Scars and ATV's

[Prot]

So just an experimental question here:

 

I have 2 ATV's that I just finished putting together. Can you convince me they should be used with White Scars over my Ultramarines, without using the 'well they're bikes' line of reasoning?

 

The models are growing on me but the points are efficient. I could see them in really nearly any army. Is there a true table top synergy here to use them with WS?

 

(P.S. I also have a Primaris Chaplain on bike, and he is feeling much more suitable to WS than UM's.)

[TrawlingCleaner]

For the points they do pretty much everything with scars, 85 points for a whole lot of shots that when it gets to the Assault doctrine can also go toe to toe with marines and be pretty spooky. 4 attacks at -1AP and 2dmg is nothing to sniff at. Not to mention they're 8 wounds at T5 so they can just sit on objectives and keep troops units at bay

[Prot]

For the points they do pretty much everything with scars, 85 points for a whole lot of shots that when it gets to the Assault doctrine can also go toe to toe with marines and be pretty spooky. 4 attacks at -1AP and 2dmg is nothing to sniff at. Not to mention they're 8 wounds at T5 so they can just sit on objectives and keep troops units at bay

 

Yes, I guess they would be a good assault option with WS. (I was planning on 'nesting' them with Outriders).

 

The thing is I was planning on going dual Multi Melta in a squad of 2. You have me questioning that, but I do like the fact I think it's... 80 points for the Onslaught, but such a minor point upgrade for the MM.  

 

With Ultra's they have the option of retreating and still shooting at decent efficiency. However as you say with the White Scars they are not actually that bad in assault, especially in T3. I do like they have the "Bike" keyword so would do well with some of the key word based Strats. I believe Born in the saddle got turned down a but, but still confers a -1 to hit on the squad. (That isn't a White Scars strat), but I can't remember the White scars biker strat off the top of my head. 

[TrawlingCleaner]

They use both guns very well to be honest, they can so easily get in range turn one with a multimelta (maybe not within half range) or just clear infantry with the Onslaught. I'd say with a 5 point difference it's really down to what your list is lacking which is usually AT with scars

 

I'd honestly just magnetise and see what works for you on the gun front, I saw a post somewhere that made it look very simple

[Prot]

Do you have a link to the magnetization? After putting it together, to be honest the weapon mount just kind of 'plugs' into the harness. It does press fit in fairly well.

[Riddlesworth]

I think there's 2 chapters where they are exceptional. For everyone else they're only(!) Very very good. I would only ever run them with the multi melta because anti tank is at such a premium in primaris lists

 

The first is Salamanders, because +1 to wound on said melta is awesome. Fairly self explanatory.

 

Second is Ultramarines. These guys are chunky. With 8 wounds apiece they can take a hit from anyone who can catch them and they can tag shooting units in the backfield to shut them down while being able to retreat and shoot.

 

I don't think white scars give them that much. With outriders being only 3 per unit, regular bikers getting better and inceptors being a very versatile unit these days for secondaries or quality fire, if you can get the melta elsewhere with scars, im not sure ATVs are a fit beyond theme

 

The scars biker strat is also -1 to hit I believe

Edited October 13, 2020 by Riddlesworth

[Karhedron]

Being able to withdraw and still fire is pretty valuable, particularly on a powerful, short-ranged gun. That is why UMs get my vote.

[Prot]

Being able to withdraw and still fire is pretty valuable, particularly on a powerful, short-ranged gun. That is why UMs get my vote.

 

Oh you bugger. You had to do this JUST as I was going to prime these models! lol

 

Okay, I'll reconsider.

[Prot]

So taking some new info into consideration from the Ultra thead:

 

 

ATV's lack the Core keyword.

 

 

Checking in with Outriders, they DO have the core keyword. Really strange. I'm not sure this is intended, but it's RAW.

 

I think this swings things toward the White Scars since they will get more out of the assault portion from the ATV, and not lose as much by being in assault with it. 

 

I think this makes the Eradicators that much better for this (Anti-Tank) purpose, even by putting them in reserves. The dakka variant is heavy 8 so that is something the ATV will be good with for removing masses in front of fast assault units (Outriders/etc). Again, perhaps better suited to White Scars.

 

Plus it is more likely the Scars will have a mass of speedy units with them, including the (currently) superior First Born Bikers/Attack Bike (definitely with MM).