Worrying development with the new codex

[Black Knight]

There is a "leaked" list of questions to do with the new codex and it says that there is no mention of SIA. I would guess it will be added in our supplement but how long from the release of the codex to the supplement will we be stripped of the very thing that makes us Deathwatch.

 

We are going to loose SIA for a few months and our bike squads. This is going to be rough.

Edited October 1, 2020 by Black_Knight

[Snazzy]

I wouldn't worry too much.  SIA has been a defining feature of the Deathwatch going back to at least 3rd edition.

[Debauchery101]

We've been playing that all indomitus units that have weapons listed in the faq and codex have the SIA...the people that want to parse words with the Twin Bolt rifle on outriders aint winning that argument over here. Twin means 2 and just because it has its profile to represent it...every other twin, tri, quad, etc weapon also does it and they all have the same rules, range, same ap and same damage..only the shots are added together...
It may not be allowed at large GT events but the smaller stuff and casual or league...let it go.

I wouldn't even want to play against you and not let you use it. I'd feel like a jerk if I won a close fight because you either didn't use units or abilities that are a few weeks behind

Edited October 2, 2020 by Mobius0288
Refrain from profanity, derogatory terms or circumventing the profanity filter system

[angrom]

Seriously if all what we get is the obnoxiously :cussty chapter rule (xeno hunter), and access to limited range of models at the cost of our signature rule special ammunition, I swear I will loose my temper.

[TrawlingCleaner]

They said in the reveal stream that all unreleased supplements would essentially get an index set of rules to tide you over until your supplement comes out. SIA wouldn't be in the base marine book because ONLY Deathwatch get it, same as Helfrost cannons, Furioso Frag Cannons and Rift cannons not being in the main Codex. Although Sternguard vets technically get SIA, its baked into the profile and is not a choice of round like DW get

[angrom]

But if true why removing bikes from usable units for deathwatch? I mean even casius team has a bike in it.

[TrawlingCleaner]

I honestly have no idea, this is either:

A mistake on the leaker's behalf

A mistake on GW's behalf

DW bikers will become their own datasheet like Veterans are

 

I think the first two are most likely, DW getting their own bike datasheet doesn't make a lot of sense IMO

[Raychu]

I wouldn't worry about SIA and bikes. we'll get them with the supplement.

 

However, I have read somewhere that the Deathwatch mecanics with the kill teams might change, and we could possibly loose our mixed kill teams.

This worries me a lot more.

 

I guess however that we'll get our supplement in the first wave so end of October or beginning November.

[Halandaar]

I get why SIA isn't in the core book as it's a chunky rule, unlike the two-liner Chapter Tactics, but there's absolutely no way it won't be in the supplement, as mentioned already it is a defining feature of the Deathwatch. 

 

I can't really understand why they'd just remove Bike Squads so I'm choosing to believe it's either a mistake, or it's so they can have their own specific datasheet in the DW supplement to open up a bunch more weapon options to them (i.e. you might be allowed to mix in Ravenwing guys in the squad with their Twin Plasma or Corvus Hammers, which would be really cool). 

 

Anyway, we know the Deathwatch supplement is one of the next four books, all of which will be out before the end of the year, and considering GW don't release anything substantial in the last couple weeks of December then, absolute worst case scenario, it's 10 weeks after the release of the Codex. Is it really that long to wait in the grand scheme of things? 

[Inquisitor Trinity]

Our deathwatch bikers currently get an extra attack  and a point of leadership over the regular bikers due to being veterans. So they presumably will give us a datasheet in the supplement for them. Plus i think we get different options to regular bikers. I think they'll do the same thing for terminators maybe because they get to choose anything rather than being restricted like regular terminators.

Edited October 1, 2020 by Of the night

[Boyadventurer]

Our deathwatch bikers currently get an extra attack  and a point of leadership over the regular bikers due to being veterans. So they presumably will give us a datasheet in the supplement for them. Plus i think we get different options to regular bikers. I think they'll do the same thing for terminators maybe because they get to choose anything rather than being restricted like regular terminators.

