Xenos Hunters chapter tactic clarification

[Skywrath]

Alright, so after dipping my toes in black, the xenos hunters chapter tactic has me a bit confused. I was hoping people could explain this to me a bit better.

 

See in the new codex there are two versions of it - one is a regular re-roll wounds of one if the KT has a specialisation matching the troop choice it is paired against. So an example of this could be Furor against Troops. If the above is correct, then if my Outriders have the KT Furor specialisation they re-roll wounds of one against troops. Does this chapter tactic apply for troops that are not xenos? So for instance if there was a Dark Angel troop unit, I would be eligible to reroll wounds of one against it, providing I paid for the specialisation? And is this also part of the reason why taking a lieutenant in a DW army is mostly pointless?

 

The other question is related to the full re-roll wounds instead of wounds of one. What conditions need to be satisfied (in your own words), for that to be achieved? 

 

The third question is this - with assigning the (let's call it nemesis, so furor specialisation is the nemesis of troops, and dominatus specialisation is the nemesis of elites, etc) nemesis is that something that applies to the one unit, or the entire army? Meaning that only that unit re-rolls wounds of one against a specific type of unit, or the entire army re-rolls against that type of unit?

 

 

 

[Mobius0288]

So lets back up a second.

 

Our Chapter Tactic is Xenos Hunters - choose a battlefield role as your mission tactic, and reroll wound rolls of 1 against them. You also reroll hit rolls of 1 in melee against the xenos factions. Both of these apply to all units in a given detachment.

 

In the deathwatch supplement, you get access to specialisms - essentially, a single kill team gains the ability to reroll 1's against the chosen specialism's targets (furor for troops as you pointed out).

 

*Only one specialism of each type can be in an army

*Only applies to a single kill team

*Kill team can be combat squaded, giving both "units" from the same kill team the specialism... example is 5 intercessors and 5 outriders can have the furor specialism if combat squaded during deployment

 

If your mission tactics and specialism happen to align, your Furor Kill Team will specifically be able to reroll the wound roll against troop choices.

 

Say your army has (not going for meta here):

-Primaris Captain

-Redemptor Dread

-Fortis Kill Team w/ Furor specialism (5 Intercessors, 5 outriders)

-Fortis Kill Team w/ Dominatus specialism (5 intercessors, 5 hellblasters)

-Fortis Kill Team w/ Aquila specialism (10 intercessors)

 

At the beginning, you choose troop choices as your mission tactics. Detachment wide, all of the above will be able to reroll 1's to wound against troop choices. The Furor Fortis Kill Team will specifically be able to reroll "the wound roll" against troop choices, meaning any dice roll on the wound roll (pass or fail). They also reroll 1's to hit against xenos in melee.

 

The Dominatus Kill Team can still reroll 1's to wound against troop choices due to mission tactics, but they can also reroll 1's to wound against elite choices due to the Dominatus specialism.

 

The Aquila specialism is more of a "pick your own" and would allow you to pick any battlefield role in addition to your mission tactics choice, but you do not get to "reroll the wound roll" if your mission tactic and specialism are the same.

 

The Primaris Captain (reroll 1's to hit for core units due its datasheet ability) and Dreadnaught would be able to reroll 1's to wound against troop choices, and reroll 1's to hit if in melee against xenos factions.

 

 

 And is this also part of the reason why taking a lieutenant in a DW army is mostly pointless?

 

The other question is related to the full re-roll wounds instead of wounds of one. What conditions need to be satisfied (in your own words), for that to be achieved? 

 

I would say the LT isn't pointless, but you can build your army so that he isn't needed if you want other HQ options. It's pretty easy to add characters because we didn't have access to a lot of them before this edition, and the master specialties for librarians, chaplains, etc. are really good. Adding more abilities to characters for a small point increase usually benefits elite-ish armies quite a bit.

 

The primary condition to reroll wound rolls of 1's is the battlefield roll of the unit, which symbols depict on the data sheet (either top left or top right depending on which side of the page the data sheet is on). The next condition to reroll the wound roll would be whether you have a specialism on that kill team, targeting a specific battlefield roll.

