Hammerfall Bunker for DA

[solarisqc]

Do you think the Hammerfall Bunker will be a good addition to DA?

 

At 175 point, it's a vehicule/Building that can easily be neutralise if engage in melee. But with a troop babysiting them on home objective, it can become a realy good firebase and area denial for DS enemy unit. 2-3 of them can be realy disturbing for ennemy unit that will receive crossfire from them and it can become a real pain for the ennemy character with the new character targeting rules. 

 

With the DA chapter tactic it will hit on 3+ if undamaged. Can't realy be ignore and everything targeting them is something that is not targeting your more important unit like Blacknight and Deathwing unit.

[aura_enchanted]

mm no, for the points you could have 2 stalkers flakk trucks and get twice the firepower Edited October 4, 2020 by Brother Tyler
Text style formatting such as "u" for "you" is not allowed at the B&C.

[solarisqc]

mm no, for the points u could have 2 stalkers flakk trucks and get twice the firepower

2 stalker will give 12 S7 ap-1 D2 attack,

 

the hammerfall Heavy bolter array can have less firepower vs 1-3 unit but can become alot better vs 5+ unit. When you take the missile array, the firepower of the hammerfall is alot better than 2 stalker if you can target 4 unit.

 

In a vaccum, the Hammerfall may even destroy the 2 stalker if your lucky with the super krak missile damage roll.

 

Both are usefull but i will not say 2 stalker is an auto-take vs the Hammerfall for damage output.

[ValourousHeart]

Given what GW did with the Repulsor and Impulsor, what do you think the chances are that GW or FW make other variants based on this chassis?

 

This model feels like it might be a little bit of fan service to the players who got started in 40k because of the video games.

 

Part of me is hoping that there is a way to bring this in from reserves.  Yes it probably won't work in game the way I'm imagining it, like the deep striking blood angels land raiders from several editions back.  But I like the thought of instead of a Captain calling in an orbital bombardment, he calls in a supply drop and this thing comes down.

[UtariOnzo]

While the bunker seems great on paper, it’s a static whirlwind with effectively an area of effect defensive attack that commands a hefty points tax. 9th with the encouragement of terrain makes a purely defensive unit like this less effective given it sits in our deployment area and stays there.

 

Looks great, but doesn’t work unless you’re going for strong backline in a less objective focused game (narrative games). There are other similar, better options for what it does that can importantly move as they need to

Edited October 4, 2020 by UtariOnzo

[Guest MistaGav]

The main problem I see with the bunker is that the missile launcher doesn't have an indirect fire mode so you need LOS to shoot at stuff. Feels like it could restrict it somewhat.

[aura_enchanted]

I think if I wanted a fortification ye olde chest high wall is cheaper by far, and the fortress of redemption :cusss all over it for table control thats to hellstorm missiles option

[WrathOfTheLion]

I don't think the hammerfall bunker is all that useful for any chapter.

[Gederas]

I don't think the hammerfall bunker is all that useful for any chapter.

It's more useful for Dark Angels than others for one reason:

 

It gets Chapter Tactics.

 

Dark Angels get +1 to hit if they remain stationary from their Chapter Tactic

 

Since the Hammerfall Bunker is immobile, meaning it can't ever move, it means ones in Dark Angels would be hitting at 3+/4+/5+ with it's degrading statline

[WrathOfTheLion]

 

I don't think the hammerfall bunker is all that useful for any chapter.

It's more useful for Dark Angels than others for one reason:

 

It gets Chapter Tactics.

 

Dark Angels get +1 to hit if they remain stationary from their Chapter Tactic

 

Since the Hammerfall Bunker is immobile, meaning it can't ever move, it means ones in Dark Angels would be hitting at 3+/4+/5+ with it's degrading statline

 

Definitely is more useful for DA because it naturally will always get the chapter tactic bonus, but that it basically sits in the back and is immobile makes it fairly situational in general I think. Even with being more useful, I still don't think it's overly useful.

[Gederas]

I don't think the hammerfall bunker is all that useful for any chapter.

It's more useful for Dark Angels than others for one reason:

 

It gets Chapter Tactics.

 

Dark Angels get +1 to hit if they remain stationary from their Chapter Tactic

 

Since the Hammerfall Bunker is immobile, meaning it can't ever move, it means ones in Dark Angels would be hitting at 3+/4+/5+ with it's degrading statline

Definitely is more useful for DA because it naturally will always get the chapter tactic bonus, but that it basically sits in the back and is immobile makes it fairly situational in general I think. Even with being more useful, I still don't think it's overly useful.

It's one of those niche units that can go either way.

 

We can have it rolled back to Devastator Doctrine turns 2/3 now with Azrael/Lazarus with the change to Brilliant Strategist.

 

The Goonhammer review mentioned it: Rather than being a 5+ CP regen, it now allows any unit (not just Core!) within 6” of your Warlord to roll back one doctrine step, either from Tactical to Devastator or from Assault to Tactical.

 

Hmmm....

[WrathOfTheLion]

That's a lot of points sunk in with your warlord babysitting it. You'll want to keep its points down so that the opponent has to reluctantly handle it. Azrael or Lazarus will almost double its points, add on some infantry sitting in your deployment zone to screen your Warlord, making it just a juicy target to knock out 500+ points worth of your army that you've allocated to sitting in the back buffing terrain instead of scoring.

