Volkite

[CCE1981]

I hear a lot of good things about Volkite for 30K

 

With a lot more access to Volkite, especially if you include the Imperial Armour Compendium, can we make heavy enough use of Volkite to make it worth it?

[SkimaskMohawk]

Volkite in 30k works completely differently and the units that can take it are largely not present in the 40k rules. The mechanic is also unique in that it generates more wounds for every failed save instead of being as generic as mortal wounds on 6s (doesn't even replicate the effect...).

 

You're missing stuff like squads armed with singles (instead of twin) of the leviathans, or the heavier versions on devestator squads. All the tanks with heavy versions of volkite weapons aren't in 40k either. Terminators can't be armed with them, or veterans or command squads, or characters, or...you get what I mean. You have the leviathan and relic contemptors I think and that's it.

[Gederas]

They also gave the Deredeo the Volkite guns it had.

 

But yeah.

[MegaVolt87]

They also gave the Deredeo the Volkite guns it had.

 

But yeah.

 

Ay, you got the termite as well that can take volkites in 40k. 

[mel_danes]

Neo Volkite pistol on the Bladeguard Lt and Srg.

[Mandragola]

Volkite is an interesting new (or old) addition to the armoury. To be honest it doesn't make a huge amount of difference because it's available from so few sources. A pistol here or there is a fun option, and a perfectly valid use of 5 spare points if you've got them, but no big deal.

 

The two versions that might be useful are the Deredeo and Relic Contemptor. They're oddly different guns. The contemptor gets 8 or even 16 shots and the Deredeo gets only 6, but at S8 and ap-2 instead of S6 and ap0 for the Contemptor. Contemptor is 150 and the Deredeo is 200, before you add extra rockets on the roof of either one. The Deredeo does have a couple of heavy bolters and it's a fair bit tougher, but it is not Core. Both will cost you a CP to field.

 

I'm not sure how I feel about the Contemptor's weapon profile. With ap0 it's going to struggle against elite infantry and tanks, but the mortal wounds really help there. It'll do way more mortals than the Deredeo. I think it could be particularly good against targets that rely on invulnerable saves rather than armour, and it's also pretty useful against big units of infantry due to the sheer number of shots. It's a weird but fun option, and seems like a decent use of 150 points and a CP to me.

 

I don't think it'd be worth running one of these with one gun and a fist, just because the standard version of the Contemptor is good enough without needing to spend a CP. It only makes sense to me to go for the relic version if you're really making the most of it, and quite likely including a Cyclone on the roof as well. Otherwise multimelta and fist is pretty great.

 

The deredeo's weapons feel more conventional. You can fire S8 Ap-2 D2 at a majority of things in the current meta and expect to be pretty happy with the result. But 6 shots makes it sort of unspectacular and the lack of rerolls makes it swingy. I'm not sure it's a unit I'd spend a CP to bring.

Edited November 17, 2020 by Mandragola

[Swordsman]

On my side I’m happy for the return of the volkite, always loved it dice HH.

 

However With my fists I think it will non see too much use, on the contemptor i fee more comfortable with two twin HB, exploding marvelous D2 damaged hits on every six.

 

With ultra things change. Two or three contemptor (I know the are a lot of C points) with double volkite are very interesting for the mortal spam (and the 48 s6 D2 shots). Especially if in the list there are also Tigurius, a librarian, and a captain with vegence for Ultramar and Paragon of war.

 

For sure it deserves some testing. My meta is full of drukari and harlequins and a good source of mortal wounds would be useful for me.

 

 

And... I hope to can field one day my LEGION GLAVIE in the 40K...

[Ishagu]

Volkite in 30k works completely differently and the units that can take it are largely not present in the 40k rules. The mechanic is also unique in that it generates more wounds for every failed save instead of being as generic as mortal wounds on 6s (doesn't even replicate the effect...).

 

You're missing stuff like squads armed with singles (instead of twin) of the leviathans, or the heavier versions on devestator squads. All the tanks with heavy versions of volkite weapons aren't in 40k either. Terminators can't be armed with them, or veterans or command squads, or characters, or...you get what I mean. You have the leviathan and relic contemptors I think and that's it.

Volkite works better in the 40k rules. The weapons have generally never been great, but work better in 8th edition at least.