 

Hope that helps.

Edited December 1, 2020 by Mobius0288

[Skywrath]

Alright, so from this, I can conclude three things (sort-of answering my own questions). Let's see how much of this I get right.

 

1. The selection of battle-field roles is army wide, not unit specific. So let's assume I chose troops, everyone in that detachment re-rolls 1s to wound against troops, whether xenos or other. 

 - Question: What about if there were two detachments in the list? Could I give one detachment the re-roll to troops, and another one re-roll to elites?

2. Let's assume I choose troops, and a unit had the furor specialisation, it re-rolls all failed wounds. Same applies to aquila, if I make it psuedo-furor as well?

3. This applies on top of the innate re-roll 1's to xenos factions in melee, (Re-roll 1's in melee). 

 

Bonus Question; Let's assume I change the chapter doctrine with the Strategem: Brotherhood of Veterans. That completely invalidates the Xenos Hunter chapter tactic this turn for that unit, doesn't it?

 

Am I right?

Edited December 1, 2020 by Skywrath

[Mobius0288]

1. Correct, assuming you are are referring to Mission Tactics defined in the Space Marine Codex.

 

2. Your furor would get the full rerolls, Aquila would only get to reroll failed wounds of 1. You can look at it as a way to give an additional "mission tactic" to a unit. It's designed to give you a flexible choice before going into a game, where the other specialism are determined when creating your army. If you make a storm bolter/storm shield Aquila team: One game you can fight tyranids and give them Troops from mission tactics, and elites. The next game you play against space marines, you can choose troops for mission tactics and fast attack for aquila specialism (maybe they have biker or outrider spam). The Furor specialism is pre-determined when building your army list, Aquila is determined at the beginning of the battle round when determining mission tactics for your detachment.

 

3. Yes, it stacks.

 

 

 - Question: What about if there were two detachments in the list? Could I give one detachment the re-roll to troops, and another one re-roll to elites?

 

Bonus Question; Let's assume I change the chapter doctrine with the Strategem: Brotherhood of Veterans. That completely invalidates the Xenos Hunter chapter tactic this turn for that unit, doesn't it?

 

Am I right?

 

It hasn't been discussed in length on the forums yet, but yes. Xenos hunters per the codex is a detachment ability. If you were to bring two different detachments (ex: 2 patrols), each detachment could have 2 different mission tactics. You could also place your specialism units in the appropriate detachment to ensure full rerolls to wound against your mission tactic battlefield role. And because your army is all Deathwatch, you maintain the "flexible combat doctrine" in the deathwatch supplement.

 

Yes the stratagem invalidates Xenos Hunter for the turn/phase (i forget which). Your Specialized Kill Team would not get to "reroll the wound roll" if you gave your furor kill team the imperial fist chapter tactic (6's score additional hits), for example.

[bortbortbort]

Does handing out rerolls of 1 via vigilance incarnate trigger full rerolls from KT specialisations? (I don't think so, but would like more opinions)

 

Edit: also I agree that chapter tactics are detachment abilities, but the xenos hunters one does specify to "select one battlefield role". I think RAW is pretty clear you only get to do this once, regardless if number of detachments (unfortunately. Would be great)

Edited December 2, 2020 by bortbortbort

[Mobius0288]

Does handing out rerolls of 1 via vigilance incarnate trigger full rerolls from KT specialisations? (I don't think so, but would like more opinions)

 

Edit: also I agree that chapter tactics are detachment abilities, but the xenos hunters one does specify to "select one battlefield role". I think RAW is pretty clear you only get to do this once, regardless if number of detachments (unfortunately. Would be great)

Vigilance Incarnate does not change the mission tactic according to it's description. Adaptive Tactics (strat) is the only one I see that affects the chapter tactic.

 

Your second point would probably be better pointed at GW for a FAQ. If it were an army wide ability, like flexible combat doctrine, where it describes your entire army specifically including adeptus astartes or deathwatch units in your army... I would agree. I agree it is one battlefield role, but I read it as only one battlefield role per detachment as it is a detachment ability.