 

Since it requires LoS as well for the missile launcher, in many cases the terrain sitting in the deployment zone could just be completely ignored by the opponent.

 

I do like the model though, but it is quite niche in general I think. With a better, more worn paintjob that makes it look like it actually dropped from orbit instead of floated like a Starcraft building, it'll look much better I think.

 

Note as well - Brilliant Strategist requires you to be within 6" to change the doctrine, so you have to be within explosion range.

Edited October 4, 2020 by WrathOfTheLion

[solarisqc]

3 of them in the center of your deploiment zone will cover the entire board.At 175 point each they are not cheap, but for 525 point you have the potencial to shoot 3 heavy bolter shot at every ennemy unit in sight. With T8 they are not easy to kill. You can even give them a 5++ save with a babysiting librarian using psychic fortress for them and a troop choice siting un a back field objective. (Psychic fortress is a new power with a warp charge of 6 that give a 6'' aura of 5++ on all chapter unit)

 

Alone they are not that great, but they don't take usefull slot (fortification, but you can have 3 for free).

 

All weapon that target them are not targeting your other unit and if the ennemy ignore them, it will become a realy good offensive unit chipping all the ennemy unit in sight  all arround the board. For DA the 2 super krak shot hitting on 3+ with S10 and d6 damage is also a good extra firepower to damage ennemy vehicule.

 

The deployment will be realy important for them, place the bunker where he can target at least 3 objective and they will become a real threat for cheep troop trying to capture objective.

[WrathOfTheLion]

I think spamming them is definitely more useful than sitting the warlord with them.

 

For Azrael for instance, you essentially are doubling the points cost to buff one slightly, whereas I think just having two would be a better investment if you're going to be spending those kind of points on it.

 

I definitely would have liked if they could deep strike in some manner, but maybe that would have been too good.

Edited October 4, 2020 by WrathOfTheLion

[Berzul]

For someone who LOVES using fortifications, I am tempted to getting three of these.

 

I am planning my Primaris Only Company, once our supplement arrives. This unit could be a good replacement for the Firstborn Whirlwind.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Berzul

[Angel of Solitude]

For someone who LOVES using fortifications, I am tempted to getting three of these.

 

I am planning my Primaris Only Company, once our supplement arrives. This unit could be a good replacement for the Firstborn Whirlwind.

You say that, but you should first consider the Suppression Fire stratagem. For 1 CP, if a Whirlwind hits a target, then until the start of your next turn, that model cannot fire Overwatch or Set to Defend and cannot be selected to fight until all eligible units from your army have done so. Not moving means that you're hitting on a 2+ with an indirect range of 72", so you're virtually guaranteed to get this off. If your Deathwing needs to charge a high-Overwatch threat unit, or a unit in terrain, then this will be a nice option to have.

[Berzul]

 

 

For someone who LOVES using fortifications, I am tempted to getting three of these.

 

I am planning my Primaris Only Company, once our supplement arrives. This unit could be a good replacement for the Firstborn Whirlwind.

You say that, but you should first consider the Suppression Fire stratagem. For 1 CP, if a Whirlwind hits a target, then until the start of your next turn, that model cannot fire Overwatch or Set to Defend and cannot be selected to fight until all eligible units from your army have done so. Not moving means that you're hitting on a 2+ with an indirect range of 72", so you're virtually guaranteed to get this off. If your Deathwing needs to charge a high-Overwatch threat unit, or a unit in terrain, then this will be a nice option to have.

Which is something I'll definitely do with my Firstborn company.

 

For my Primaris company, I want something with a LOT of fire bases. I'm thinking turrets, bunkers, and tanks.

Edited October 4, 2020 by Berzul

[Angel of Solitude]

Ah, fair enough - I hadn't clocked that it was for a planned Primaris company!

 

I think the Hammerfall Bunker is going to be a very interesting unit. It may either work extremely effectively as a backfield area-denial unit and thus be a bargain at 175 points, or it's something that experience players will be able to move around (due to terrain) and quickly take out with an appropriate unit.

[Berzul]

Terrain is a concern. In smaller games I do not think you'd be able to use them much, because of this.

[Malakithe]

As cool as it could be its just not worth it compared to other stuff that can do what it does

[Chaplain Lucifer]

Bunkers are to hide not to fight. For that reason along they get no love from me. ;)

[Gederas]

Bunkers are to hide not to fight. For that reason along they get no love from me.

Bunkers are to add fortified areas to a gunline. ;)

 

[G8Keeper]

It's a rule of cool one for me. I'll grab one or two to make my army pics pop when I eventually get around to doing them properly. That's the plan anyway.

[Malakithe]

Im in the camp that one is a waste while 3 creates a must-deal-with distraction carnifex. Getting the +1 to hit gives them more offense then any other chapter. The issue with 3 is with tables being smaller and terrain all over the place you might not even get to place all 3 down within your small deployment zone and they cant otherwise be ported in. 

 

But they look cool so theres that

[ValourousHeart]

According to Tactical Tortoise the Hammerfall Bunker doesn't get chapter tactics.  BRB 246 box at the bottom, Detachment Abilities lists several detachments that never gain detachment abilities even if every unit in that detachment is from the faction specified.  Fortification network is one of them.

 

The hammerfall bunker still gets our combat doctrine.