting that though and it is only a minor difference in the end.

 

Anyways, time to reread Massacre in full!

[Iron Hands Fanatic]

 

It's under the 'Medusan Carapace' in his unit profile (the lore that indicates the X^th developed Indomitus is in their Organisation section in Massacre too).

Thanks :-) I had completely forgotten about that. Seems to read that he came up with a lot of the tech and concepts behind the design (and many others), rather than explicitly designing it. I could be misinterpreting that though and it is only a minor difference in the end.

 

Anyways, time to reread Massacre in full!

 

 

I do seem to remember the Cataphractii Primus relic armour available to the Sons of Horus referring to the pattern being developed from suits used in plasma reactors, so it's probably a developed into usable wargear kinda deal.