FAQ Thread: Deathwatch Codex Supplement 9th Ed: Email Qs!

[Qui-Gon]

Alrighty folks,

 

Games Workshop has come a long way in terms of creating quality of life improvements to the codexes and game, but they still have not figured out how to proofread.

 

With the advent of a new Codex Supplement dropping on us, and having slightly earlier access to the book and rules (thanks to some special enterprising individuals), it is time to gather together the questions that we should send to GW as a community so that they can review and correct their mistakes or confirm their intent.

 

So, some guidelines:

Be specific.

Reference page numbers wherever you can.

 

Questions:

 

1. In Index Astartes: Deathwatch (page 12) and Power Rating Update 2020 (page 19) documents, the Corvus Blackstar was PL 10. On page 60 of Codex Supplement: Deathwatch, it lists the PL of the Corvus as being 15. Is this PL increase intended or a mistake?

 

2. In Index Astartes: Deathwatch (page 9), Kill Team Cassius was PL 13. On page 57 of Codex Supplement: Deathwatch, it lists the PL of Kill Team Cassius as being 3. Is this PL decrease intended or a mistake?

 

3. On Page 53 of Codex Supplement: Deathwatch, under the Indomitor Kill Team construction it lists in the first rules section "An FORTIS KILL TEAM  contains..." Is this not meant to read "An INDOMITOR KILL TEAM contains..."?

 

4. There seems to be an inconsistency in how the PL of the Kill Teams are created on pages 52 and 53. Proteus is 7, but the base unit of Veterans in the datasheet is 9, so 2 less. Fortis is 6, but the base unit of Intercessors is 5, so one more. Indomitor is 9, but the base unit of Heavy Intercessors is 7, so 2 more. Spectrus is 8, but the base unit of Infiltrators is 6, so 2 more. Why are the Power Levels for the Kill Teams all over the place regarding their starting PL, where some units have less PL than their default unit?

 

5. How do Kill Team Specialisms work if the Kill Team uses the Combat Squads ability? Do both units still benefit from the Kill Team Specialism? Furthermore, if an Aquila Kill Team, which uses the Combat Squads ability during deployment, has both of its "child" units retain the Kill Team Specialism, would each unit then be free to select a different Battlefield Role after the choice of Battlefield Role for Xenos Hunters (see Codex Space Marines)?

 

6. If I have an Indomitor Kill Team unit with Eradicators, must the entire unit target the same enemy for the eradicators to benefit from total obliteration, or can only the eradicators target the one unit and benefit from total obliteration?

 

7. Why does the Veteran Biker in Kill Team Cassius (page 57) have deathwatch twin boltguns and normal Veteran Bikers (page 59) do not have deathwatch twin boltguns?

 

8. Why does the Teleport Homer rule for Kill Team Cassius (page 57) require a Terminator (keyword) model to be able to use it? Kill Team Cassius does not contain any Terminator models to use this ability until the last model left in the unit is the Terminator (by the wording of the Mixed Units rule). Conversely, Deathwatch Terminators (page 58) does not have this restriction, meaning a Proteus team that includes any Deathwatch Terminators can use the Teleport Homer rule, but Kill Team Cassius cannot. Is this intended?

 

9. Can a Blackshield replace a Veteran in a Proteus Kill Team in the same way that he can replace a Veteran in a Veteran squad?

 

10. On page 53, Indomitor Kill Team, the options allow any Heavy Intercessor to replace their heavy bolt rifle with a heavy stalker/auto bolt rifle. However, neither are an option on the datasheet, instead they have Executor and Hellstorm bolt rifles.

 

11. What is the correct cost for a Veteran with default equipment (boltgun and power sword), is it 20 or 23?

 

12. On page 195 of Codex Space Marines, it does not list the "vigil spear" as a bolt weapon, but lists the Guardian spear as a bolt weapon. Is this meant to say "vigil spear"?

 

13. On page 195 of Codex Space Marines, it does not list Hellfire Extremis as a flame weapon. Is Artemis' Hellfire Extremis a flame weapon?

 

14. On page 40 of the Deathwatch Codex Supplement, it states that a Librarian can choose for all their powers to come from Xenopurge or Librarius/Obscuration. The Tome of Malcador Chapter Relic allows a Librarian to know one additional psychic power from any discipline they have access to. So, can a Deathwatch Librarian with the Tome of Malcador Chapter relic select all their spells from either the Xenopurge or Librarius/Obscuration Discipline and one spell from the other, or vise versa?

 

15. Similarly to question 14, on page 321 of the Core Rulebook, for the Crusade Battle Honor Psychic Fortress "Master of Lore", which states "add 1 to the number of powers this unit knows from one of the discplines available to them." Can this be used to select all their spells from either the Xenopurge or Librarius/Obscuration Discipline and one spell from the other, or vise versa?