I'm 99% certain ^ this is the case. It's a different statline, even though the share the same name. It would be kind of weird to give us an inferior biker unit for a month or two and then go back to the regular one. Well, it's weird to just take it away too.

 

Honestly, I'm not convinced that its worthwhile lumping DW in with the main codex. Hopefully DW and SW are released hot on the heels of the codex. BA at least is mostly codex + extras, so they can get by a lot easier. No Kill Teams, no ammo, assuming no Vets as troops, it seems like its forcing a big playstyle shift on us for a couple months for no real reason.

 

We've been holding off our Crusade campaign specifically for the SM Codex to drop because of all this uncertainty with DW and we didn't want my list to be invalidated for a couple of months. I really would have appreciated a WHC article with just a bit of an explanation of how this whole thing works now.

[Black Knight]

I think a few of you didn't get what I meant, I wasn't saying we were loosing SIA or Bikes I just wanted to say we are loosing them for a few months from the codex release until our supplement is released.

[Cleon]

My hope is the Deathwatch in the 'main' Codex is primarily there to represent the Primaris chapters seconded wholesale to the DeathWatch and to be honest I wouldn't be too upset with them not getting special Issue Ammo when operating as standard Primaris squads, but being issued it only when they have earned Veteran status and are formed into Kill Teams. Suddenly being able to produce enough SIA for multiple extra chapters worth of Marines feels a bit odd. 

[Qui-Gon]

Hooray! a list of "rumors" about an army literally dropping within a week, with no proof or photos, no news about the supplements, seemingly couched to deliberately cause problems for various communities. Whatever would we do without it? /s

Burn it to the ground, toss it in the dumpster, and leave it there. Rumors are rumors. Proof. The new codex. The new supplement. Until both books are in hand crying "the sky is falling" is premature and sensationalizing. Wait for the books. Do not let rumors spread.

 

Let us not repeat the events around WD 452.

[Debauchery101]

Man what i did hear from the lips of a gossip princess aka famous fisting youtuber aka scared to battle winters aka chapter serf Valtrex....that Thunder Hammers are going to ap-2...that seems crazy and I aint gonna lie if that happens ima be hella salty that I painted 4+ characters and sgts in each of salamanders, raptors, space wolves and deathwatch all rocking hammers also its supposed to be flat 20 points for sgts and characters

 

Edit: if you see this Val I still think your fortifications are cool- Peturabo

Edited October 2, 2020 by Debauchery101

[Mobius0288]

Kinda odd Hammers would change to AP-2 and still be 20 pts. For characters, mayyyyyybe??? The blade guard Vets' master crafted power swords are sitting at S5 AP-3 D2, and the whole model is sitting at 35 pts per. Maybe 10 for the sword, 5 for the shield and 20 for the model. Regular power swords moving to D1 instead of D2, but still S5.

 

Man that would put an intercessor Sgt at 40 pts. You'd probably see a lot more powerfists if this ended up being true. It seems really out of balance.

[Mobius0288]

They said in the reveal stream that all unreleased supplements would essentially get an index set of rules to tide you over until your supplement comes out. SIA wouldn't be in the base marine book because ONLY Deathwatch get it, same as Helfrost cannons, Furioso Frag Cannons and Rift cannons not being in the main Codex. Although Sternguard vets technically get SIA, its baked into the profile and is not a choice of round like DW get

I'm not entirely sure they would completely exclude our SIA rule just because we moved to an adeptus astartes codex... that book is massive. SIA is just a paragraph and a table at the bottom of a page in our codex, and every data sheet that can use it printed on them (all of three words). It's possible to retain it as a unique rule in our section, just like we get the Xenos Hunters rule.

 

It doesn't make a lot of sense to me to have to make all of these datasheets (some of which are named uniquely for deathwatch... Watch Captain, etc.), and then reprint all of those datasheets just to add Special Issue Ammunition. What's the point of the first book? Sure there can be more fluff, rules and new datasheets in the supplement.... and I'm hoping there is.

There's probably some rebranding and business decisions I'm probably not seeing.

 

Edit: Just saw a leak first hand, hammers are AP -2.

Edited October 2, 2020 by Mobius0288