Bladeguard vs Terminators

[Medjugorje]

what is your experience? ( I got the feeling that it depends on the opponents list but do you think its worth it to field both?)

 

Bladeguard:

 

+Transhuman

+more attacks

+cheaper

+ 6" movement

+better ap

 

Terminators:

+deepstrike

+better save with stormshield

+hammers have one damage more

+able to field 10 in one squad

[Karhedron]

Don't forget, the multi-damage Terminator weapons usually have a -1 to-Hit penalty attached. Those MC Power Swords are really quite tasty en-mass.

 

Termies can have better shooting but it depends on options.

Edited December 8, 2020 by Karhedron

[Acebaur]

Why not field both? Both have their strengths and weakeness's as you pointed out. Don't forget Terminators have Fury of the First which can negate the -1 on hammers and fists. With a Chapter ancient you can even get Termies to be hitting on a 2+! Both units are great and there is nothing wrong with running both imo.  

[Sword Brother Adelard]

My plan is certainly for both, Bladeguard are more mobile with an Impulsor, and Terminators more durable.

[Acebaur]

My plan is certainly for both, Bladeguard are more mobile with an Impulsor, and Terminators more durable.

 

Don't underestimate how fast we can move our infantry. We have a lot of tricks between all the re-rolls we get, and things like the Emperor's Will, Frontline Commander and Devout Push

[Medjugorje]

do you played them often?

[Sword Brother Adelard]

 

 

My plan is certainly for both, Bladeguard are more mobile with an Impulsor, and Terminators more durable.

Don't underestimate how fast we can move our infantry. We have a lot of tricks between all the re-rolls we get, and things like the Emperor's Will, Frontline Commander and Devout Push

I get that, which is why it's nice to have two threats. With Devout Push the BladeGuard range is great, and with Emperor's will the terminators are pretty quick too. But you can't really use both on the same unit, well you could, but it seems a waste, so may as well have two plans.

[Acebaur]

do you played them often?

 

often is a strong word :P but I've played both and both are very good IMO. I walked Terminators up the board in my last game against IG and they absorbed an enormous amount of firepower

[Medjugorje]

how are the matchups,... are one of them better against an opponent? I think against normal Marines the Terminators are better because the flat 3 damage against Aggressors, Eradicators and mostly against other Bladeguards and Terminators.

[Acebaur]

how are the matchups,... are one of them better against an opponent? I think against normal Marines the Terminators are better because the flat 3 damage against Aggressors, Eradicators and mostly against other Bladeguards and Terminators.

 

They have different targets for sure. I run my TDA with all hammers and send them after hard targets. The BGV are great against infantry though and even against tanks they aren't bad, they are S5 so you are on 5's for every vehicle which isn't great but a huge improvement over 6's 

[Medjugorje]

at the moment we dont see any vehicles. The question is how good are they against another Marines, Necrons, AdMech, Daemons and Harlekins...

 

I would say against Marines --> Terminators are better (maybe it depends which Chapter we fight against)

Necrons ---> BGV

AdMech---> ???

Harlekins --->BGV

Daemons i think Terminators but i dont know.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I use terminators a lot and I can say they are very good now.

[Medjugorje]

I use terminators a lot and I can say they are very good now.

yeah, I know... but how good are they in comparison to bladeguards?

Normally I would test my lists but because of lockdown I cannot play that much.

Edited December 8, 2020 by Medjugorje

[XeonDragon]

I think terminators are more flexible. For 215 points you can get regular ones with a cyclone missile launcher. That's 20 storm bolter shots, 2 krak missiles, 4 power or chain fists (As they are zero points, I think chain fists are almost a must-take) + a power sword. Not shabby.

 

Or you could take the 'relic' terminators and get 20 storm bolter shots, power-fists on all of them, and maybe a grenade harness for a tankier and slight less-shooty version of aggressors. 

 

These dude compare them (well, the assault terminators anyway): 

[Medjugorje]

for me there is just SS+Th an option. ^^

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I prefer Relic terminators. I like all of my units to be able to contribute in at least two phases of the game - in this particular case shooting and melee. Sure hammernators are hard core in melee but that’s it.