 

16. Is Combat Squads performed before or after the selection of units for using Strategic Reserves, Transports, and other means of deployment? 

Answer is likely Combat Squads must be done before anything, because how else can a Proteus unit split and then allow a group of 5 Terminators/Vanguard Veterans to use Teleport Strike/Death from the Skies? Combat Squads must be done at the start of the reserves and transports declaration. Be aware!

 

17. The AP value of Duty's Revelation is different between the datasheet (p. 55) and the summary profiles (p. 63). Is Codicier Natorian's datasheet correct (AP -4) or is the summary page (AP -3)?

 

18. How does Special-Issue Loadout (p.35) interact with Metal Storm rounds (p.48)? 

 

19. When using the Banebolt of Eryxia, if the weapon firing it has the Special Issue Ammunition rule, can you also use Special Issue Ammunition to modify the characteristics of that attack?

 

20. How many models does a CENTURION model count as when being transported by a Corvus Blackstar?

 

Personal Vanity Question: Will the Apocalypse and Kill Team Datasheets for Deathwatch be updated to reflect the new units, statlines, etc. along with the inclusion with Space Marines?

Edited November 12, 2020 by Qui-Gon

[Boyadventurer]

I'd add about whether a Black Shield can be taken in a Proteus Kill Team or not. But I think it needs to be asked in a specific way. Something like "Does a Black Shield take the place of a Deathwatch Veteran in a Proteus Kill Team in the same manner as in a Deathwatch Veteran Squad?". This way it sort of implies like it *does* already work that way and just needs more clarification, rather than offering them the possibility of saying no, it can't be included.

[Debauchery101]

I didn't see or hear anything about the black shield being able to be taken in a kill team with the full rules release but I don't ever remember the Blackshield ever being a replacement or upgrade for a veteran.

 

Does DW get the command squad and company veterans options? Also what's the venerable dread limits and options. Wierdly they updated the Bsttlescribe and it shows frost axe and Storm shield option in the ven dread options

Edited November 2, 2020 by Debauchery101

[Qui-Gon]

I didn't see or hear anything about the black shield being able to be taken in a kill team with the full rules release but I don't ever remember the Blackshield ever being a replacement or upgrade for a veteran.

 

Does DW get the command squad and company veterans options? Also what's the venerable dread limits and options. Wierdly they updated the Bsttlescribe and it shows frost axe and Storm shield option in the ven dread options

 

That's why we are asking after the black shield, just to be sure.

 

Check pages 124 and 161 of the space marine codex for your answers

[Lemondish]

I didn't see or hear anything about the black shield being able to be taken in a kill team with the full rules release but I don't ever remember the Blackshield ever being a replacement or upgrade for a veteran.

In 8th edition, the datasheet explicitly outlines this:

 

"A Black Shield can take the place of one Veteran."

 

In 9th edition, no such clarity is found. It simply says 0-1 on the data sheet, the maximum number of models being 10, and the minimum number of models being 1 Watch Sergeant and 4 Veterans.

 

This is a subtle difference in that a Black Shield cannot be added to either a 5 man Veteran unit or a Proteus Kill Team.

[Trokair]

Can a Fortis Kill team of 5 Intercessors and 5 Outriders (or a Spectrus  team consisting of 5 Infiltrators and 5 Eliminators) combat squad? The Intersessors/Infultrators have Combat Squad but the Outriders/Eliminators have not. Or in other words do all models in a unit need to have Combat Squad for a unit to Combat squad.

 

 

Do all models in a unit need to have Concealed Positions in order for the unit to use the ability during deployment. Example: A Spectrus team containing Reivers. The Reivers do not have Concealed Positions but all other choice in the unit do.

 

Edit: I missed part of Concealed Position wording, so my question on that is irrelevant.  

Edited November 4, 2020 by Trokair

[Qui-Gon]

The answers to the Combat Squads and the Concealed Positions question are on page 125 of the Space Marine Codex.

[Trokair]

Could you clarify, as all I can spot is a description of the two abilities (and other deployment abilities) and what they do. Nowhere in those two does it state that every model in the unit needs to have the ability, unlike Teleport Strike, Outflank and Death From Above, which each specify that every model in the unit must have the ability. Nor does it state that if the nit has at least one model with this ability it can use it. It just states that a unit can use it if it has it. But does it have the rule if not all models in the unit have it?

 

As Deathwatch are one of the few/only army that can have a mix of units with any of these abilities (or mix of models with one of them and models without them). It feels prudent to have it clarified.

 

I assume that because the other abilities do specify that every model in the unit needs to have it to use it and these two do no not that a unit containing a mix of models that models that have it and models that don’t the unit can still use the ability. However relying on proving a negative by comparison to another rule is not particular conclusive to me, nor am I clear on the function of RAW and RAI interpretations here. Hence asking for clarification. 

