Pathogen on Lord of Contagion with Plaguereaper

[Iron Sage]

What I am not entirely sure about, is if the +1 STR modifier is calculated directly to the weapons STR  before STR is doubled and so becomes 10 if , or if it is added as a +1 to weapon after STR is doubled. I suspect it means he is STR 9 and that the extra STR is added after STR is doubled. This because the rules for pathogens says that +1 STR is added to the weapon. Yet this is still somewhat unclear to me since the weapon also doubles STR. It is not entirely intuitive that it is double STR to 8, then add 1 and it is not entirely clear to me. I am leaning towards the STR 9 interpretation instead of the STR 10., but it is possible I am erring on the side of caution.

 

Maybe I am missing something glaring and it is clear. Maybe you guys know ?

[Marshal Loss]

It'll be 4x2+1=9.

 

You can find this example in the core rules:

 

 

Example: A Space Marine Sergeant (Strength characteristic 4) is making an attack with a power fist (Strength characteristic x2) while under the effects of a psychic power that increases his Strength characteristic by 1. The two modifiers (x2 and +1) are cumulative and applied concurrently. The attack is therefore resolved at Strength 9 ([4x2]+1=9).

Edited January 24, 2021 by Marshal Loss

[Iron Sage]

Thanks !

[Plaguecaster]

It'll be 4x2+1=9.

 

You can find this example in the core rules:

 

 

Example: A Space Marine Sergeant (Strength characteristic 4) is making an attack with a power fist (Strength characteristic x2) while under the effects of a psychic power that increases his Strength characteristic by 1. The two modifiers (x2 and +1) are cumulative and applied concurrently. The attack is therefore resolved at Strength 9 ([4x2]+1=9).

I was pretty sure it should be str10 since it's an actual upgrade to the weapon you take before deployment and not something that changes its stats during the game

Could be wrong but that was how i interpreted it anyways

Edited January 24, 2021 by Plaguecaster

[Marshal Loss]

 

It'll be 4x2+1=9.

 

You can find this example in the core rules:

Example: A Space Marine Sergeant (Strength characteristic 4) is making an attack with a power fist (Strength characteristic x2) while under the effects of a psychic power that increases his Strength characteristic by 1. The two modifiers (x2 and +1) are cumulative and applied concurrently. The attack is therefore resolved at Strength 9 ([4x2]+1=9).

I was pretty sure it should be str10 since it's an actual upgrade to the weapon you take before deployment and not something that changes its stats during the game

Could be wrong but that was how i interpreted it anyways

 

Doesn't matter whether the modifier is on the weapon or the character:

 

 

 

Apply modifiers in the following order: division, multiplication, addition, then subtraction.

 

The x2 always comes first

[Iron Sage]

Well, at least I am glad I asked the question since it also helped others. Had completely forgotten that passage in the Core book.

[Azekai]

Well, at least I am glad I asked the question since it also helped others. Had completely forgotten that passage in the Core book.

I believe it is also opposite how it worked in 8th? Which is weird. In math you typically multiply, then add. I think 9th makes more sense and is easier to remember.

[Closet Skeleton]

 

I was pretty sure it should be str10 since it's an actual upgrade to the weapon you take before deployment and not something that changes its stats during the game

Could be wrong but that was how i interpreted it anyways

 

The weapon starts as x2, that means it doubles the user's strength. Pathogens add to the weapon's strength so it would become x2+1, its not (U+1)x2.

[TrawlingCleaner]

 

 

It'll be 4x2+1=9.

 

You can find this example in the core rules:

Example: A Space Marine Sergeant (Strength characteristic 4) is making an attack with a power fist (Strength characteristic x2) while under the effects of a psychic power that increases his Strength characteristic by 1. The two modifiers (x2 and +1) are cumulative and applied concurrently. The attack is therefore resolved at Strength 9 ([4x2]+1=9).

I was pretty sure it should be str10 since it's an actual upgrade to the weapon you take before deployment and not something that changes its stats during the game

Could be wrong but that was how i interpreted it anyways

 

Doesn't matter whether the modifier is on the weapon or the character:

 

 

 

Apply modifiers in the following order: division, multiplication, addition, then subtraction.