[Medjugorje]

no... its more important to have a 4++ instead of a 5++ and a 1+ save instead of a 2+

 

at least for me

 

 

thats why I make a comparison between BGV and our Assault Terminators

Edited December 9, 2020 by Medjugorje

[Dracos]

I'm an all Primaris player and I still think Terminators are better TAC unit. The storm bolter power fist combo is a mighty weapon and innate T2 deep strike is great asset. Bladeguard are the better melee option and like most things Primaris they are good at what they do but what they do is very defined compared to equivalent Firstborn units. 

[Acebaur]

at the moment we dont see any vehicles. The question is how good are they against another Marines, Necrons, AdMech, Daemons and Harlekins...

 

I would say against Marines --> Terminators are better (maybe it depends which Chapter we fight against)

Necrons ---> BGV

AdMech---> ???

Harlekins --->BGV

Daemons i think Terminators but i dont know.

 

I disagree that we don't see many vehicles. Guard pretty much run on TC spam, DG run a lot of Daemon engines and that will only get worse with their buffs. Necrons have have a good amount of high T 3W models to deal with, Nids have their big monsters, and Marines are seeing a lot more 3W models as well. There are plenty of big targets for TDA with hammers to take on in this edition so far

[Sword Brother Adelard]

I think terminators are more flexible. For 215 points you can get regular ones with a cyclone missile launcher. That's 20 storm bolter shots, 2 krak missiles, 4 power or chain fists (As they are zero points, I think chain fists are almost a must-take) + a power sword. Not shabby.

 

Or you could take the 'relic' terminators and get 20 storm bolter shots, power-fists on all of them, and maybe a grenade harness for a tankier and slight less-shooty version of aggressors.

 

These dude compare them (well, the assault terminators anyway):

Anyone know where that Terminator sculpt in the thumbnail is from?

[Karhedron]

Anyone know where that Terminator sculpt in the thumbnail is from?

He's just a regular dude from the BA Assault Terminator box.

 

Edited December 9, 2020 by Karhedron

[Medjugorje]

 

at the moment we dont see any vehicles. The question is how good are they against another Marines, Necrons, AdMech, Daemons and Harlekins...

 

I would say against Marines --> Terminators are better (maybe it depends which Chapter we fight against)

Necrons ---> BGV

AdMech---> ???

Harlekins --->BGV

Daemons i think Terminators but i dont know.

 

I disagree that we don't see many vehicles. Guard pretty much run on TC spam, DG run a lot of Daemon engines and that will only get worse with their buffs. Necrons have have a good amount of high T 3W models to deal with, Nids have their big monsters, and Marines are seeing a lot more 3W models as well. There are plenty of big targets for TDA with hammers to take on in this edition so far

 

I just mean Vehicles. T5 and 3wounds are not a problem for BGV. But Terminators are way better against Vehicles for example ( I mean real vehicles with T7+ and 10+ wounds).

 

btw... AstraMilitarum is an autowin for us in tournaments. I played against them and they have a lot of firepower but escpecially we as BT will find some Infantry with our own and destroying their gameplan with just one unit. If I talk about tournament lists I mean just the factions we compete in the last game for winning tournaments.

Edited December 9, 2020 by Medjugorje

[Shamansky]

 

btw... AstraMilitarum is an autowin for us in tournaments. I played against them and they have a lot of firepower but escpecially we as BT will find some Infantry with our own and destroying their gameplan with just one unit. If I talk about tournament lists I mean just the factions we compete in the last game for winning tournaments.

 

 

Ha. Astra Militarum in current state is auto win for anyone, except maybe Tau or another Guard.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

 

Anyone know where that Terminator sculpt in the thumbnail is from?

He's just a regular dude from the BA Assault Terminator box.

 

Awesome. Need to track down that Torso next.

[9x19 Parabellum]

While I think the two are comparable, BGV are more reliant on a transport than Terminators are, and for me that means that Termies would win out in the comparison.  I just don't think there are really any great transports for Primaris.  The Repulsor pays too much too do everything and doesn't know if it wants to be a main battle tank or transport, but pays for both. Same problem as Land Raiders, basically.  The Repulsor Executioner is the same problem with the slider bar set further to "tank" and less to "transport".   And then the Impulsor....the blessed Impulsor which is almost economical but not quite.  120+ points to transport 6 models...and it lost it's cool gimmicks and abilities; it can't really shoot, it's not particularly defensive, it's not particulary transporty.  At least it's not too expensive but it's more expensive than it needs to be for what I want it to do. 

 

I'd go with Terminators, of any stripe.