[Qui-Gon]

Concealed Positions: "During deployment, when you set up this unit, if every model in the unit has this ability..."

Combat Squads doesn't specify because it doesn't care about if every model has it, simply if one has it and the squad is at full size.

Concealed positions does specify all models must have it, and so triggers the Kill Team construction requirements that everyone must have it or no one can use it.

[Trokair]

Ok, my bad on concealed positions, I missed that, I guess because it change the order of the sentence template compared to the other three. Answer clear as day now. My apologies, it is obviously been a too long a day for me.

[Qui-Gon]

We all have days like that!

[bortbortbort]

Can we take a company champion without using a force org slot if we take a DW veterans unit (instead of a company veterans unit as per champion datasheet)?

[bortbortbort]

If I combat squad a unit, is it 1 or 2 cp to teleportarium both halves? (I'm fairly certain it's 2, unfortunately)

[leth]

It is one because of order of operations. Teleportation is declared before the combat squad step. So you put them in teleportation for one CP and then combat squad them during the deploy step. 

[bortbortbort]

Teleportarium strat says "during deployment", combat squad rule says "at the start of deployment".

 

So this would mean they are already 2 separate squads when I use the strat.

 

You are right however that the "declare reserves" step is before deployment.

 

Long story short: it feel it needs an FAQ...

[Qui-Gon]

It is one because of order of operations. Teleportation is declared before the combat squad step. So you put them in teleportation for one CP and then combat squad them during the deploy step. 

 

 

Teleportarium strat says "during deployment", combat squad rule says "at the start of deployment".

 

So this would mean they are already 2 separate squads when I use the strat.

 

You are right however that the "declare reserves" step is before deployment.

 

Long story short: it feel it needs an FAQ...

 

Gentlemen, I already had that as a question, and I have found the correct sequence. You must combat squad before anything, because if you don't, then a squad that could "teleport strike" such as a combat squaded Proteus team for terminators, can't now use teleport strike because you've passed that spot.

 

What GW should do is correct the timing.

[Qui-Gon]

I'm issuing a last call for questions.

I've collated 20 questions that are 40k relevant for Deathwatch. There is a cheeky Apoc/Kill Team question included as well because reasons.

 

If everyone in the community can email these questions to:

 

40kfaq@gwplc.com

 

Within a week or so we should have our clarifications and corrections.

 

Again, please email it. They won't address these issues unless there is widespread cries for clarification or calls to attention.

[Debauchery101]

I'm issuing a last call for questions.

 

I've collated 20 questions that are 40k relevant for Deathwatch. There is a cheeky Apoc/Kill Team question included as well because reasons.

 

If everyone in the community can email these questions to:

 

40kfaq@gwplc.com

 

Within a week or so we should have our clarifications and corrections.

 

Again, please email it. They won't address these issues unless there is widespread cries for clarification or calls to attention.

are you sending these questions to GW?

Oh I see now...that is a GW contact. Can you send me the collated questions?

[Qui-Gon]

First post of this thread has all the questions edited into it.

[GrinNfool]

Would tack on there,  "Can the infernus heavy bolter be used with the hellfire shells strategem?"

Otherwise reasonable selection of questions that GW likely answers 1-3 and ignores everything else lol.

[Qui-Gon]

If they dont answer all of them, well we'll need to sort through them ourselves. But otherwise, a number of these are corrections and clarifications. They deserve asking.

[Debauchery101]

I sent an email from every email I have which is 8. Edited November 12, 2020 by Debauchery101

[Daynga-Zone]

A bit late to the party as y’all had already caught most of the issues that I’d seen, but one discrepancy I noticed was the difference in price of assault cannons DW terminators vs space marine terminators. We pay 15 compared to the 10 in the codex for the same upgrade over a storm bolter. That’s a pretty hefty difference and based on other wargear cost errors, such as stalkers being 3 points instead of 5 and frag cannons being 10 instead of 15 in non English codexes makes me think it’s a mistake. I assume plasma cannons are also supposed to be 10 since they rate about the same as an assault cannon IMO.

 

Edit: Also, after a conversation on reddit it looks like the shroud field stratagem allows you to shield as many Corvus as you want turn 1 since it’s used states “at the beginning of the battle round” and is therefore out of phase. That seems unintentional to me, but there’s really no way of telling.

Edited November 24, 2020 by Daynga-Zone

[Lemondish]

Another we should have asked is clarification on the Crux Terminatus rule when you add a Deathwatch Terminator to a Proteus Kill Team. Right now, a single Deathwatch Terminator in that KT would confer a 5+ invulnerable save to everyone in the unit.

[Qui-Gon]

An FYI folks, GW have stated that they've updated their policy to 4 weeks FAQ collections instead of 2 weeks.

So the FAQ drops next monday.

One more week to send in any questions or queries. So if you think of soemthing send it in! We won't get corrections or clarifications if we don't do that.