 

The x2 always comes first

 

While that is correct during the game, I'm not sure if it is the case for something  that is added in the list building step before the game starts. Specific wording in the codex is: "In addition to the effects listed for that Deadly Pathogen, add 1 to the Strength Characteristic" (emphasis by me).

A example would be a WLT increases a character's strength by 1 to 5 and they have a power fist. Their strength would be 10 when fighting with the fist rather than 9 because they start the game as strength 5 rather than 4+1

 

I had a quick flick through FAQs but couldn't find them clarifying it

[Marshal Loss]

While that is correct during the game, I'm not sure if it is the case for something  that is added in the list building step before the game starts. Specific wording in the codex is: "In addition to the effects listed for that Deadly Pathogen, add 1 to the Strength Characteristic" (emphasis by me).

 

 

 

Strength Characteristic of the weapon

 

Deadly Pathogens specify that you need to select a plague weapon to upgrade. It doesn't affect the model's statline.

 

Either way, it doesn't matter. The rules don't distinguish between when different modifiers are added, they only spell out how said multipliers interact:

 

 

 

Many rules modify the characteristics of models and weapons. All modifiers to a characteristic are cumulative; you must apply division modifiers before applying multiplication modifiers, and before applying addition and then subtraction modifiers. Round any fractions up after applying all modifiers. If a rule instructs you to replace one characteristic with a specified value, change the relevant characteristic to the new value before applying any modifiers that apply from other rules (if any) to the new value.

 

If a WL trait said, e.g., "change your Warlord's str characteristic from 4 to 5", then a power fist would make it S10. If the trait is just "add 1 to your Warlord's str", then a power fist would make it S9. There's no difference between a modifier added before the game and a modifier added during the game. They function the same way. No FAQ is needed.

[jgascoine011]

 

While that is correct during the game, I'm not sure if it is the case for something  that is added in the list building step before the game starts. Specific wording in the codex is: "In addition to the effects listed for that Deadly Pathogen, add 1 to the Strength Characteristic" (emphasis by me).

 

 

 

Strength Characteristic of the weapon

 

Deadly Pathogens specify that you need to select a plague weapon to upgrade. It doesn't affect the model's statline.

 

Either way, it doesn't matter. The rules don't distinguish between when different modifiers are added, they only spell out how said multipliers interact:

 

 

 

Many rules modify the characteristics of models and weapons. All modifiers to a characteristic are cumulative; you must apply division modifiers before applying multiplication modifiers, and before applying addition and then subtraction modifiers. Round any fractions up after applying all modifiers. If a rule instructs you to replace one characteristic with a specified value, change the relevant characteristic to the new value before applying any modifiers that apply from other rules (if any) to the new value.

 

If a WL trait said, e.g., "change your Warlord's str characteristic from 4 to 5", then a power fist would make it S10. If the trait is just "add 1 to your Warlord's str", then a power fist would make it S9. There's no difference between a modifier added before the game and a modifier added during the game. They function the same way. No FAQ is needed.

 

 

Did the BRB not saying something about you add in factors after the weapon.

[TrawlingCleaner]

 

Strength Characteristic of the weapon

 

Deadly Pathogens specify that you need to select a plague weapon to upgrade. It doesn't affect the model's statline.

 

Either way, it doesn't matter. The rules don't distinguish between when different modifiers are added, they only spell out how said multipliers interact:

 

 

You're totally right, my bad! Damn my 8th ed mindset! Strength 9 Scythe is still a rad scythe!

 

[jgascoine011]

 

 

 

Strength Characteristic of the weapon

Deadly Pathogens specify that you need to select a plague weapon to upgrade. It doesn't affect the model's statline.

 

Either way, it doesn't matter. The rules don't distinguish between when different modifiers are added, they only spell out how said multipliers interact:

You're totally right, my bad! Damn my 8th ed mindset! Strength 9 Scythe is still a rad scythe!

No difference between S8 and S9 unless the target is T9

[Iron Sage]

Which is, let's face it, very rare. So I suppose it is just a question if the ability is worth it or not. Maybe too expensive on a 5 attack Plaguereaper.

 

Different if you go soup I suppose.