[SkimaskMohawk]

 

Volkite in 30k works completely differently and the units that can take it are largely not present in the 40k rules. The mechanic is also unique in that it generates more wounds for every failed save instead of being as generic as mortal wounds on 6s (doesn't even replicate the effect...).

 

You're missing stuff like squads armed with singles (instead of twin) of the leviathans, or the heavier versions on devestator squads. All the tanks with heavy versions of volkite weapons aren't in 40k either. Terminators can't be armed with them, or veterans or command squads, or characters, or...you get what I mean. You have the leviathan and relic contemptors I think and that's it.

Volkite works better in the 40k rules. The weapons have generally never been great, but work better in 8th edition at least.

Better at what? Killing light to medium infantry? They arent. A volkite charger wounds a GEQ on 2s, ignores the save and generates another wound. An 8th version wounds that same model on 3s, doesn't ignore it's save and requires a 6 to do more.

 

If it's killing heavy vehicles they were never meant to be a threat to, then yes, 8th style volkite is "better".

 

Edit: let's do the math on the contemptor guns against t7 vehicles though.

 

One twin volkite arm gets 8 shots, 6.64 hits, 2.19 wounds (and a mortal) and 0.72 failed saves for a total of 1.72 wounds on a rhino. full guns do 2 mortal wounds and 2.89 normal ones, basically 50%. Needs two rounds of shooting.

 

One twinlinked arm does 3.88 hits and 1.3 hull points. Full guns do 2.6 hull points which is closer to one-rounding it than not.

 

Looks like the 8th style one isn't better at anything except shooting what used to be av 14.

Edited November 18, 2020 by SkimaskMohawk

[Gederas]

Once again, Ishagu posting like he's got correct facts when he's blatantly wrong... 

[Ishagu]

Wrong about what? Volkite weapons are better in 40k against a variety of targets.

 

Yes, they kill Guardsmen better in 30k. So do bolters. Granted vehicles were made of paper in 7th, where as everything is more like a Monstrous Creature in 9th.

 

Don't get tetchy because no one cares about 30k anymore lol

Edited November 18, 2020 by Ishagu

[Mandragola]

Some people do care about 30k*. No need for anyone to get tetchy.

 

I don't think it's a big deal that the rules aren't all that similar. That goes for lots of things between 7th and 9th. The MW mechanic is kind of comparable with the deflagrate rule, though obviously not identical. The result is that 40k volkite weapons are more of an all-rounder gun whereas the 30k ones are very specialised.

 

There are other places that Volkite crops up. The knight Styrix has a version that's H5, S8, Ap-3 and D6 damage, doing 2 MW on a 6. That's a weirdly different profile to the Contemptor's gun, but then I suppose it's a single really big gun instead of a pair of average-sized ones. It's actually a weapon that I expect will see some play, partly because its claw is so brutal. Maybe one day I'll even paint mine.

 

*I'm not one of them tbh, but each to their own.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

The pistol looks really cool that good enough for me.

[Gederas]

Wrong about what? Volkite weapons are better in 40k against a variety of targets.

 

Yes, they kill Guardsmen better in 30k. So do bolters. Granted vehicles were made of paper in 7th, where as everything is more like a Monstrous Creature in 9th.

 

Don't get tetchy because no one cares about 30k anymore lol

You.... Do realize Volkite weapons, unless they're the really big heavy ones, aren't supposed to deal with vehicles right? They're dedicated anti-infantry.

 

Also: Just because you don't care about 30k doesn't mean other people don't.

Edited November 19, 2020 by Brother Tyler
Personal attack removed

[CCE1981]

Guys please be civil. If you want to disagree please post your counter argument and move on. I was genuinely curios about Volkite, the larger number of units that can use them, and peoples thiughts. I don’t want to see this thread get squashed because people can’t be civil. I like discourse, but I don’t want to see insults.

[Dracos]

Gederas gets worked up if Ishagu say grass is green and the sky is blue. If that's as bad as it gets seems no one cares?

 

 

I like the look of the Volkite weapon. No clue about HH that crazy FW stuff happened during my sabbatical from the game. I just can't see spending 5 points on it (or a plama pistol) for my Bladeguard. That's 10 points I need elsewhere. Points are at such a premium for a Primaris player that almost no upgrade is worth it (looking at you Eradictors). Shave points add units is my motto.

[tychobi]

Outside of 30k and admech its just bloat